ChicagoRider This is a great idea. I think it would make a lot of intra-state runs more appealing.
This is a great idea. I think it would make a lot of intra-state runs more appealing.
This is a good idea on the surface however:
1. Do not convert any of the present Amfleet 1s until enough coaches are purchased to fill in the obvious demand for SL seats in the present trains. No one will know the demand for seats in 2013-2015.
2. When enough single level train cars are built and covering the demand then take part of each Amfleet 1 car that might be mothballed and install auto-matt/micro waveable food service cared for by one attendant that would also be responsible for 1 or more regular coach cars. This might take 24 - 32 seats out of the "restaurant" car for this use. Then if marketing studies show that not enough additional passengers are attracted then the converted cars can go into mothballs.
ConnDOT has not committed to any M-8 bar cars. This is bad because the old cars aren't compatible with the new M-8 cars.
The automat cars were an invention of SP that were detested by the advocacy crowd but they were closer to the needs of the customers actually using SP's trains than a full-service dining car. I would opine that an automat car with a single attendant would probably better suit some of the short-haul routes such as Chicago-Milwaukee (85 miles) and might get more customers than even a snack bar.
In the NYC metro area there is always a big political stink when the MTA talks about eliminating the bar cars on Metro-North which are currently on the New Haven line only. I seem to remember a similar service on the LIRR but I'm probably wrong about that one.
Before Amtrak there was an experiment on several roads with Auto-Mat cars. Back then passengers hated them, but I think today we'd accept them, but although I'm a fan of unions, railroad unions are embarrasingly terrible to the viability of passenger rail. They're really a real reason for the mass bankruptcies of the 1960s and 1970s and the formation of Conrail and Amtrak. Really!!
Speaking of concessions, I was pretty happy that soda cans on the NEC are now $1.75 instead of $2.00 during a recent trip.
The unions will undoubtably fight it tooth-and-nail, but NEC with automat (vending machine) cars would be a fantastic service for everyone who travels between NYC-WAS, PHL-BOS, and NYC-BOS, but I don't think WAS-BOS would appreciate it.
**EDIT** I was happy to notice that beer was $2 cheaper on Amtrak than airlines and hard liquor was exactly the same $6.
Amtrak tried this type of "concession" on the Empire Corridor between Albany and NYC about 3 or 4 years ago. A company signed up to provide sandwhich, pastries, snacks and beverages using its own manpower and supplies. The local Amtrak union objected and after physical threats to the company workers and damage to their personal autos, the concessionair withdrew. There has been no food service on the Albany - NYC route since. Once again passengers lose, but the Amtrak conductors now have half a car to call their own.
ALCO Fan
How much would the concession fees be?
Food service on trains has never been a profit center. Even in the heyday of rail travel, food service was provided as a service not for a profit. We all know what even the golden arches charges for things today...imagine what would have to be charged to make a profit after paying consession fees to the rail carrier to provide the service...most people traveling are looking to get from A to Z at minimum personal cost and if they have to starve a bit or bring their own food they will do it.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
bedell Exactly! Why not privatize dining car services as some states have allowed restaurant chains to operate rest stops on toll roads. The possibilities would be endless. Sort of Ronald McDonald meets Thomas the Tank Engine - the kids would love it. Perhaps Amtrak could save some money and some entrepreneurial types could make some money.
Exactly! Why not privatize dining car services as some states have allowed restaurant chains to operate rest stops on toll roads. The possibilities would be endless. Sort of Ronald McDonald meets Thomas the Tank Engine - the kids would love it. Perhaps Amtrak could save some money and some entrepreneurial types could make some money.
The biggest problem is there enough passengers to get enough restaurant revenue?.
However making a car half restaurant and half kids area; placing the play area at the rear of the car and train (could give kids a viewing area of the tracks and not require passengers to pass thru), Then place business class and quiet cars at front of train. This might really attract a lot of adults with children??
"Because that's the way we have always done it" and "If it ain't broke, don't fix it" have killed many businesses.
I have one more sentence I want to post here, but I can't figure out a way to say it that doesn't sound political, and that is not my intent.
Dave
Lackawanna Route of the Phoebe Snow
lattasnip9I was wondering that if Amtrak were ever to ease its costs on operating cars on the back of its trains, would it be possible to make an agreement with Amtrak to operate a restaurant car on the back of some shorter route trains? A few possible routes might be the Indianapolis-Chicago Hoosier State or the Boston-Portland (and soon to be Brunswick) Downeaster or other routes that do not have a formal dining service. Just an idea to think about that may increase the appeal for passenger rail. As it is, the travel time for between Indie and Chicago is about an hour longer than driving but I'm willing to believe that on board service will sway people from road to rail.
Sounds like a good idea. But I am not surprised at the negative reception on here for anything new, that shows imagination and breaks with the established, preexisting pattern.
C&NW, CA&E, MILW, CGW and IC fan
lattasnip9 Ah but to sway passengers from airliners to trains over a semi-short run, 2-3 hours, there needs to be some sort of appeal to passenger rail. Imagine during meal times if someone wants an omlette during morning runs or a hot sandwich during eveneing runs.
Ah but to sway passengers from airliners to trains over a semi-short run, 2-3 hours, there needs to be some sort of appeal to passenger rail. Imagine during meal times if someone wants an omlette during morning runs or a hot sandwich during eveneing runs.
Outside contracting of services probably conflicts with existing labor agreements. At any rate, anything more than a snack bar or in-seat services similar to the airlines would not be necessary on a short-haul run.
I bet you could make a Starbucks car work.
You want to get families out of their cars? Put on a car where children can play, out of the confinement of their seats. Have you ever been trapped for 8 hours in an automobile with 3 children between the ages of 2 and 6?
I was wondering that if Amtrak were ever to ease its costs on operating cars on the back of its trains, would it be possible to make an agreement with Amtrak to operate a restaurant car on the back of some shorter route trains? A few possible routes might be the Indianapolis-Chicago Hoosier State or the Boston-Portland (and soon to be Brunswick) Downeaster or other routes that do not have a formal dining service. Just an idea to think about that may increase the appeal for passenger rail. As it is, the travel time for between Indie and Chicago is about an hour longer than driving but I'm willing to believe that on board service will sway people from road to rail. Would this be breaching Amtrak's monopoly status?
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