Meanwhile in California: HSR suffers another setback?

845 views
12 replies
1 rating 2 rating 3 rating 4 rating 5 rating
  • Member since
    June 2003
  • From: South Central,Ks
  • 6,629 posts
Meanwhile in California: HSR suffers another setback?
Posted by samfp1943 on Tuesday, August 11, 2020 10:03 AM

Within the last week, a series of stories have come out in the press:(ie)  "Report:   Series of errors botched California bridge project" by Los Angeles Times : Monday Aug 10.2020

 

 

 


 

  • Member since
    January 2019
  • From: Henrico, VA
  • 5,073 posts
Posted by Flintlock76 on Tuesday, August 11, 2020 11:15 AM

Maybe it's the cynic in me, but I'm wondering if this project might just have the aspects of a criminal enterprise?

Kind of like the Long Island Expressway in New York, a work in progress for decades but never finished?  

  • Member since
    September 2017
  • 3,538 posts
Posted by charlie hebdo on Tuesday, August 11, 2020 12:19 PM

Part of the problem was Trump withholding money already committed to the project. 

 

 

 

  • Member since
    September 2003
  • From: California - moved to North Carolina 2018
  • 4,286 posts
Posted by DSchmitt on Tuesday, August 11, 2020 12:46 PM

charlie hebdo

Part of the problem was Trump withholding money already committed to the project. 

 

 

Problem for the project, but not the cause of  bad engineering, work damage, etc. 

I tried to sell my two cents worth, but no one would give me a plug nickel for it.

I don't have a leg to stand on.

  • Member since
    September 2003
  • 12,819 posts
Posted by Overmod on Tuesday, August 11, 2020 4:40 PM

charlie hebdo
Part of the problem was Trump withholding money already committed to the project. 

The actual problem was California claiming it would not spend that 'money' on high-speed rail but was entitled to keep it anyway.

I am not a Trump fan but he has shown more restraint on that scam than I would.

  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: US
  • 19,162 posts
Posted by BaltACD on Tuesday, August 11, 2020 4:42 PM

Overmod
 
charlie hebdo
Part of the problem was Trump withholding money already committed to the project.  

The actual problem was California claiming it would not spend that 'money' on high-speed rail but was entitled to keep it anyway.

I am not a Trump fan but he has shown more restraint on that scam than I would.

Tell an engineer that he has half the funds necessary to fulfill the specs for a job and they will still attempt to complete the task with the funds that ARE available.

  • Member since
    September 2017
  • 3,538 posts
Posted by charlie hebdo on Tuesday, August 11, 2020 5:48 PM

BaltACD

 

 
Overmod
 
charlie hebdo
Part of the problem was Trump withholding money already committed to the project.  

The actual problem was California claiming it would not spend that 'money' on high-speed rail but was entitled to keep it anyway.

I am not a Trump fan but he has shown more restraint on that scam than I would.

 

Tell an engineer that he has half the funds necessary to fulfill the specs for a job and they will still attempt to complete the task with the funds that ARE available.

 

I wonder if you would have *completed* your job if your salary had been drastically cut? 

  • Member since
    January 2019
  • From: Henrico, VA
  • 5,073 posts
Posted by Flintlock76 on Tuesday, August 11, 2020 6:53 PM

Don't forget the other scams, i.e. environmental impact study after environmental impact study after environmental impact study after environmental impact study after environmental impact study...

Talk about a protection racket!

If Al Capone were alive he'd be green with envy.  "Jeez, I wish I'd a thought o' that!"  

  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: US
  • 19,162 posts
Posted by BaltACD on Tuesday, August 11, 2020 7:38 PM

charlie hebdo
 
BaltACD 
Overmod 
charlie hebdo
Part of the problem was Trump withholding money already committed to the project.  

The actual problem was California claiming it would not spend that 'money' on high-speed rail but was entitled to keep it anyway.

I am not a Trump fan but he has shown more restraint on that scam than I would. 

Tell an engineer that he has half the funds necessary to fulfill the specs for a job and they will still attempt to complete the task with the funds that ARE available. 

I wonder if you would have *completed* your job if your salary had been drastically cut? 

Engineers live to see their creations completed, however, they have to bring them to completion.

Fortunately I never got caught in those circumstance, that being said my father got caught in serious salary reduction account economic conditions in 1959 when there were concurrent Miner, Auto worker and Steel worker strikes that virtually gutted the traffic from the B&O and his salary was reduced 25%.  He continued to do his job to the best of his abilities.

  • Member since
    June 2009
  • From: Dallas, TX
  • 4,687 posts
Posted by CMStPnP on Tuesday, August 11, 2020 10:15 PM

Overmod
The actual problem was California claiming it would not spend that 'money' on high-speed rail but was entitled to keep it anyway. I am not a Trump fan but he has shown more restraint on that scam than I would.

To be fair it was not a Trump restriction it was an Obama condition for accepting the money in the first place.    Republican Ray LaHood who supervised the HSR grants under Obama was the guy that wrote in the strict provisions of the grants.   The grants turn into loans if they are not applied directly to HSR (they also could not be diverted to non-rail passenger usage) and/or the HSR project does not meet it's original project date to be up and running.    Illinois was subject to the exact same terms on the money it accepted for Chicago to St. Louis...........Michigan the same deal for money accepted for Chicago to Detroit.     Trump is just enforcing the provisions that were laid out before the grant was accepted.    You can get this info via Trains Magazine (past issues) or via Google.

Illinois had to steeply raise taxes to complete it's contribution for Chicago to St. Louis but also needed to seek a waiver due to the equipment snafu (which it obtained).    California under Newsome was not even going to apply for a waiver, instead he copped an attitude the money was in his hands now and there was nothing the Feds could do..........he never bothered to read the terms of the grant or he would not have given that impression publicly.    That is what got California in trouble to begin with over the funds and the dispute with the Trump administration.   Because the terms are the grant reverts to a loan to be paid back to the Feds if the state deviates from the intended usage of the funds or does not complete the project on the specified timeline.

  • Member since
    January 2019
  • 634 posts
Posted by Erik_Mag on Tuesday, August 11, 2020 10:21 PM

The "cables snapping" and other problems reminds me of the issues with the eastern portion of the Bay Bridge and the replacement for the Transbay Transit Terminal. My impression is that the state government is having a lot of issues managing large civil engineering projects.

  • Member since
    June 2009
  • From: Dallas, TX
  • 4,687 posts
Posted by CMStPnP on Tuesday, August 11, 2020 10:24 PM

Erik_Mag
My impression is that the state government is having a lot of issues managing large civil engineering projects.

I also got that impression when I read XPress West was going to build solo to Las Vegas instead of a partially shared ROW with the states HSR project.   Seems like XPress West wants nothing to do with California's project.

  • Member since
    December 2007
  • From: Georgia USA SW of Atlanta
  • 9,942 posts
Posted by blue streak 1 on Tuesday, August 11, 2020 11:27 PM

Read the LA times report willlink later.  IMHO a lot has to do with the ongoing inspectors notdoing their jobs because 1.  Not enough inspectors. 2. A detailed job inspetion of critical items given to the inspectors.   This poster got caught in that bind.  The post tensioning of the bridge is very importat to prevent what happen at FIU.

The cables were stored out doors and got wet starting corrison.  The conduits that the cables were to be placed were not kept closed allowing water to get in the tubes.  The tubes failed a pressure test before cable insertation.  Dry air or maybe nitrogen was not applied thru tube to clear any moisture .

As for the temporary steel supports and their wire cross bracing breaking ? ?

https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2020-08-10/california-bullet-train-bridge-snafu 

https://www.rtands.com/passenger/contractors-for-high-speed-rail-project-in-california-screw-up/ 

Join our Community!

Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account.

Search the Community

Newsletter Sign-Up

By signing up you may also receive occasional reader surveys and special offers from Trains magazine.Please view our privacy policy