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Amtrak and NS going to war with each other

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Amtrak and NS going to war with each other
Posted by blue streak 1 on Sunday, March 17, 2019 8:16 PM

WSJ article that has NS demanding that Amtrak quit listing tweets about the delays happening on NS.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/amtrak-and-freight-railroad-clash-over-tweets-and-train-delays-11552836755?shareToken=stcb3f352e6829476b860bf19d1db10da3&mod=share_mobilewebshare

For those of you needing the tweet link here it is!

https://twitter.com/AmtrakAlerts

 

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Posted by PNWRMNM on Sunday, March 17, 2019 8:50 PM

As J. J. O'Driscoll used to say "Its a strange bird that shits in its own nest".

ATK is far beyond strange bird status.

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Monday, March 18, 2019 6:52 AM

PNWRMNM

As J. J. O'Driscoll used to say "Its a strange bird that shits in its own nest".

ATK is far beyond strange bird status.

 

PNWRMNM

As J. J. O'Driscoll used to say "Its a strange bird that shits in its own nest".

ATK is far beyond strange bird status.

 
Are you suggesting that Amtrak should keep its mouth shut and put up with the delays??
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Posted by charlie hebdo on Monday, March 18, 2019 9:00 AM

Is J.J. O'Driscoll real?

Since PNWRMNM (probably a so-called libertarian) hates Amtrak and government, his remarks about Amtrak are about as useful as the supposed quotation from Mr. O'Driscoll.


 

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Posted by oltmannd on Monday, March 18, 2019 10:19 AM

It's not polite to air other people's dirty laundry in public.  

The reasons for delays that the conductor enters into his hand-held device are his (and the engineer's) opinion.  Amtrak meets with the host roads to review the reported delays on a regular basis.

It might not be a good idea to tweet so much about who's to blame for what.  Providing info about the delay and expected ETA's is a good idea, though.

-Don (Random stuff, mostly about trains - what else? http://blerfblog.blogspot.com/

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Monday, March 18, 2019 10:59 AM

Looks like the Wall Street Journal article can't be read unless you're a subscriber, at least the link doesn't work for me.

No biggie.  Here's the thing, when something is your fault, you acknowledge the fault, you fix the fault, and you do your best to try and make sure it doesn't happen again.

When something's NOT your fault, i.e. Amtraks poor on-time performance due to freight train interference it makes no sense to take the blame, although I'd think anyone traveling Amtrak should realize FTI can be part of the problem and accept the fact, as long as it's not too outrageous. 

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Posted by PNWRMNM on Monday, March 18, 2019 7:25 PM

CSSHEGEWISCH
Are you suggesting that Amtrak should keep its mouth shut and put up with the delays??

Yes. What is the point of ATK whining? Really.

They are getting a free ride by paying far less than market value for the capacity they consume.

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Posted by zugmann on Monday, March 18, 2019 7:49 PM

Flintlock76
Looks like the Wall Street Journal article can't be read unless you're a subscriber, at least the link doesn't work for me.

Basically: NS didn't like Amtk tweeting that the delay was caused by a NS freight train interference.

So now Amtrak just says freight train interference.  It's up to the passengers to look out the window to see what color the freight engines sharing the line are.

It's been fun.  But it isn't much fun anymore.   Signing off for now. 


  

The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.t fun any

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Posted by BaltACD on Monday, March 18, 2019 9:01 PM

zugmann
 
Flintlock76
Looks like the Wall Street Journal article can't be read unless you're a subscriber, at least the link doesn't work for me. 

Basically: NS didn't like Amtk tweeting that the delay was caused by a NS freight train interference.

So now Amtrak just says freight train interference.  It's up to the passengers to look out the window to see what color the freight engines sharing the line are.

A part of my position before retirement was to work with the 'Amtrak Clerk' concerning delays - the Amtrak Clerk would be in possession of the delays as reported by the Amtrak Conductors and then try to correlate those reported delays to delays observed on the Amtrak Train's trainsheet (CSX developed a computer application to overlay one upon the other).  Many times when the Amtrak train was having its own mechanical issues, the Amtrak Conductors would report the delay as 'freight train interference'.

A least when I was working, CSX tried to the Amtrak 'passenger preference' within our guidelines of operation, that doesn't mean that Amtrak ALWAYS got preference but they were given breaks over most CSX trains - a UPS train running to make the crew's HOS time, with no recrew available, would get preference over Amtrak.

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Posted by Deggesty on Monday, March 18, 2019 9:09 PM

zugmann

 

 
Flintlock76
Looks like the Wall Street Journal article can't be read unless you're a subscriber, at least the link doesn't work for me.

 

Basically: NS didn't like Amtk tweeting that the delay was caused by a NS freight train interference.

So now Amtrak just says freight train interference.  It's up to the passengers to look out the window to see what color the freight engines sharing the line are.

 

And if the engine they see is a foreign engine they still may not know what road is responsible--unless they know just where they are.

Johnny

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Posted by blue streak 1 on Tuesday, March 19, 2019 3:12 PM

Would like to see Amtrak post CSX freight train interferrence when it is the delay at Howell CP in Atlanta.

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Posted by runnerdude48 on Thursday, March 21, 2019 9:26 AM

zugmann
So now Amtrak just says freight train interference.  It's up to the passengers to look out the window to see what color the freight engines sharing the line are.

I don't think that the average passenger really cares whose fault it is, they just want to get where they are going on time or close to it.  I just returned from a trip to Philadelphia via Acela Express.  We left Penn Station about 3 minutes late and were nearly 20 minutes late by Stamford, all because of Metro North delays.  But, there were no mentions of that on the Amtrak Alerts page.  They normally report "commuter train congestion" or "track work" as reasons on Metro North so why do they name the freight railroads?

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Posted by blue streak 1 on Monday, March 25, 2019 1:58 AM

Here is a NARP post that has copy of Amtrak's letter responding to NS.  Someone who knows NS schedule tell us about 21M.

https://www.railpassengers.org/happening-now/news/blog/amtrak-takes-the-fight-against-delays-online/ 

However still could not find that 20/24 exceeded 60 MPH ATL - CLT

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Posted by oltmannd on Monday, March 25, 2019 2:36 PM

blue streak 1

Here is a NARP post that has copy of Amtrak's letter responding to NS.  Someone who knows NS schedule tell us about 21M.

https://www.railpassengers.org/happening-now/news/blog/amtrak-takes-the-fight-against-delays-online/ 

However still could not find that 20/24 exceeded 60 MPH ATL - CLT

 

21M is the old Conrail/PC/PRR Mail8.  Premium intermodal.  Runs Croxton, NJ to Chicago Englewood.  Scheduled crew change at Conway PA at 10PM.  Scheduled arrival at Englewood, 10AM.  Capitol Ltd. is scheduled to pass this train en route, departing Pittsburgh about midnight, arriving Chicago at 8:45 AM.

NS can't really mess with 21Ms schedule commercially.  The only real solution is to set the Capitol back a couple hours or ahead a couple hours to eliminate the planned pass.

-Don (Random stuff, mostly about trains - what else? http://blerfblog.blogspot.com/

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Posted by blue streak 1 on Thursday, March 28, 2019 1:39 PM

AMTRAK named NS again today.

 

 

 

Crescent Train 19 that departed New York (NYP) on 3/27 is currently stopped south of Atlanta (ATL) due to a disabled Norfolk Southern freight train blocking the tracks ahead. We will update as more information becomes available.

The NS delays come because of the great increase of freight traffic on the line.  We remember that a few years back the FRA or DOT predicted this route is one of the routes expected to see a large increase of traffic.  Do not believe that included the Meridian speedway traffic but could be wrong.

NS is improving the route but no one has really listed the projects being done.  Especially more sidings, longer sidings ( 16 - 18k would seem appropriate ), connecting sidings for more 2 MT operations,  higher speed turnouts?   

One helpful item might be shortening up dispatcher zones giving them more time to plan meets and run  arounds. Run arounds may be impossible due to level of traffic ? Only more 2 MT would partially fix that  problem ?

Another solution that we could never expect would be place flying repair crews especially car men, signal, and loco techs at strategic locations to mitigate breakdowns of what ever flavor ?  They also could when not attending a breakdown observer trains preventing a break down of long duration,   Any idea of the present spacing of techs on this NS route ?

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Posted by BaltACD on Thursday, March 28, 2019 4:06 PM

blue streak 1
AMTRAK named NS again today.

 

 

 

Crescent Train 19 that departed New York (NYP) on 3/27 is currently stopped south of Atlanta (ATL) due to a disabled Norfolk Southern freight train blocking the tracks ahead. We will update as more information becomes available.

The NS delays come because of the great increase of freight traffic on the line.  We remember that a few years back the FRA or DOT predicted this route is one of the routes expected to see a large increase of traffic.  Do not believe that included the Meridian speedway traffic but could be wrong.

NS is improving the route but no one has really listed the projects being done.  Especially more sidings, longer sidings ( 16 - 18k would seem appropriate ), connecting sidings for more 2 MT operations,  higher speed turnouts?   

One helpful item might be shortening up dispatcher zones giving them more time to plan meets and run  arounds. Run arounds may be impossible due to level of traffic ? Only more 2 MT would partially fix that  problem ?

Another solution that we could never expect would be place flying repair crews especially car men, signal, and loco techs at strategic locations to mitigate breakdowns of what ever flavor ?  They also could when not attending a breakdown observer trains preventing a break down of long duration,   Any idea of the present spacing of techs on this NS route ?

Think PSR and how it affects support personnel and watch your flying squads poof away.  When such equipment and personnel exist, they are generally 2 hours or more away from wherever the trouble is - getting to the trouble and making a repair that gets the troubled train moving can be several more hours.

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Posted by blue streak 1 on Friday, March 29, 2019 7:32 PM

Another NS delay between Austell and Howell in ATL for 20/28.  Then was 6 hours late leaving ATL now 11 + hours late approaching ALX.

 

UPDATE: Crescent Train 20 which departed New Orleans (NOL) on 3/28 is currently operating about 6 hr late due to a servicing delay, signal issues, and a disabled Norfolk Southern Freight Train south of Atlanta (ATL).

 

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Posted by blue streak 1 on Tuesday, April 2, 2019 11:51 AM

And the beat goes on and the beat goes on.

 

Crescent Train 20 which departed New Orleans (NOL) on 4/1 is currently stopped east of Anniston (ATN) due to a disabled Norfolk Southern Freight Train in its path. Updates to follow as more information becomes available.

Next:

 

Crescent Train 20 which departed New Orleans (NOL) on 4/1 is now on the move currently operating about 5hr late due to a disabled Norfolk Southern Freight Train in its path east of Anniston (ATN).

NEXT:

20/01 arrived so late in ATL (arrived at 01:41.) 19/01 arrived on time ATL but crew from inbound 20/01 had to wait for HOS to take 19/01 on south out of ATL at 10:21.

 

 

Crescent Train 19 will hold in Atlanta (ATL) for about 1 hour due to a delayed change in crew.

Actually left 1:43 late from ATL.

 

 

UPDATE: Train 19 which departed which departed New York on 4/1 that was holding in Atlanta (ATL) is back on the move operating about 1 hour 40 minutes late. Thank you for your patience during this delay.

 

 

Note: AMTRAK has no crews based in ATL.

 

 

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Posted by BaltACD on Tuesday, April 2, 2019 12:00 PM

blue streak 1

 

Crescent Train 19 will hold in Atlanta (ATL) for about 1 hour due to a delayed change in crew.

Actually left 1:43 late from ATL.

 

 

UPDATE: Train 19 which departed which departed New York on 4/1 that was holding in Atlanta (ATL) is back on the move operating about 1 hour 40 minutes late. Thank you for your patience during this delay.

 

 

Note: AMTRAK has no crews based in ATL.

Suspect the 'crew delay' is in Amtrak getting a recrew in place from their crew base.  My experience is that Amtrak doesn't keep close tabs on their crew's HOS status and are not 'proactive' in getting recrews in place to avoid delays.

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Posted by Deggesty on Tuesday, April 2, 2019 1:00 PM

Back when NS was having trouble getting Amtrak trains from New York and Washington into Chicago, I boarded #5 at the proper time--and we left more than two hours late so passengers from #29 and #49 could transfer. The crews in Lincoln were  called for on time departure; we left Lincoln about five hours late--and had to be recrewed before we got out of Nebraska.

Johnny

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Posted by blue streak 1 on Tuesday, April 2, 2019 9:43 PM

20 arrived ATL at 0141.  19 left ATL at 1021.  Exactly 8:40 certainly sounds like an HOS break?  Crew needs a full break to operate all the way to Meridian.

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Posted by BaltACD on Tuesday, April 2, 2019 10:33 PM

blue streak 1
20 arrived ATL at 0141.  19 left ATL at 1021.  Exactly 8:40 certainly sounds like an HOS break?  Crew needs a full break to operate all the way to Meridian.

Is Atlanta a 'designated' crew terminal?  A little education on the Hours of Service Law.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/49/appendix-A_to_part_228

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Posted by oltmannd on Wednesday, April 3, 2019 10:24 AM

Meridian and Charlotte.  Atlanta is "away from home" terminal.

-Don (Random stuff, mostly about trains - what else? http://blerfblog.blogspot.com/

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