due to the 101 closed near santa barber surfliners are overwhelmed. Reports of 500 persons at one station for a north bound. All amtrak trains filled to crush capacity. 3 extra locos and 8 california capitol and san jaoquin train cars were sent on Amtrak 11 to add capacity to the So Cal trains. Capitol corridor announced that their trains will be overcrowed until cars can be returned.
This is another example that when new Amtrak cars are delivered that the semi-retired Horizons, AM-2s & -1s need to be assigned to standby disaster & crush duty and not be retired. IMO there needs to be a storage facility built somewhere in the mid-west for the times that the need is determined. That location can dispatch equipment the quickest. Alternatively two locations somewhere outside the west coast earthquake zones and in mid atlantic states.
Sorry cannot post link as not on regular puter
At Glendale Sunday morning two Surfliner trains had nine cars each. The news anchor on KEYT (Santa Barbara TV) has been taking the Surfliner into work from Oxnard. He said the extra cars significantly reduced overcrowding yesterday.
081552At Glendale Sunday morning two Surfliner trains had nine cars each. The news anchor on KEYT (Santa Barbara TV) has been taking the Surfliner into work from Oxnard. He said the extra cars significantly reduced overcrowding yesterday.
Extra capacity is fine! Who finances and pays for it? Even Amtrak 'tries to run as a business'. Their business model doesn't call for keeping excess equipment on the property for 'needs' that may be a one time occurence that may never happen. No business can operate on that basis.
Once the other forms of transportation have recovered there will be no more need for the extra cars on the Surfliners; who will pay for keeping those extra cars around until they, if ever, are needed again?
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
You may not need something as dire as a mudslide blocking a main highway. Just look at the travel demand during Thanksgiving and Christmas time, as well as during other events to warrant extra rolling stock.
A McIntoshYou may not need something as dire as a mudslide blocking a main highway. Just look at the travel demand during Thanksgiving and Christmas time, as well as during other events to warrant extra rolling stock.
How much are you willing to pay so that you have extra capacity for two weekends out of a year - nominally 10 days of the 365 days that comprise the year. Capacity costs money, real money, real money that may be better invested in something that gets used for the 365 days of the year.
Few passenger operations in the United States have enough extra cars in their fleets to contribute to a national reserve capacity. If such a reserve fleet would be in normal daily service, how do you address disruptions in their normal service area that would occur when the cars are re-assigned for emergency service?
Message from the Managing Director Regarding Service Assistance to the Pacific Surfliner Travel
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Managing DirectorCapitol Corridor Joint Powers Authority
Dear Passengers,
As most of you are aware, there was a devastating mudslide in Santa Barbara County earlier this week due to heavy rains that fell in the areas burned last month by the Thomas Fire. The mudslide sadly resulted in at least 17 deaths, many more injuries, and has isolated communities between Santa Barbara and Ventura because of the closure of US Highway 101. Our “sister” service in this area, the Pacific Surfliner route (San Diego-LA-Santa Barbara-San Luis Obispo) resumed service last week. With the closure of Highway 101 in the Montecito area, the Pacific Surfliner is the only surface transportation option connecting the Santa Barbara region with the Los Angeles Basin. As a result, the Pacific Surfliner trains are experiencing severe over-crowding (standee conditions) and in some cases, hundreds of passengers have been left stranded on the platforms as trains cannot accommodate these people.
On Friday evening, I was contacted by the California State Transportation Agency (CalSTA) requesting the CCJPA’s assistance to temporarily transfer some intercity passenger rail (IPR) vehicles from the Northern California fleet for use on an emergency basis for the Pacific Surfliner service. As the CCJPA is the agency responsible for the use and assignment of IPR vehicles in the Northern California fleet, I agreed to the request and immediately began to coordinate with the CCJPA, San Joaquin JPA, and Amtrak transportation and mechanical staff to determine which vehicles could be temporarily made available for the Pacific Surfliner service.
Within a few hours, I authorized the temporary transfer of three locomotives and eight cars from the Northern California IPR fleet to Southern California. These vehicles will be removed from the Capitol Corridor and San Joaquin services starting today, Saturday, January 13, and will be used on Surfliner trains to help accommodate passengers needing to travel through the Santa Barbara area while Highway 101 is closed. We expect the Northern California IPR vehicles will be returned to Northern California on Saturday, January 20.
The assistance we are providing to our colleagues and friends in Southern California will result in one less car on two trainsets assigned to the Capitol Corridor’s weekday rotation. As a result, you may notice that some Capitol Corridor trains are more crowded, with fewer empty seats. We are managing the rotation and assignment of these shorter trainsets so we can minimize the impact to our more crowded peak travel trains. Please note that it will be especially important for everyone to be patient and courteous and observe our “One Ticket, One Seat” policy. Do not hesitate to ask one of the conductors for assistance if you need help finding an empty seat or a place to store your bags or bicycle. We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause. As I mentioned above, the CCJPA and our service partners in Northern California did not hesitate to authorize this humanitarian assistance. We are confident that each and every Capitol Corridor passenger would agree with our decision. It is in times like this when communities must come together and help each other out. I am proud that the CCJPA is able to put our mission into action and help bridge the transportation need in Southern California during this challenging time.
We are grateful for your support and patience, and as always, thank you for riding the Capitol Corridor.
Sincerely
Unconfirmed reports that CA surfline is closed again. Checking Inter city rail map all trains showing service disruptions around various stations between Irvine & Oceanside
Here is link just found
Travel Advisories | Pacific Surfliner
This is only in San Clemente, due to 'debris falling on the tracks'.
Cancellations in effect again. Amtrak would have had a much better showing for FY 2023 if not for all the cancellation that year.
Amtrak Advisory | Service Temporarily Disrupted Between Los Angles and San Diego
Amtrak really needs to do something about those "acts of God". (sarcasm)
Would have been nice to have some of the money spent on the Cal HSR going instead to replacing the route through San Clemente. The Surf line has been closed down for extended periods a number of times over the couple of decades.
The Del Mar bluffs have been an issue at times, but not to the extent that the bluffs in San Clemente have been.
It was interesting to note that someone on the pedestrian walkway was trying to warn people of the bluuff collase in progress but was ignored by many.
Walkway was taken out.
Halt to train service through San Clemente is indefinite following new landslide (msn.com)
Landslide in San Clemente disrupts train service between OC and San Diego (msn.com)
Landslide in San Clemente damages bridge and halts train service (msn.com)
Landslide in San Clemente halts train service indefinitely - Los Angeles Times (latimes.com)
Masriposa bridge damage
california mariposa railroaad bridge - Search Images (bing.com)
You know I look at these pictures and I see a lot of urban development right up until the edge of the problematic cliffs that are collapsing. Now I get it that some of this is due to climate change and wave action on the beach but not all of it. Guess who is not properly managing urban development in the Southern part of the state? This is recent urban development too not something that has been there years and years.
State lawmakers getting worried about Lossan loosing too many passenger trips 2019 over 8M and now less than 4M.
CA: Could increased state intervention improve local rail service? | Mass Transit (masstransitmag.com)
NOTE this is 5th time shut down for landslides.
According to the first link freight service just started. But there is still movement of the hillside. Several points that the line is still in some of a peril. The next wave of storms coming may cause other landslides?
San Clemente Landslide Update; Upcoming Storm System, Continued Hillside Movement - Railway Track and Structures (rtands.com)
LOSSAN Rail Corridor Awarded $53 Million - Railway Track and Structures (rtands.com)
blue streak 1But there is still movement of the hillside
Note the houses right up on the edge there. That as much as wave action has an impact on erosion and landslides. Though it is rarely mentioned in articles.
Another atmospheric 'river' is expected to hit the West Coast over the weekend.
Correction, the first wave of the river is supposed to be hitting NorCal as I type this and SoCal early tomorrow (Thursday) morning. Second wave is supposed to hit Monday.
Overall, the storm damage hasn't been horrendously bad, taking note that parts of San Diego were flooded in the last storm. We dodged a bullet in 1980, with a week and a half of one storm after another. There was one forecast storm that had the decency not to show up, as the biggest reservoir feeding the San Diego river was about to spill adding 100+ sq miles to the active watershed. The fear was that the resulting flood would take out the Surf Line and the I-5 bridges across the San Diego river.
Worst storm in San Diego history was 1916, which took out a number of miles of track.
Building houses near the edge of the seaside bluffs is not a good idea. Building tracks near the edge of seaside bluffs was not a good idea either.
The points made earlier about housing development atop the bluffs are valid. Whether the weight of the homes, patios, or swimming pools themselves is a factor or not, someone else can delve into that. But irrigation of landscaping is a documented concern, with rules now in place to try and limit it:
https://documents.coastal.ca.gov/reports/2020/10/W12c/W12c-10-2020-report.pdf
Some interesting quotes from the above link:
"The coastal bluffs in San Clemente are not subject to direct wave attack due to either a roadway or the OCTA railroad tracks and a rock revetment protecting the railroad separating the surf zone from the base of the bluffs. However, it is the nature of bluffs to erode. Though currently not subject to direct wave attack, the San Clemente coastal bluffs are subject to natural erosion caused by other factors such as wind and rain, adverse bedding orientations, soils conducive to erosion and rodent burrowing. Bluffs are also subject to erosion from human activities, such as irrigation, improper site drainage and grading. Bluff failure can be episodic, and bluffs that seem stable now may not be so in the future."
Last year I began noticing reports of beach loss not so much due to sea level rise but more due to loss of sand that used to drain into the coastal waters from creeks and rivers. Many of which are now lined in whole or in part by concrete, and many of which have seen reduced outflows during recent drought years. Plus the presence of the rail line and its roadbed, which is known to be blocking the flow of naturally-eroded cliff/bluff sand into the ocean.
https://www.bringbackourbeaches.com/san-clemente-sand-system-1
https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2022-09-27/landslide-sand-loss-threaten-railway-homes-in-san-clemente
Erik_Mag mentioned some of the heavy rain and flooding that impacted this area in the not-so-distant past. I'll conclude with the following points that were included in a larger piece I wrote for another publication:
Osgood’s choice for passage through the coastal mountains was Temecula Canyon, northeast of Oceanside, Calif. Local residents were quick to warn him that periods of heavy rain had been known to swell the canyon’s riverbed into a raging torrent. By simply grading above the high water marks that were etched in the sandstone walls, Osgood felt confident he could lay track beyond the reach of any conceivable flood.
Less than a year later, in January 1883, a storm that dumped three inches of rain in San Diego in a single day left the line through Temecula Canyon in shambles. Ties and bridge timbers were literally washed out to sea. It took eleven months to restore the route to service. The canyon was hit by more flooding in February 1884, so it was no surprise when work was begun in 1886 on an alternate route that would continue up the coast from Oceanside toward a more reliable connection with the Santa Fe main line. After two years of drought, heavy rains devastated Temecula Canyon again in February 1891. The Santa Fe was granted permission to abandon the canyon trackage in 1896. But the weather woes didn’t end there. Southern California endured cycles of drought and flood over the next several years, with most of the region’s reservoirs nearly empty by 1915. January 1916 changed all of that by delivering a straight week of heavy rain, which wiped out some two-dozen bridges on Santa Fe’s route to San Diego.
With respect tp cliff/bluff failures:
Coastal San Diego county and the southern part of coastal Orange County are sitting on a thick layer of sandstone, so it doesn't take much in terms of wave action to disturb the bluffs. In some ways, the residents of the southern half of coastal San Clemente should be glad that the Surf Line runs next to their property as the rip-rap protecting the track also keeps the surf away from the base of the bluffs.
I've read a number of news reports about landscape irrigation being a significant if not the primary cause of bluff failures. An example is Moonlight Beach in Encinitas were ongoing efforts have been made to keep enough sand for a usable beach which would protect the cliffs from wave action. There have been at least two incidents where people have been killled by a bluff collapse - note that the Surf Line is about 4 blocks inland, so vibrations from trains is unlikely to be a cause.
One possible fix for the San Clemente and Del Mar problem areas would be a sea wall, but the state Coastal Commision doesn't want sea walls. I'd be curious if the STB could override the Coastal Commission on protecting the lines.
Note to Bruce: One of my co-workers grew up in T.O., we have fun exchanging stories about the place such as telling him about sheep being herded over what's now TOHS.
Erik, TO goes waaaaay back for me. It was the first place my family moved to in CA when we left Spokane in the late 1960s. But we eventually ended up in El Toro (now called Lake Forest) before I was done with grade school. And that's where I discovered trains. On the Surf Line, no less. Weird to think that 2024 marks 40 years since I left SoCal behind. So much of it is still remembered like it happened just yesterday, even the days of bloody-nosed/pointless-arrow Es or Fs leading San Diegans down single track comprised of jointed rails.
With all the rain forecast over the next few days Amtrak will be lucky if no additional mud slides happen.
Weather service predicting highest level of flooding. As well Donnor may get 5+ feet of snow.
Highest Flood Risk Warning Issued By Weather Prediction Center - Videos from The Weather Channel
blue streak 1Weather service predicting highest level of flooding. As well Donnor may get 5+ feet of snow. Highest Flood Risk Warning Issued By Weather Prediction Center - Videos from The Weather Channel
Have seen articles where the snow pack in Northern California has not benefited from the atmospheric rivers this year and more snow is needed.
Situation is getting worse with freights being cancelled as well.
Continued Slope Movement Halts Freight Traffic in San Clemente - Railway Track and Structures (rtands.com)
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