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Third Avenue's Second-Hand Cars

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Third Avenue's Second-Hand Cars
Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, January 19, 2021 2:24 PM

1201-1225, built 1924, Osgood Bradley, wider than all other TARS-TATS cars. Square, non-tapered ends, bought 1933, used only on Webster Avenue.  1210 had one end damaged as was repaired wirh that end rapaired as in a regular homemade lightweight

More to come

 

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Posted by daveklepper on Wednesday, January 20, 2021 4:31 AM

No 1226 or 1227 that I know of.

1228 and 1229 similar to above, also Osgood Bradley, but normal TARs-TATS width and tapered ends.  Could be used wired-system-wide, but used mainly on Webster.  From Eau Claire, Wisconsin, Northern States Power Company:

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Posted by daveklepper on Wednesday, January 20, 2021 7:48 AM

1230-1239, ex San Antonio, Texas, Public Servive (3'-6" gauge) American Car. Co.:

161-163rd St. Crosstown:

 

Headed for Kingsbridge Carhouse at 225th & Broadway,  Mable Hill:

 

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Posted by MidlandMike on Wednesday, January 20, 2021 11:17 PM

Were the narrow gage cars the same size as the other cars?

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Posted by daveklepper on Thursday, January 21, 2021 6:05 AM

Yes.  I never knew they were narrow gauge untiil the data in the Siefried book was shown to me.

Similarly, the Los Angeles narrow-gauge, also 3' - 6," were standard width.

Washington, DC, were one-window shorter to fit the Georgetpwn carhouise transfer table, but I do not know about the Lost Angeles Railways PCCs.

 

 

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Posted by daveklepper on Thursday, January 21, 2021 7:34 AM

1250 was one St. Luis-built, ex-Kankakee & Urbana car, like 1201-1225 too wide for use other than the Webster & White Plains Av. "W" line.  Currently lacking a scanned photo, but identacle in appearance to 1201-1225 after the door arrangement was altered to the TARS-TATS usual practice.

1251-1256, American Car Co., ex=Lake Superior District Power Co., Ironwood, MI.

University Avenue Line "U," then used on the "C" Bronx and Van Courtland Parks, and on Bailey Avenue:

I thought 1251-1256 the best of the 1200s.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Posted by daveklepper on Friday, January 22, 2021 8:24 AM

Note  cars missing for numbers 1226 and 1227.  Whein I visited the Garden Avenue Yard for the first time at age 15 in 1947, I saw two derellict Connecticut Company steel car bodies.  I was told they had not been ovehauled and used because of too much rust.  They were gone by my next visit.  Possibly the two numbers were held for them in case their rehbilitation was necded?

1257 abd 1258 were from the Interstate Street Railway of Attleboro. Massachustts,  built by Wasoon.   Lacking scanned photo at the moment.

1259 was the first and somewhat exprimental Third Avenue home-built car. Hope to find an old negative for scanning for thid one. 

 

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Posted by daveklepper on Sunday, January 24, 2021 4:43 AM

The last three, 1260 - 1262, Brill, from Sunberry and Balinsgrove Ry.,  Balinsgrove, PA.  On University Avenue until it went bus, but occasionaly on Ogden:

Hope to find. scan, and post the missing pictures.

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Posted by daveklepper on Thursday, February 4, 2021 6:19 AM

Found my not-very-good photo showing the repaired damaged end of 1210.  Did the best I could with it and cleaned-up the photo posted earlier of the undamaged end:

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Posted by daveklepper on Thursday, February 4, 2021 3:08 PM

Another view of 1256 on Universoty Avednue

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Posted by daveklepper on Friday, February 26, 2021 7:38 AM

Note the difference, 1235 behind Kingsbridge carhouse:

1256:  12 regolar windoows and one small window

1235:   12 regular windows and a door de-activated.

The car originally had four double doors, b ut Third Avenue cars had a dounle entrance door and a single rear door.  1256 came that way

  

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Posted by daveklepper on Saturday, February 27, 2021 3:00 PM

Previous post corrected.

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Posted by daveklepper on Thursday, March 25, 2021 12:26 PM

An ex-San Antonio former narrow-gauge 1242 on the 161st & 163rd St. Crosstown on the ahort stretch of Jerome Avenue that stioll had strfeetcar tracks between 161st St. and the McCoombs Dam Bridge to 155th Street Manhattan, also used by Ogden Avenue cars:

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Posted by daveklepper on Sunday, April 18, 2021 4:00 AM

Here's 1210, the rebuilt end at the rear, southbound on Webster Avenue, north of Fordham Avenue, University, and Square, adjacent to the Third Avnue Elevated's junction for the branch to its Bronx Park Station and Terminal.

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, April 19, 2021 4:06 AM

And a little later 1252, formerly a University Avenue car, at the same spot:

 

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Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, April 20, 2021 9:46 AM

Improved the 1252  photo and found two others at the same spot.   Four second-hand 1200s, all different.

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Posted by daveklepper on Thursday, April 22, 2021 8:34 AM

1213 on Webster near Fordham and 1252 shown on Fordham, returning to the Kingsbridge Carhouse, with the Third Avenue elevated  and a 101-200-series Fordham-207th Street  streetcar in the background.

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Posted by daveklepper on Friday, April 23, 2021 2:20 AM

Not a very good photo, but it does show the rebuilt end of 1210 clearly.

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Posted by daveklepper on Sunday, April 25, 2021 9:29 AM

Another genuine Webster approaching Fordham Rd. from the north.  Background:  Ex-conduit-Manhattan 120. 130. or 140 northbound, and on the Elevated's center track, a train of Compsites, stored between rush hours.  Note open end train-door. 

  

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Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, February 8, 2022 11:42 AM

A somewhat better view of the rebuilt end of 1210, here northbound on Webster Avenue at Fordham Road:

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Posted by daveklepper on Sunday, May 1, 2022 4:11 AM

Another comparison of the two ends of 1210, both around the 241st Street Terminal of what is now the "2"  on the structure above.  Doesn't the door on the rebuilt end interrupting the letterboard, while the original doors on the original end do not, suggest the the  home-built lightweights were higherthan this group of second-hand cars?

 

Another second-hand car, one that served mostly on the "U" University Avenue Line, transferred to the "C" Bronx & Van COUrtlandt Line whan "U" went bus, here at West Farms Square.

 

 

 

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, July 25, 2022 12:33 AM

Two great photos fowarded by Nate Gerstein:

Richmond Railways, Staten Island, begin their truck-and-boat journey to Canada  in 19i24.

1245, westbound,  emerging from exhauusrt-fume-filled 161st Street Grand Concourse Underpass, with the Grand Palkace Hotel in the background:

 

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Posted by Joseph Frank on Monday, July 25, 2022 1:52 AM

Hello Dave

Your date and caption are incorrect on the PHOTO BELOW that you posted. .

These Staten Island Streetcars  were being shipped on 7-13- 1924 (not 1934) and were being shipped to (and sold to) CANADA --- NOT the Bronx.  The Cars to the Bronx were the Staten Island 400 series cars renumbered by TARS to 1200 series.  THOSE 400 series cars were shipped in 1934 to the Bronx via each being delivered by rail flat cars and car floats.

Nate, myself, Jack May and others are aware of this !

regards - Joe F

 

 

 

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, July 25, 2022 11:34 AM

Thanks for the correction.  I was using 2nd-hand information. Where in Canada?

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Posted by Joseph Frank on Monday, July 25, 2022 6:44 PM

Hello Dave ---

That Canadian move in 1924 for the ex-Staten Island/  Richmond Railway Co. streetcars of the 300 series -- was a hair just under 100 years ago --- and thus virtually no easily found info on WHAT town or city they went to in Canada,  turns up on any searches. Nor have I found it (other than "sold to Canada") in related publications.

PS: Since my post above, I see you corrected your data info on your earlier posting with the photo of 1924 with those S.I. streetcars and the Mack truck and flatbed trailer  ( JF)

Regards - Joe F

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Posted by daveklepper on Friday, July 29, 2022 8:07 AM

Some more corrections to 1245 at the Grand Concoursae  161st Street underpass portal, and Joe is welcome to post his version for comparison:

 

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Posted by MidlandMike on Friday, July 29, 2022 9:08 PM

daveklepper

Some more corrections to 1245 at the Grand Concoursae  161st Street underpass portal, and Joe is welcome to post his version for comparison:

 

When I saw Swiss Family Robinson on the movie marquee, I remembered the 1960 movie and wondered if it was photoshoped, but I see there was an earlier 1940 production. 

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Posted by Joseph Frank on Friday, July 29, 2022 10:49 PM

Hello Dave

I never did ANY corrections to that (E.161st St Photo) -- I ONLY posted the original crisp and clear version that my pal Nat G sent to you (and me) -- here it is again as it was originally sent to you by Nate G - BELOW: The paving and trolley tracks behind (to left, west of) the E/B TARS trolley are relatively sharp and distinguisable -- and the pipe rails on the raodway safety islands are all straight and sharp and not staggered - jagged looking on the safety island !  regards - Joe F

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Posted by daveklepper on Saturday, July 30, 2022 3:06 PM

I am happy to see the "original" posted.  The distortion in the "original," possibly because of some stretching or curling with time, or a scanning that is not accurate, is perfectly obvious when looking at the large aopartment building, left of the Grand Palace Hotel and right of the white gas satation.   The left side of the "original" leans to the left, but the right doesn't.   I did not loose any detail on the streetcar itself, and I believe my edited version is far closer to what was reality than the "original," if any scan can indeed be called an original.

The railings are not jagged in the last correction, and I must thank you for suggesting that correction.

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