G’day Gents!
The weekend is here – somehow with a Thursday holiday, there’s been a spate of “Saturdays” this week! <grin> Blue skies continue – temps predicted to make it into the 70s today – outside work continues as we prepare the ranch for winter. <grin> Petrol was $2.17 (rounded) up at “Collusion Corner” as we passed by yesterday. Raised about 15 cents, dropped 2 – yeah, that’s makes sense.
A bit of activity since my last narrative of yesterday, let’s get to the acknowledgments:
Rob at 11:45 ‘n 11:51 PM yesterday: Put SPAMALOT on your “must see” list – no kidding. It’s really that good. I believe the traveling cast we saw yesterday is the same as appeared in Toronto. They are that good! Almost as if one were watching and listening to John Cleese, Terry Gilliam, Eric Idle, Terry Jones and Graham Chapman. Not that this cast is imitating, for they aren’t. But the lines and the delivery is so “familiar.” <grin>
What’s this A Saturday ENCORE! on Friday!! Ah, yes – I see, it WAS Saturday where you are. Okay – you squeezed it thru. Avoided a TWEETING at that. Anything from BC has to be worth it, eh
I dropped off a couple of Pix on “my other Thread” in response to your contributions. Seems that the continuation of that Thread is nearing an end. I’ve always known it would be a hard sell to attract and find some guys for the bar – but that experiment has pretty much run the course. Perhaps I’ll keep ‘er going ‘til year’s end; we’ll see. Thanx for your support. Over time it’s been Lars ‘n BK who have provided the Lion’s share of contributions in supplement to mine. Without them, it’s most times just a one-man-band.
Eric at 1:40 AM today: Welcome aboard and happy to note that you (and your wallet) survived the so-called “Black Friday.” <grin> We’re fare beyond that craze in our Haus as neither of us want any part of enraged shoppers at some ungodly hour H-bent on some “bargain hunting.” Anyway, I’ve found that shopping the internet is so much better and easier on the psyche, if you follow my drift. <grin>
Yes, having that young fellow in the Can-Am trainroom was really a treat – for Moi! I have 5 grandchildren, with only one interested in trains (big time). Alas, he lives very far away, so that visits are far ‘n few between. I built the Lionel Polar Express shelf system just for him – but he’s not seen it yet. Hoping the day isn’t too far off . . . .
Cell phone etiquette is like any other form of “doing the right thing” these days, in my not-so-humble-opinion. One cannot count on people being considerate of others, just ain’t gonna happen. I firmly believe that and it is based on overwhelming observations of behavior in public. Whether in automobiles, in restaurants, at live theatre presentations, shopping, traveling aboard public conveyances, etc. It’s a pandemic of rudeness. It is called the unintended consequences of technology. Had I been at that Cracker Barrel you mentioned, I would’ve asked the offender to quiet down a bit. If that didn’t work, I would’ve found the manager and at least lodged a complaint. If they valued my business, they’d do something about it – otherwise, find another place to dine. If we all stuck to those principals . . .
Doug at 6:50 AM today: Nice ENCORE! and good way to start off our Saturday. Joke Was THAT a joke <groan5>
Be back with an ENCORE! a bit later . . . .
Boris, serve ‘em all of the “spiked” OJ they can handle!
Remember: Ruth comes in at 9 AM and remains behind the bar ‘til Leon takes over at 5 PM!
Tom
Good morning Tom and friends! You know, I just got around to looking at one of Mike’s URLs of the 1901 Pullman menu. Scotch Broth? Green Corn? Pickled Lamb’s Tongue? I’ll settle for a Mentor light breakfast please, and nothing from the G. Goldsmith Commissary. Did a little shopping yesterday. Got my microwave oven for over the stove, and an industrial-sized grill, and holiday decorations. Three houses have decorations as of last night. Then we went to the annual “lighting of the square” ceremony in our little town of Woodstock. A few of the pix turned out, and you’ll see those tomorrow. Looks like my little Pullman article generated some discussion from James and Eric. I have no idea where the Lake Bluff is today. It’s not at the IRM. Rob, we have more than 9 barns at IRM. Some of our barns aren’t even numbered, like the steam shop. Hmmm .. now you have me thinking about popping in today and getting a few pix. Hmmmm
Thanks for starting our ENCORE day with your submission, by the way. Here’s an ENCORE from me:
A heavy Union Pacific freight heads west, working up the 16th St. hill out of Omaha. The lead unit is the new EMD SD60 No. 6065. Interestingly, the balance of the all-EMD power consist reflects the “Triple Merger” of UP with Missouri Pacific and Western Pacific, announced in 1980 and approved by the ICC in September, 1982.
The first unit, No. 6065, is less than a year old in this photo, having been built in April 988. The second unit is No. 2307, a former MoPac locomotive inherited in the merger, and painted in temporary “UP-style” MP lettering, that is, the standard red characters, outlined in black on the yellow locomotive, but spelling out “Missouri Pacific” instead of “Union Pacific” on the locomotive side. This 200-hp unit, built in 1981, is a GP38-2, a model produced from 1972-86; its MoPac number was also 2307. The trailing unit is No. 785, a 2500-hp GP35 built in 1963 (and rebuilt by Morrison-Knudsen in 1981) which came to UP from Western Pacific as No. 3004; GP35’s were produced during 1963-66. Both GP units have left the UP roster; No. 785 now wears that number for Eastern Idaho RR.
As is typical of freight trains in recent decades, most visible cars in this photo are of much higher capacity than in former times, often 70 or 100 tons in place of the 50-ton cars which dominated freight car rosters as late as the 1960s. Accordingly, much more horsepower was and is being used to manage these trains, and a train of, say, 60 cars today carries far more cargo than the same size train 30 years earlier. This today’s railroad moves more freight with substantially fewer trains. George R. Cockle photo, Sept. 10, 1988, courtesy of Union Pacific.
There was a competition to cross the English channel doing only the breaststroke, and the three women who entered the race were a brunette, a redhead and a blonde.After approximately 14 hours, the brunette staggered up on the shore and was declared the fastest. About 40 minutes later, the redhead crawled up on the shore and was declared the second place finisher.Nearly 4 hours after that, the blonde finally came ashore and promptly collapsed in front of the worried onlookers.When the reporters asked why it took her so long to complete the race, she replied, "I don't want to sound like I'm a sore loser, but I think those two other girls were using their arms..."
ENCORE SATURDAY ENCORE SATURDAY ENCORE SATURDAY
Here's another sampling of the thread past for everyone's purusal.Another classic juice to start off the encore saturday for this week.This time the opposite side of the country from yesterdays piece on Quebec City and It's transit system.
Rob
trolleyboy wrote:Well some meat to go along with our potatoes today. I'm not sure where to classify this so I will put it into the stable with the Classic Juice series. CLASSIC JUICE # 19 BC HYDRO RAIL & POWER AUTHORITY This company is owned by the Province of British Columbia. The BCHPA supplies electric power and gas to much of BC and Victoria. The rail service was reorganized from the BC Electric rail Company LTD ( BCER ), an electric interurban and street railway system that began operations in Vancouver and it's surrounding areas in 1897,when it took over public transit in Vancouver,Victoria,North Vancouver,and New Westminster-the principle cities in the province.Along tthe Fraser valley, BCER provided a vital link between towns isolated from one another by distancce and absence of good roads. The BCER's electric rail cars brought dairy and other produce to market reguardless of weather,supplied farmers with feed,machinery and supplies,carried logs to the mills in return for lumber and shingles and supplied convienient transportation for the settlers and their families. A major setback for the BCER came in 1913 through competition from jitneys ( small busses and motor cars ) which were independantly owned. These offered extremely flexible schedules and routing, and were often enclosed against weather,wheras the BCER's city streetcars were not. Dr Adam Shortt, who investigated jitney competition in 1917, noted that many people rode them for plasure and social contacts. He pronounced them "an irresponsible service, with no permanent commitment to meet public transit needs " In 1918 the Vancouver city council declared them illegal,ending the competition that had crippled regular transit service. Though sturdy and dependable, the rail cars fell victim to progress. Vancouvers first motorbus line went into operation in 1923 and from that time, the electric railcars were replaced gradually by motor and trolley bus lines. BCER's freight service inherited much of the original ROW and most is still in use today. In 1935 a freak snowstorm dropped between 19.7 and 25.6 inches of snow on the area cutting overhead and telegraph wires.The intercontinental trains were stopped in the mountain passes and the services were not fully restored for svereal weeks. After WW2, the 12MPH speed limit for BCER vehicles was increased to 18MPH, and 15MPH in school zones. In the early 50's, BCER carried out a rails to rubber program. City streetcars were replaced by trolley coaches and busses, and the interurban cars were replaced by the busses of Pacific Stage Lines now Pacific Coach lines. Prior to 1950, the greater part of eastbound freight was from the forest industries. Then as additional industries were established on the lower mainland the railfreight business beacame more diversified. The steeple cabs were replaced by heavier diesels and the light 85 and 70 pound rail was replaced by heavier 115 pound rail The rail service, now concentrated on frieght handling was aquired by the BC Hydro Rail and Power co ( BCHPA ) when it was formed in 1962 from the amalgamationof BC Hydro and the BCER. In 1965, BC hydro completed a new 21 acre marshalling yard in Burnaby ( outside Vancouver ) it ws large enough to store 450 cars. In 1967 a new repair and service centre was completed at the same location. Significant changes came with the introduction of computers in 1979 controlling car control and signalling. This has continuously improved customer relations with the rail carrier. In 1980, the provincial gov. reorganized the passenger transportation system, and the service is now a responsibility of BC Transit ( Van City )This still operates the electric trolley busses and reg busses in Vancouver and suburbs and the new sky train electric light rail. The BCHPA, as of 1984 operates a diesel powered freight service between Vancouver and Chilliwak carrying automobiles,food and forest products. Still a small railway-104 miles of track 20 locomotives and 264 cars. Enjoy Rob
Good evening Leon and all the other ships at sea. Figured that i would pop in for a quick brew or three oh here's a couple extra bucks to squeeze off a round for everyone. Bit of a sloooow day but to be expected with the festive season now officially upon us. I haven't heard yet Tom any crushed bones , dead or otherwise grusome casualties from this years black friday sales stateside. all sorts of live video feeds of people being trampled in walmarts from last years crazyness. Just don't understand it. i've worked in retail up here for 20+ years and haev yet to see one punch even thrown. Just crazy.
Tom-I;m glad that you enjoyed spamalot , Heather and I had intended to get a set of tickets for the last block in the Toronto production but they sold out and we missed out. From what i've read and understood it was well worth the price of admission. coarse we are both Python-heads from way way back. "Would You Lime to Buy a slug " LOL
Glad that you enjoyed the Quebec city bit.It was quite the interesting operation, frieght pasenegers street running and a fine bridge crossing what more could one ask of a railway line
Doug-I thouroughly enjoyed the Pullman piece more great reading for the Our Place Archieves , what a storehouse of information this thread is. an dit's fun too I am a bit jealous though Barn 9 Good Gawd Gertie realistically our musuem need five barns and we're still struggling to get number 4 funded and built.
James-Yup the slimiest of slime green. No way in any place you could miss it. A blind person would feel the heat from the brightness of it's lime green paint job. Oh well these paint job and advertising wraps put quite a bit of cash in VIA's coffers
Eric-There is no pending plans for any light rail into Quebec City, not even a dedicated commuter line. The City is moreof a tourist trap then a heavy industrial centre. Montreal is by and far the main port and main hub of commerse for the province. Quebec the capitol but beyond that. Nice city to visit though. The old town still has it's fortifications and the narrow cobblestone streets. You would easily mistake the old town for any city in France.
Dl-I kinda wish VIA had those quiet cars. I concur with Tom's rant, this high tech wonder of a world we are living in is just a plain rude at times. Nothing irks me more than when a customer I'm giving attention to and trying to help is yapping away on their cell phone to someone else at the same time I'd love to see "tech bans" in doors
,
Hello all of you
Holden’s mild please. Nice to see you are in too Tom.
I hope those of you with holidays have been enjoying them – to be honest you have the right idea – we have the haul in from Aug 30th roughly to Dec 25th with no public holiday – it is a long stretch – and frankly a bore. Maybe when you guys stop experimenting with this ‘independence’ idea and re-join the Queen’s commonwealth we can borrow this idea from you?
Lars – NE corridor and mobile phones / lap tops – don’t get me started on this one – drives me so crazy in fact I had a stand up row with some fools last week on a train I was on who persisted in playing MP3 files from their mobiles to the obvious annoyance of other passengers - which did little to retain the peace I admit – I always reserve in the so called quiet coach here when this is possible but you always get one or two jerks who think their mobile phone conversation is more important than them going to sit in another car where they can use the mobile no problem. I only wish the cars were protected by a Faraday cage which I think would interrupt the signal (according to a scientist friend of mine). I genuinely think this technology (useful though it can be) has meant people have lost the ability to sit down, shut up and be quiet. I’ve heard of the occasional pub that bans them- good news in my view.
Mike – nice Pullman links the other day – was that car being loaded up with ice for the air conditioning – or for the bar? The LMS 4-6-2 Coronation on US tour was good – a preserved one of these is being re-streamlined here in UK as Pete mentioned a while back – it will look like that picture again (minus the headlight and bell) – the streamline casing was taken off during world war 2 to make maintenance easy. It will be impressive when work is finished, probably next year.
Tom – you commentary on those arrival connecting times with Amtrak is depressing – but then the host rail roads seem to think Amtrak timekeeping is optional do they not – sad really as pride in the job should mean timekeeping is a priority for any road – whoever the customer is.
Eric – glad you got that link working.
James – some interesting updates – helps me learn about the US scene
I hope Nick calls in to verify (or otherwise) Mike’s suggestion on the Neil Young lyrics !!!
Pete – did not realise the South Devon Railway and the Paignton line were at one time linked. I’ll certainly give a report back on Swanage in due course – they do a good job there I think with some nice restorations. The line serves a great area and of course they are lucky to run preserved steam right in to the centre of the town.
Good wishes to you all
DL
G-day Tom and all present.
Well, I'm glad to see that everyone enjoyed there thanksgiving day. I know I will today. Unfortunately the father was not home yesterday (due to work) We held off so that father could join in with the whole family.
Ruth- Today I'm just going with a coffee. I have a bigger meal coming, but later I'm thinking leftovers is going to be good. Thanks.
Anyway.
Rob- A slime green F40. Now that one would be hard not to notice. I'm going to have to say that it might be a bit ugly for my taste, but no one asked me how it should be painted.
Your Quebec City electric line was great to read. I enjoyed the history. Glad one of the street cars is still preserved. Thanks
Eric-I know there is a BN unit stuck in with Milwaukee power. But I like U-boats. They are really cool, and even better with sound. Glad you liked the Little joe link. I thought it might surprise you as it did me. I didn't think there was another still surviving. BTW: glad the gobbler and pumpkin pie were good. I always enjoy this time of year. Good eating.
Mike- You always bring in some nice pics and adds. Thanks for the Milwaukee add. And especially the Little joe running down the street. (street running) I guess I'm so used to seeing little joes in the mountains that I never realized they ran right down the street with the South Shore railway. Thanks for those.
Barndad- Well I'm glad you recognize the building it's in. I thought I was seeing things when the caption said, Located at the IRM. Now I really want to go and visit!! To bad you didn't help with some of it's restoration. That would have been cool.
BTW: I read your C&NW sleeper article and I noticed that the one train, #511 to Duluth, Superior. I have a book with me called, "Trackside around Duluth 1957-1960 by David Schauer, and one of the main passenger features in the book is the C&NW passenger train #511. Its pretty cool to look at the train and see the only heavey weight sleeper on the whole train. Most of the train is consisted with stream line cars and a heavey weight baggage. But the sleeper points itself out. I can't read the name on the side of the car. But thanks for the article. It was great.
Tom- A rock hard stomach I have. I am one of those thats needs a cup of OJ once per morning just to give me that head start. Otherwise.... I'm pretty inactive.
Thanks for the comments on my layout. I work hard keeping the thing up to par and I hope it gets better as I go. Especially on the scenery part.
The Little joe was a find. I didn't realize they had finished restoring something like that. It said, under Wikipedia, that they had restored it to working condition. I want to get down there and get a good look at it.
Happy railroading
James
The biggest shopping day of the year is upon us here in mid-continent USA as many of the retail stores opened their doors at 5 AM or earlier! People actually lined up before midnight to get first chance at the “bargains.” Amazin’, simply bloomin’ amazing’
A blue sky morning, temps again to be in the 60s (F) as this wonderful week of great weather continues. We’ve got a rare treat for this afternoon – going to see “Spam-a-lot” at a live performance. Should be lotsalaffs. For those who have no clue – this is a spoof of the Monty Python flicks – supposedly original stuff, but along those lines. An early Christmas treat for us.
Hope one and all enjoyed the feast day, gave proper thanks, and took a relaxing loooooong walk after dinner!
So, the call went out for the Brits to help out, and where were they Nary a one – not ONE! However, kudos all ‘round to our Canadian connection for keeping the tempo going here and on “my other Thread.” 5- to you Bar Chandler Rob! Some of our regulars “done good” too, as there’s all kinds of interesting stuff to check out! So, what happened to the Brits
The acknowledgments:
James at 10:16 AM yesterday: OJ and vanilla Good Gawd Gertie, a cast-iron stomach. <grin>
Rob at 3:52 ‘n 4:29 PM yesterday: If that furnace you had actually functioned over a 40-year period – where can I find one like THAT Amazin’
Something of interest from Quebec City traction, eh I think that’s a first for this Thread – good reading!
Eric at 1:20 AM today: Survived the day, eh The one day of the year where “excess” seems to be in vogue, so to speak. Couldn’t do that anymore than once a year in our Haus!
Doug at 6:32 AM today: Better late than never, as the wee-bit late Pullman “theme” continues on! Appreciate the time ‘ n effort you put into your submissions, and I’ll be sure to read it before day’s end!
Have a great day one and all – I’ll try to check in this evening.
Remember: Ruth comes in at 9 AM and remains behind the bar ‘til Leon takes over at 5 PM! And this is Pizza 'n Beer Nite along with Steak 'n Fries Nite at the Tavern by the Tracks!
Good morning Tom and friends! I'll have a light breakfast please, with a side of leftover turkey, stuffing, green bean salad, cranberries, sweet potatoes and gravy. Interesting "Little Joe" info and pix James. I can tell from your photo that the picture was taken in barn 9 at the IRM, but Like I said, I'll just have to be on the lookout for it since I somehow missed taking any photos of it. There's about 1/2 mile of track inside barn 9. It's our longest barn, and houses about a third of our steam engines. It would have been nice to have worked on the Little Joe, but I can't take any credit. Great to see new stuff from Rob yesterday, and the visit from Eric. I started to clean-up the the fence line between my yard and the farmers field behind me yesterday. If I put down some topsoil and seed between the end of my lawn and the fenceline, I can double the apparent length of my back-yard. We also became the first house to light holiday decorations yesterday. Bet my new neighbors are cursing me for that! Today I run to Home Depot for an over-the-oven microwave oven, and to get myself a nice sized grill for the patio. But in the meantime, and continuing the Pullman theme, here's a little something to read with your coffee:
Floyd River by Roger W. Kramer & William F. Strauss
Between 1923 and 1927 the Pullman Standard Manufacturing Company built a total of 266 sleepers with the 10-section, 1-drawing room., 2-compartment configuration. In December 1948, when Pullman was forced to divest itself of its large fleet of sleeping cars, Chicago & North Western purchased a total of 51 sleeping cars. 17 of them with the 10-1-1 arrangement, six of them with the 10-1-2 arrangement and five with the 10-section, 3-double bedroom arrangement. Over the course of the next several decades these cars ran on a variety of C&NW overnight trains.
Plans for an all new “North Western Limited” in 1923 prompted Pullman to build more 10-1-2 sleepers for C&NW service. These cars were built in 1924 to Plan 3585. Four of these sleepers which C&NW purchased in 1948 were Lake Bluff, Lake Forest, Lake Gardner, and Lake Geneva. None of these cars exists today. Among the 10-1-1 sleepers purchased in 1948 was the Floyd River, 1 1928-built Pullman sleeper. This car does exist today at the Illinois Railway Museum. We acquired the car in work train service in 1985. It was last assigned to the Wisconsin Division, used as a storage car in Crystal Lake, Illinois.
The cars were constructed with steel floors, steel plate sides, and had Pullman wide-style letterboards. The Fort series cars were originally built with canvas roofs that were later changed to galvanized steel when air-conditioning ducts were installed during the late 1920’s. Our Pullman did have three of these ducts installed but its air-conditioning system consisted of blocks of ice in bunkers underneath the car, These bunkers are still on the car but in a rusted condition with some hinges missing.
Cars in both series of Pullmans had a sleeping capacity of 24 to 26 patrons. The drawing room and each of the sections slept two people, one on the upper fold-down berth and another on the lower seat. The cars were electrically lighted, having a 32-volt DC battery set and a belt drive generator to supply power. At night all lights would be turned off and aisle lights underneath every other section would be turned on to supply night lighting. It was quite an interesting atmosphere, especially if you were on your honeymoon!
Inside the passengers were greeted with plush and imitation leather Pullman seats. Carpeting covered the section, compartment and drawing room floors. The only remaining example of carpeting in the Floyd River is in the compartment. The lavatories and corridors had tile flooring. Some of the tile still exists in the Floyd River. Drawing Room A had its own private bathroom and a couch. Unfortunately, the C&NW removed not only the bathroom, but also all fixtures and appointments in the drawing room of the Floyd River. Basically, our C&NW Pullman car is stripped of many of the interior parts it once had. But through the determination of IRM volunteers, we have acquired many of the parts needed to restore Floyd River to resemble its former self.
When the “North Western Limited” was streamlined after World War II the Lake sleepers were assigned to other trains operating over the Wisconsin Division. Most of these trains were destined for northern Wisconsin and upper Michigan. During the 1940’s, these cars had been used on trains 211-212, the “Ashland Limited” and on trains 510, the “Chicago Limited”, and 511, the “Duluth-Superior Limited.”
In 1928, the exterior color scheme of the sleepers was changed to the standard Pullman green from the bright yellow and green color schemes of years past. It was not until 1939 that these cars again wore the C&NW’s yellow and green colors. This time the roofs were painted North Western’s forest green to match the letterboards and ends of the cars. Two two-inch black stripes were painted the length of each car; one separated the yellow and green on the letterboards, and another ran along the windowsill. The heavyweight equipment was repainted so it would match the new streamlined “400” equipment which had been delivered in November 1939. The only lettering on these cars at the times was the traditional “Pullman” on the letterboard and the car name centered on the side of the car and below the windows. In 1948 when C&NW purchased the cars, the words “Chicago & North Western” were painted on each end of the letterboard in three-inch aluminum letters. This proclaimed the cars were Pullman sleepers but were owned by the Chicago & North Western. This paint scheme is the style we would like to paint the Floyd River in. It’s the color scheme many of us remember the C&NW by – yellow and green.
These cars were operating in sleeping car service for over 30 years and the Floyd River survived by being converted into maintenance-of-way service. She is one of the last remaining Pullman sleepers from the C&NW, symbol from an era of first class passenger travel.
CLASSIC JUICE # 36 QUEBEC CITY ELECTRIC LINES
Well it's been a while since a new classic juice has surfaced so figured that I would fill up some dead space with it this afternoon , keep the wheels turning as it were.Quebec City is the oldest city in Canada, and indeed one of the oldest in North America having been temporarily settled by cartier in 1535 and permanently settled by Champlain in 1608.Always a strategic city in that it was sited at tyhe Narrows of the St Lawrence River, the city grew to be a safe anchorage and a city with alot of import export business. Beginning in the early part of the 19th century,Quebec City underwent massive growth, becomming the third largest port city in North America just behind New York City and New Orleans.principle exports through the Port of Quebec became potassium, wheat,and forest products.Numerous small scale manufacturers set up shop in the walled city as well, and the period between 1800 and 1861 the population of the city expanded from 8,000 to 57,000.
Now by the early 1900's the city began to suffer from it's outdated port facilities and more and more traffic was diverted away to Montreal and Halifax so starting in 1901 when the cities population hit around 70,000 a concerted effort to modernize and expand the city and it's Port facilities was undertaken. Including a new and more modern and reliable public transit system. Part of this new system ws of coarse the Quiebec bridge which we have disscussed at length on this thread satrted in 1904 but not finished until 1919 due to it's two tragic collapses while under construction. The first in 1907 and the second in 1916.Once the bridge was finished however it was openned to rail traffic on dec 3 1919 finally linking the city to the South shore.As built this magnificent structure was 94 feet wide ,3,239 feet long and boasted three lanes of highway one track for the railway and two pedestrian walkways. The third centre highway lane carried the streetcar line accross.
So in 1901 it was decided that the city needed a more dependable public transit system that was clean reliable and quicker than the horse railway that was started up in august of 1865. Thus the Quebec Light and Power Company ( QRL&PC ) became the transit company of choice operating city streetcar lines and an interurban district.
The company operated the 6 routes of the in city transit as well as oversaw the construction and operation of the neighbouring streetcar systems in St Foy,Levis,and Sillery PQ.The interurban district ran from teh city centre conected the ajoining comunities and ran down to Montmorency and the Ste Anne De Beaupre Shrine and the sisters of Charity Hospital. In all 50 miles of trackage bewteen the interurban districts and the city system.
Owing to the cramped streets of old Quebec the streetcar service(s) ended in 1948 in favour of motor busses. The interurban line continued on until March of 1959 , abandonning 5 months before the Provinces largest streetcar system in Montreal bowed out of the passenger moving buisiness.Once these last two electric line abandonments occured the only electric transit left in te Province was te CN run commuter service from Montreal to Deux-Montagne which still operates today.
The CN had trackage right s over te 40 mile Montmorency district, and interchanged both paseneger, as well as mail express and frieght with the QRL&PC. Most in town switching was handled electrically by the various express motors and steeple cabs operated by the QRL&PC.
Most of thre QRL&PC's streetcars were built by te Ottawa car Company and were doubled ended as the narrow city streets did not allow for turning loops.All were painted an attractive dark crimson with leaf brown roof and window sashes.An interesting design was that they carried their resistors grids on the roof as due to the extreme amount of snow which typically clogged Quebec City Streets would cause endless electrical shorts had the grids been left beneath the cars.Heavy wedge plows and pilot mounted snowplows were the order of the day for the interurban district which also was serviced by Ottawa Car Company products. The First wood bodied cars of similar design as the Montreal and Southern Counties. Then the famous 450 series metal high speed interurbans were built by Ottawa and became synonimous with the St Ann De Beaupre Shrine and the entire Montmorency Division. One can still be seen today , restored and operational at the Seashore Trolley Musuem in Kennebunkport Maine.
Good afternoon everyone , hopefully the food put out by H&H and Cindy is to the passers by's liking. I'll nab a Kieth's and go sit by the fireplace. Hopefully everyone is having the happiest of thanksgivings with their friends and families .Our Place will be here for the after dinner alka seltzers and turkey sandwiches
Tom-great little animations sir gives the place some character on this fest day donchathink I will likey take some corespondance coarses who knows wher it may end, never can learn too much I've always said.Nice to see most of the regulars who are still in town have popped by for a happy thnaks giving wish, something not to be seen in most parts of this forum,truly is what sets us apart , that and Boris I've go all my outside decs up today, nice 60 degree day here today with a bright shining ball in the sky , given all the rain and grey skies latley I hardly recognized it. also had a new high efficiancy furnace installed today good timing weatherwise anyway, replaced an old 40 yeaar old model.
Mike-good to see you in with the usual high output urls hope you folks have a happy holiday as well.
Ditto Doug n James glad to see the two of you pop in today as well.
Eric-I would have to aggree with you , I couldn't get used to 90 degree christmas's either , no way no how. My family went to Florida once none of us actually enjoyed the trip , just seemed wrong. We should have been building snow forts not sand castles.My understanding is that the F40's are to soldier on for many years to come, their just to reliable like most of the 40 series locomotives.I'm certainly not complaining, I just have never liked those GE genesis passenger engines they just don't have the charactor. Mind you FPA4/s and FP9's and FP7's are my true passenger power of choice.
Happy T-Day to all! No time to stay for a drink, but I'll spring for a round. I have to get back to my work before it's discovered that I'm not working! Hope my family here all have a terrific day with their family and friends, and get those holiday lights up while the weather is nice! Have a feast!
(great graphics Tom)
I just noticed from Tom's latest post and a few others have talked about it, that Cindy has taken over for the day.
Alright Cindy, could I get a cup of OJ with a splash of Vanilla. Thanks.
Just came on this fine morning to wish everyone here a....
Happy Thanksgiving!!
Hope the Gobblers are good!!
Happy Thanksgiving to our U.S. customers!
Another blue sky day here in mid-continent USA, where the petrol prices have “soared’ to $2.19 (rounded) – they just have to gouge the holiday motorists, eh Anyway, temps are supposed to be in the 60s (F) again. Nice day and I hope it is so wherever the rest of you are!
Getting right to the acknowledgments, after a most annoying start - lost this Post on two tries - fortunately, I had the bulk of it on my WP. <good grief!>
DL at 11:12 AM yesterday: Wish I had more info to pass your way regarding the RCAFs training in relation to your uncle’s experiences during WWII.
Insofar as overnight passenger train travel is concerned – I NEVER require an excuse! Problem is I prefer VIA Rail, and the costs for me to get to the station from mid-continent USA are becoming rather prohibitive. For example, what used to be a round trip fare for TWO is now nearly tripled, and that’s with months of advance planning – no last minute stuff. If anything factors in against our travels to the UK it will most certainly be the air fares. Of course I have a built-in-bias against traveling coach for such a long distance. So, I’m already operating against the curve when it comes to finding affordable fares. <grim>
Your comments regarding the preserved railways having no consideration regarding the scheduling with “real” trains brings to mind the way Amtrak operates here. For example, there’s a train that arrives in Kansas City, Missouri from Los Angeles on a daily basis – the Southwest Chief. The schedule has it arriving at 7:26 AM at KCity’s Union Station. Now, there is also a train scheduled to depart for Chicago, via St. Louis at 7:30 AM. So any passengers aboard the Chief who wish to change trains for destinations in Missouri or Illinois (other than Chicago – where the Chief terminates) they must wait until 4:30 PM for the next train – and that one terminates in St. Louis. Confused You betchaboots. Make any sense Nope. And it’s been going on like this for decades ‘round the country. Amtrak is NOT a rail system, it’s simply a hodge-podge remotely resembling one – but with so many glitches that it is sadly laughable. <groan>
Several years ago that library that I mentioned hosted a two-day seminar on passenger equipment and diesel locomotives from decades past. It was a terrific forum to attend. There were so many facets to it all, with representatives from those great times providing narratives to their slide collections and 16 mm motion pictures. Quite a bit of the library’s offerings were on display – but hardly all – and you can bet those tables were in demand. My bride had given me the admission as a birthday present, one that really will be hard to top. As with you, I can easily become engrossed and enthralled simply browsing through the schedules of the day, or the rosters of equipment, or . . . . <grin>
Pete at 2:32 PM yesterday: Many thanx for keeping the place vibrant with your visit!
Check out the info from Lars, as he addressed your comments regarding the distances between New York – London and New York – San Francisco. Gotta watch that anecdotal stuff, eh
Interesting and enlightening story out of the KC Star – however, as pointed out by Lars, wonder why they didn’t include a picture of the trolley Happens all too often these days – citing the VIA Rail special trains on Remembrance day of this and last year.
Liked that Pix of the pub. My late friend up in Dartmouth (Halifax) who hailed from Scotland, was an active member of the Nova Scotia Robert Burn’s Society. He could quote Burns’ poetry and do so while engaged in dialogue about diverse subject matter. The pipers and tributes from the members still echo in my aging head.
Received your Email and will hold the reply ‘til Sunday. Enjoy the Thanksgiving holiday and weekend in southwestern MO!
Lars at 4:29 PM yesterday: A very introspective Post from you and I found it to be one of your finest! Covered lots of territory.
There are times when I too think back on that part of my life where career played heavily into my comings ‘n goings. Would I do it a
Hi Tom and everyone, a round for the house.
Lots to be thankful for. Our Place for sure. You guys.
Missed the boat due to circumstances but here's a couple things
http://images.nypl.org/?id=469747&t=w
http://images.nypl.org/?id=469738&t=w
A train always helps. This one is at Buffalo in 1936. Seems to be about air-conditioning.
http://iarchives.nysed.gov/images/extscaled/airconditpullmancarfull.jpg
Explored that link that Tom put yesterday and found this Milwaukee Road ad
http://tjrhino1.umsl.edu/Barriger_Collection/milwaukee_ad.html
Here's that Little Joe of Illinois Railroad Museum coming down the street
http://davesrailpix.com/cssb/htm/ss335.htm
It's going to rain on the parade today, but R. H. Macy sells dry goods.
http://images.nypl.org/?id=1219153&t=w
Long Island Rail Road coach and London, Midland & Scottish 4-6-2
http://photoswest.org/photos/00020501/00020567.jpg
You can get anything you want at Alice's Restaurant
http://images.nypl.org/?id=482752&t=w
Nick, was it Down By The River by Neil Young and Crazy Horse?
A
Mike
Good evening Leon , just a Keith's and a round for the house if you will. I've come to make sure that the trainload of turkey's arrived and are all preasnt and accounted For. ( this year the reefers are not being parked ajacent to Boris's shed ) All will be set for the special food services this holiday weekend, H&H and Copperkettle will have the turkey dinners and all the fixings ready and waiting for all who wish to partake. Nice to know that Cindy has offered to help as well.
tom-Thanks for the on my passenger stuff.I manage to dredge up the odd interesting tidbit now and again.I'm putting up my outdoor lights this weekend as well, usuually first of december I'll light em up. My mother's falt she's such an big Christmas person, I can remember helping yank down outside halloween decorations on OCT 31st and helping her start to put up the Christmas ones ( no joke ) love her to bits. Sounds like you and Pete will have a ton of stuff to disscuss on your rail journey's, like that wouldn't happen anyway eh Thanks for the speacial over "on de otha thread"
lars-Nope post secondary is a pay as you go over here.Gov loans are available but the repayment terms would to use a Tomism "gag a haelthy maggot " actually in the late 80's when I was comming out of high school the criteria to qualify for the govt, loans was lets just say none to friendly , it was based on the family income rather than the students. Therefore I only qualified for a $1000 a year which wouldn't have covered the cost of the text books let alone the tuition or dorm/apartment fee's. York university was (is) in Toronto big bucks even then. Times have changed now the whole shot 5-10,000 a year can be put on these govt loans with few questions asked. Unfortunatly our youth once they graduate tend to carry a debt load of 20-100,000 $ all which needs to be paid back within ten years of gaining employment. I may indeed hit some night school coarses, if for no other reason than just to expand my brain. When Tom mails you those books I think that you will enjoy them. Pierre Berton wrote them , he alway's a good read, one of our more prolific authors ( passed away a year or so ago ) other books written by him are , The last Spike and The National Dream ( two volumes on the building of the CPR ) Vimy ( chronicles the Canadian Corps and the Battle of Vimy Ridge during WW1 ) dozens of others. All are non-fiction but he's just an intreesting read , he tries to hit the story from all angles.
Doug-loved the latest CGW article, nice to see you back in the flow of things again,your pereps for Chicago seem to be taking on epic proportions
Dl-Your welcome for the RCAF info. If you get the chnace when you are over here again, CFB Trenton Ontario has a small, but nice RCAF Museum on their grounds, there most interesting exhibit at the moment is an RCAF Halifax Bomber that was repatriated from the bottom of a fyord several yeasr ago now.It's been completely restored ( not air worthy ) interestingly enough the pilot was on hand at it's handing over cermonies and he was handed his thermos which ws found wedged under his seat, battered but intact,hopefully he didn't drink the tomato soup that was inside it seeing as the plane was shot down in 1944
Pete-Interesting story on that streetcar. Likely a PCC have to guess due to the lack of picture. But the TTC bought out most of KC's PCC fleet when the Kansa City transit ended streetcar operations. It was cheaper to buy up[ used cars and convert them to Toronto guage then to buy new,they picked up PCC's from Birmingham and Cleveland as well. In the end TTC operated a unified fleet of 775 PCC's from the end of the Witt's tenure in 1966- till the early 80's when the new CLRV's began delivery. today their fleet is all CLRV / ALRV's with two PCC's left as herritage summer use charter cars.
James-Fine locomotive editions young man. Oh and good to see the inclusive post and to hear that the ole mother board isn't as fried as you had feared. always liked the C30's and the Uboats, alas canadian railroads never embraced GE locomotives till the late 80's and 90's so none served on this side of the boarder.The F40 in the red's a rarity, VIA will paint up two or three locomotives like that a year, all advertising makes the locomotive into a rolling billboard, helps pay the bills. ther's at least one "slime green" one floating out there with big "Telus Mobility" signs all over it. The Red one was painted for the CBC's 50th aniversary ( Canadian Broadcasting Network TV and radio) Also a crown corporation.
Eric-Nice to see you back sir,I had hoped it was not more computer woes that kept you away, good to hear that it wasn't.That WP piece was from a WP theme day we had oh last year, sparked quite a bit of disscussion amongst the legion of the lost at the time. Tom's numbers are about smack on for the F40's, VIA still ahs about 10 or 12 others stored servicable above and beyond the 42 that are in service. Certaion trains and districts are better suited to the continuing usage of the F40's over the P42's. My hometown is a Prime example, we have 10 VIA's a day usually only two are GE powered, they have difficulty with the Dundas hill leading into town, the GE's just don't load up and dig in as well as the F40's I figure that VIA will run them till they drop, then run them some more.
Well gents set up some rounds for holiday toasts, the bar chandler is buying for his American friends sorry DL and Nick but you guys still have to buy LOL
G-day Captain Tom and all present.
Leon- I forgot to order from you my friend. Just a coffee for me, thanks.
I just found out that my mother board actually didn't fry. The computer ( After a diagnostics check and defrag) discovered 10 problems with the motherboard and how it's running things. So It has been correcting them for a portion of the day. I have internet again...
Bandad- I finally see your animation pics. The one with the man holding the gun up to the computer was hilarious. Well I'm glad to see The Valley Modelers are using an old substation for there layout. And Yes, HO is the only way to go.
Your CGW article was really cool. I think 6, 1350 HP F-units is a little under powered for a 190 car train. How did they do it? Thats really amazing!!
Pete- The Kansas City streetcar was very interesting. I'm glad the city took part of its time to help rebuild a portion of rail history. Street cars are really cool to have around. Glad to see it restored. BTW: Liked the pics you posted today. Really liked that interesting Coach. It is white and blue. Would that be a royal car of some type?
Lars- Thanks for the adresses on where I can find the books. I will get right on it and look that book up. Thanks.
Rob- I was quite relieved to find that it was problems the computer could "fix." Some of the time its, A Fatal error has occured and can't be fixed. I will have to look in the news paper for re-actments like that. Thanks for the tip.
Eric- In fact I have the web address to the Little joe.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Little_Joe_locomotive_at_IRM.jpg
This should take you to the Joe. It is a former Chicago, South Shore and South Bend Little joe. They say it is able to operate..... Also glad you liked the Little joe info. Glad I could help.
Tom- I know what you mean. This computer has had it's problems. Just glad they could be fixed so that I could come back aboard and read and post.
It's that time again. Wednesday models!!!
A new addition. Not exactly Milwaukee road, but I had to have it at the price I got it. I was quite happy to know that it has sound equipped! This is a B30-7.
This is also new. The cement plant had its foundation lifed and moved across town. This is next to the large Grain elevator.
A nother new addition. This is a U25B. The early version with the longer nose. Phase 4. This is more of the Milwaukee road style.
Had to get a shot of the hard working men who contribute so many hours toward the railroad.
Happy railroading.
Good evening Tom and friends! I'll have a bottomless draught and spring for a round. Did everyone get their turkey yet?
Sorry I missed the Pullman Nostalgia post Tom. You were right, ... it was a winner! As for the additional CGW stuff, well ... it's a long article and I don't have a whole lot of time to type it all up, and that's why it's dragging out so long. I didn't even have time to put together a pike piece for today. Wonderful to see DL here, and thanks for your Pullman insites. I just know I have more Pullman stuff around here to find! Great to see you too today Pete, and thanks for your words as well. Seems like Tom is hinting at a practice Rendezvous in Chicago, which sounds just fine to me. Anytime gentlemen ... I'd be pleased to assist and host anytime. I see manager Lars made it in as well. Glad you like the cartoons, but you know I have a lot more groaners in me that must be released ... just like the following:
A woman was looking in the bedroom mirror and says to her husband,"I feel horrible, I look fat and ugly. Pay me a compliment".The husband replies, "Your eyesight's damn near perfect".He never heard the shot.
Until the next time!
Lars
Hi Tom and all.
Afraid it is a quick visit today as we are down to the bride's mom for Thanksgiving in a while, so allow me to get a round in please RUTH.
ROB Glad you enjoyed the Pullman pics.Great post on the UP Pullmans, it seems that the early Hotel train was the pioneer of the luxury trains that followed.
I see in the KC star that an original 1940s era Kansas City Streetcar has been returned to K.C. and is going on perminent display at Union station there.
http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/news/local/16070872.htm
It says it was in Toronto for a time.
ERIC I bet they are some good stories that guy who used to work for Pullman. I think there are a few more pics of Alan's German trip to come.
DOUG Thanks for the latest installment of the CGW, it certainly seems it was a road full of caracter, The image of the cowboys shooting the telegraph insulators from the top of the cattle cars is wonderful.
DL Perhaps we can look into the non Pullman premier cars the GWR and the LMS had. I know the London & North Western Railway built some very elegaant 12-Wheel cars that was used on the 2PM "Corridor Express on the London to Glasgow run. A version of this type of carriage, which was used for the Royal Train, is in the NRM at York.
Hope you have a great time at the Swanage Railway and look forward to hear what locos were running there.
It certainly is annoying when a preserved line cant be bothered to offer connections to the main line when the stations are adjacent.
So the Devon Belle car is on the Paignton line now, it was on the other line the Paignton line owned, the South Devon Railway before. If I remember right the Paignton line sold the South Devon to some the preseravtion society a few years back. I think the Paignton line is run much more as a business than a preserved line.
A pub in Dumfries Scotland where Robbie Burns used to drink ,perhaps he enjoyed a Deuchars there.
TOM Great Pullman day yesterday.
With distances over here I was told once it is nearer from London to New York than it is between New York and San Francisco. I dont know how true this is
As you say we will have to look into a trip to Chicago, there seems plenty of railroad interest to see there.
As I say I will be away from the bar for a few days unless I can get on a puter. Anyway I did not want to leave without wishing everyone:
A VERY HAPPY THANKSGIVING TO ALL THE PATRONS OF OUR PLACE.
Pete.
Hi Tom
Let’s have something from the evening menu and a pint of Caledonian Deuchars IPA please.
Can’t recall if I thanked you and Rob for info on RCAF training info before we entered Pullman theme day – even if I did won’t be of harm to thank again. Interesting stuff.
Lars and Tom – sure I appreciate the mileage to San Fran is a bit more than ‘a trip to the corner shop’ as we say, but do you guys really need me to tell you when you have an excuse to ride sleeper trains? <grin>
Rob, was thinking about your comment about re-patriating the Pullman observation saloon to the UK – I bet costs are lower due to it being close to a port – and Swanage at this end is not far from Southampton so I guess if they can get it ship board it may be easy – in fact that site said they had raised the money to bring it back, most funds now required for restoration. Rob, I look forward to enjoying a brew of tea with you some time I can make it Ontario and your street car museum!
Pete – you remind me about the sister Observation car in Devon – in July I had to accompany someone to Exeter on the train and rtn the same day – I thought I’d press on to Paignton for a trip on the steam line there before heading north in the evening. I alighted the BR train at Paignton and crossed to the steam platform to see a GWR loco and that saloon pulling out on the last round trip of the day. I have to say I take a dim view of preserved railways that can’t be bothered to align their departure times with the arrival of connecting ‘real’ trains – it re-enforces the view that they are ‘playing trains’ and can’t see the wider picture. Sadly (for them) they lost out on my fare, the supplement I’d have paid to ride in the Pullman and the money I’d have spent on an afternoon tea!
Eric and Pete – sorry about the science and society pic lib link – hope it works another time – I like selecting images from this archive as they are very high quality (plus being from a national museum I’ve sort of paid for them to be there with my taxes!).
Doug – interesting stuff about the Box Cars – shows Pullman were a big manufacturing force in US – don’t think I mentioned that in UK Pullman did not build cars – they managed and maintained them in house but car construction usually carried out by the leading private carriage and wagon (C&W) manufacturers here.
Pete – did not know no Pullmans on the LMS – I think none on GWR either – I recall reading GWR could not reach agreement with Pullman Car Co so developed their own luxury saloons – GWR ‘Super Saloons’. I saw one at Didcot Railway Centre many years back.
I agree, the modern (1960s) Pullman’s don’t start to match the luxury of the 1930s cars – but I think they have their own period charm. I’m sure you are right about those MK1 Pullman’s being the last to carry the trad livery – I’ve ridden in one on a steam special to Stratford upon Avon last summer (Shakespeare Express)
http://www.shakespeareexpress.com/sv.htm
Thanks for your contribs on the Manchester and Liverpool Pullmans – I did not realise the latter was mixed rake service – I think it ended earlier than the Manchester Pullman – probably reflects the declining economic fortunes of Liverpool in that period sadly.
I’ll definitely report back on Newark Films – it is about 8 days away but sure to be good. Flyer advertises some film footage from the Edwardian Period I think.
Tom – interesting link about the University Archive – I’d enjoy the timetable archive that is part of it. Always fascinating. Just bought my new copy of the UK All Line timetable for winter 2006/7 yesterday – it runs to 200+ tables across 2,646 pages of passenger train timetables. It is shame they are going to stop printing these after next summer on the basis that there is ‘little demand’ now that information is on the web. A great shame!
You are no doubt correct about collecting tins at our place – since I’m in Swanage in January I’ll find out what is going on with this Pullman Car – maybe put some ‘non virtual’ money in the pot there and have a drink to the Our Place regulars!
Mid-week in mid-continent USA and things are going fine here at the Saloon by the Siding. Just waiting for some customers to enjoy our <light> ‘n <traditional> breakfasts from the Menu Board, some pastries from the Mentor Village Bakery, and of course some freshly ground ‘n brewed coffee <regular> ‘n <unleaded> over in the urns.
A great looking morning with blue skies and temps expected to reach 60 (F) – it’s that time to get some outside decorations put up for Christmas. <ugh> Yeah, for some it may be a tad early, but we don’t lite ‘em off ‘til about the 2nd week in December. Just want to get a leg up on it with the nice temps and so forth.
Let’s get to the acknowledgments since my last narrative:
DL at 12:28 PM yesterday: Fascinating info regarding the effort to bring home car #14 – Pullman observation coach – from San Francisco. Really chock full of most interesting things to “go,” browse and enjoy! Many thanx.
A thought regarding “donations” being sought here at the bar. Anything serious should be kept off the Forums. I know that Kalmbach would take a dim view toward using their services along those lines. So, let’s just encourage the guys to droppa few bucks for the effort. It’s a good idea.
Appears as though they just may reassemble the entire consist if what I’ve pieced together holds true. That would be something else, eh
One of those coaches named “Lydia” should be of interest to our friend BudKarr BK and his bride, Lydia! Perhaps they’ll spring loose with a gold bar or two!
The approximate distance is 1740.8 miles (2801.5 km) from St. Louis, Missouri to San Francisco, California. Just a bit of a stretch for a weekend jaunt!
James at 2:18 PM yesterday: Join the club – ‘puter problems R us ‘round this place! <argggggggggh>
Nice work with the inclusive Post!
Lars at 4:19 PM yesterday: Really enjoyed your book cover and posters on the Pullman Company from both sides of the pond! Really appreciate your participation in these Tuesday Themes, for without you and your submissions, something surely would be missing!
Yes, it is indeed one of the positives from this cyber experience to have made a few friends here at the bar. With Pete and I living relatively close (nearly 2 hours by car or train) we’ve found many reasons to get together – either for train trips for the guys or some pleasant lunches with the gals. A plus fer sure, fer sure! Looking forward to meeting a few others at our spring Rendezvous here in St. Louis.
Rob at 5:08 PM yesterday: Your commentary regarding the youth of Canada could just as easily be spoken of the youth in this country as well. Not all, mind you – in yours or mine – but it does seem that history and appreciation for what it took to build our respective societies isn’t as important has having a cell phone stuck in one’s ear, a water bottle in hand, an MP3 player plugged into an ear, all in the name of multi-tasking! <geesh> Revelations such as those make me appreciate the times I’ve had on this earth. I remember when there was no TV – no gizmos and people actually read books!
Speaking of which, I shall mail those books off to Lars after I read ‘em. Good idea!
Doug at 7:07 PM
Good morning Tom and gang! I'll have a light breakfast before running off to work. Great additional material Pete, and Rob contributed more Pullman meterial later. Do you guys ever sleep? I'm not sure there is much of a museum down in Pullman. I think it's more plans to build rather than a place that actually exists. I'll check into it, because it might be a place we need to visit in 2008. Good to see Eric once again! Always a pleasure sir.
Here's a little more on my CGW to read with your coffee, and it ain't done yet!
The Amazing Great Western Sep. 1953 Railroad Magazine
Six unit diesel at Graf, Iowa, heading 190 loads. Heavy use of locomotives like this is “secret” of how CGW hauls heaviest tonnage per train of any railroad in the country
On the Kansas City line much of the cater-cornered route across Iowa had been constructed by “The Old Diagonal,” corporately known as the Wisconsin, Iowa & Nebraska Railway. Indeed, the Stickney0inspired Chicago, St. Paul & Kansas City purchased the Old Diagonal when the latter was a going concern with trains running between Des Moines and Waterloo, and a short branch serving Cedar Falls. The CStP&KC spanned the gap between Waterloo and Oelwein on the north, and by the end of 1888 reached St. Joseph, Missouri, 158 miles from Des Moines on the south. With the leasing of the Leavenworth & St. Joseph Railway in 1891, plus certain trackage rights, the Stickney road had trains running into Kansas City.
Meanwhile, A.B. Stickney had more plans for continued expansion, but near-insolvency temporarily halted further track laying. He, however, succeeded in reorganizing the road without a receiver. A new company, the Chicago Great Western Railway was incorporated in 1892 to take over all the property of the CStP&KC. By an ingenious method of getting security holders, most of whom resided in England, to exchange bonds of the old company for stocks of the new, the road emerged without any mortgage indebtedness. At that time the CGW was said to have been the only American trunk line without bonded indebtedness. An unusual feature of the reorganization was the issuance by the company of debenture stock, along with three other kinds of security.
A bitter foe of discrimination, including rebating and rate-cutting, Stickney found time to write a book called The Railway Program (1892) attacking these vices. Probably the most outspoken volume ever penned by a railroad president, the work did much to further the cause for better regulation. The whole subject is more or less academic today, but in the ‘90s shippers often sought rate concessions and railroads were sometimes bludgeoned into acceding to their requests.
A man of action, outspoken and fearless, the red-headed A.B. Stickney often blazed his own trail. When he wanted a railroad bridge across the Mississippi to St. Paul he completed the structure and then asked the Government for permission to build it. The War Department acquiesced! He is said to have been the first to introduce compartment sleeping cars west of Chicago and to adopt the a la carte system in dining-car service.
Railroading in those days was a rugged occupation. Contemporary accounts relate how cowboy attendants on stock trains between St. Paul and Chicago whiled away their time shooting glass insulators off telephone poles. They often rode atop cattle cars, and not a few were crack marksmen. Company linemen were kept busy repairing the damage. For many years, too, the Great Western was a haven for boomers. If a man could not hire out on the larger roads like the Milwaukee, North Western or the Burlington, he hit the “Red Stack,” as the CGW was known because of the distinctive coloring of its smokestacks. It was often said of Great Western trains that they never had the same crew twice.
One of the principle shortcomings of the road was that it did not have “friendly” connections. Many overtures were made by CGW officials for strong traffic alliances but generally to little avail. Before the turn of the century Stickney rode with the bearded James J. Hill, head of the Great Northern, in the former’s private car. Stickney was desirous of getting the Empire Builder to use his line as a connecting link between St. Paul and Chicago for Great Northern trains going to and from the West Coast. Jim Hill had not purchased an interest in the Burlington at that time and was open to suggestion. As the train sped along, Hill, as was his way, took a little book from his vest pocket and with great gravity looked over some notes. Finally he raised his leonine head and quoted a sizeable figure as the ton-miles hauled over a division of his road.
With equal austerity A.B. Stickney whipped out his pocket memorandum, pondered a few minutes, and quoted another figure – considerably in excess of Hill’s – as being the current ton-miles moved over the Great Western.
"Stickney, you’re lying,” said the Empire Builder.
“So are you, Jim,” retorted the Great Western president. After that both men resumed looking out the window; and as we know, the Great Northern found a connecting link elsewhere. Perhaps it was best the two forceful and strong-willed executives remained apart and that their interests did not overlap.
By 1900 the Chicago Great Western obtained stock control of the Wisconsin, Minnesota & Pacific, operating between Red Wing and Mankato, Minn. Via Randolph. Shortly afterward it purchased the Duluth, Red Wing & Southern, extending from Red Wing to Zumbrota, Minnesota; and the Winona & Western, running from Osage, Iowa, to Winona, Minnesota, with a branch to Rochester. Soon the 26-mile gap from Zumbrota to Rochester was spanned, giving the CGW a north-and-south outlet to the latter town, subsequently made famous by the Mayo Clinc. (to be continued)
The band played on. In this undated photograph, railroad workers listen as rail-borne musicians in Union Army uniforms strike up an air. Road being built was St. Paul, Minneapolis & Manitoba, later to be part of Great Northern. Stretch of fill here was just outside Fort Assinaboine
Gentlemen …. find your turkeys!
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