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Number of Passenger journeys in UK 1.3 billion

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Posted by kbathgate on Saturday, May 21, 2011 3:25 PM

Old Foreigner

A.f.a. I know, they count it as three journeys. Therefore the overall number of journeys is grossly exaggerated in my opinion.

I don't think so.  I understand that 1 single ticket = 1 "journey", and most people planning a trip involving one or more changes will buy one ticket for the complete journey.  Of course there is inevitably a bit of double counting (e.g. some long distance passengers may buy separate tickets for short suburban hops at one or both ends of their journey), but I doubt if it is significant statistically.  In any event, I am sure that that also happened during the 1920s and WW2 as well, so the growth in passenger numbers referred to is certainly accurate.

 

However, this growth has been achieved at the cost of a massive increase in government subsidy over the last 15 years, and it is now more or less universally acknowledged that the privatisation of British Rail in the mid '90s spectacularly failed to achieve its main objectives (the main one of which was to cut costs).  An official report published this week concludes that equivalent European rail networks have costs around 30% lower than those of the UK (see http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-13446824).  IMHO the morals of these stories are: (1) more subsidy = more passengers, and (2) privatisation is no panacea.

 

Incidentally, yesterday was a sad day for British railfans as it is the very last day of restaurant car service in the UK.  When the summer weekday timetable commences on Monday the last operator to provide dining service (East Coast) will have replaced this with an onboard shop selling microwaved snacks, and complementary 'airline meals' for first class passengers.  When British Rail was privatised in 1995 there were still 249 weekday services with restaurant cars.  (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-13472676)

 

Keith Bathgate
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Posted by LNER4472 on Monday, May 16, 2011 4:52 PM

What is left out of the equation of "passenger profit" is that the TOCs (Train Operating Companies) franchise the rights to operate a route or region's operation, but that Network Rail, a government-owned quasi-public corporation, actually owns and maintains the infrastructure:

http://www.networkrail.co.uk/

In addition, some franchise packages mandated (at least when they started operation) that bidders had to take the "bad" with the "good;" there's simply no way that the remote passenger lines in rural Scotland or Wales, for example, will EVER be profitable, even at £4-a-litre petrol.

This arrangement makes it possible to say that the routes themselves turn a profit; however, inasmuch as Network Rail tries to operate like a for-profit, it usually ends up with public subsidies.  Part of the reason UK fares are among the highest in Europe (as my UK friends constantly like to remind me every chance they get) is that they have been striving to make the operations pay the actual cost of track infrastructure.  We're starting to see similar moves here in the States, with more toll highways or lanes, steep proposed toll increases, and increases in charges to Amtrak for the Northeast Corridor (Acela) and freight lines.  If they start assessing the riders of the Super Chief the real costs of maintaining the Raton Pass route between Trinidad and Albuquerque, for example........  all bets are off.

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Posted by Old Foreigner on Saturday, May 14, 2011 3:55 AM

A.f.a. I know, they count it as three journeys. Therefore the overall number of journeys is grossly exaggerated in my opinion.

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Posted by bedell on Friday, May 13, 2011 1:58 PM

My question is: what is a "Passenger Journey" ?  From our experiences of riding the rails in the UK, some trips could be pretty short - lots of changes en route to your final destination.  If you take three trains to get from point A to point B, is that one Passenger Journey or is it three?

 

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Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, May 12, 2011 9:41 PM

beaulieu

 aricat:

The BBC announced on their website that Passenger train journeys are 1.3 billion passengers. This is the most since 1928, except for World War II.Gas prices in the UK are around $11.50 a gallon,up $3.50 over 2006.The UK fares are the highest in Europe.Passengers rate service levels high. Are the politicans on this side of the pond noticing? British trains are run by private operators for profit.

 

Yes they are for profit, but only three mange to turn a profit without subsidy.

This sounds similar to the situation in Victoria, Australia, as well as other areas of Australia.  In Melbourne, which accounts for more than 75% of the population of Victoria, the trams, buses, and commuter rail operations were privatized.  They require government subsidies to make money, but when I lived there (1999 to 2004) most people agreed that they were more efficient under private opeators than the government.  

The private operators had to meet agreed upon performance standards or they forfeited a performance incentive payment.  More importantly, perhaps, if they consistently failed to perform, they could lose their contract.  There have been some changes in the arrangements over the years, but as far as I know, they are still operated by private operators. 

In addition to the aforementioned operations, VLine, which operates country trains in Victoria, was privatized.  And the Great Southern Railway, which operates the Indian Pacific, Ghan, and The Overland, is a private company.  They get government subsidies to make them whole, but they do a better job than was the case when the government ran them.  

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Posted by Dragoman on Thursday, May 12, 2011 8:58 PM

Doesn't he fact that any of them can turn a profit put the lie to the oft-repeated "truism" that passenger service can never make a profit??

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Posted by NittanyLion on Thursday, May 12, 2011 7:38 PM

The UK is also not much bigger than New York and Pennsylvania combined.

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Posted by beaulieu on Thursday, May 12, 2011 12:09 PM

aricat

The BBC announced on their website that Passenger train journeys are 1.3 billion passengers. This is the most since 1928, except for World War II.Gas prices in the UK are around $11.50 a gallon,up $3.50 over 2006.The UK fares are the highest in Europe.Passengers rate service levels high. Are the politicans on this side of the pond noticing? British trains are run by private operators for profit.

Yes they are for profit, but only three mange to turn a profit without subsidy.

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Number of Passenger journeys in UK 1.3 billion
Posted by aricat on Thursday, May 12, 2011 11:11 AM

The BBC announced on their website that Passenger train journeys are 1.3 billion passengers. This is the most since 1928, except for World War II.Gas prices in the UK are around $11.50 a gallon,up $3.50 over 2006.The UK fares are the highest in Europe.Passengers rate service levels high. Are the politicans on this side of the pond noticing? British trains are run by private operators for profit.

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