Potentially a last look at Milwaukee Road Pullman Sleeper "Jefferson River" in relatively good condition and how it still looks, having never entered Amtrak Service, probably the last revenue run was 1970 or 1971. The sleeper current sits outside Kansas City Union Station on a frieght siding lead.
http://jalbum.net/en/browse/user/album/1696086
https://c1.staticflickr.com/6/5280/7219012020_60638a4b4d_b.jpg
http://s3.amazonaws.com/rrpa_photos/115814/MILW%208-6-4%20Sleeper%2024%20Jefferson%20River%20a.jpg
A handsome long distance car with unmistakable Milwaukee Road craftsmanship and imagery.
Why is the end near? Orphaned and unwanted?
Is the number 24 at top rear end the number Milwaukee assigned it when the Pullman split happened ? W
blue streak 1 Is the number 24 at top rear end the number Milwaukee assigned it when the Pullman split happened ? W
Jefferson River was delivered after the Pullman split. Most railroads assigned numbers to sleeping cars for accounting purposes, though only SP, NKP and some tourist cars were identified by number by Pullman. Many NKP car names were duplicates of other Pullman car names, hence the use of the numbers.
Jefferson River had several strikes against it when Amtrak went shopping for cars in 1971 and 1972. It had been out of regular service since the end of the Pioneer Limited in late 1970, it had an unusual configuration with Duplex Roomettes, and it had Waukesha AC. Amtrak later bought cars with Duplex Roomettes and/or Waukesha AC, but only after traffic grew faster than initial projections.
What are they doing with sleeping car, just letting car go to steel haven??
Do not know of any RR but SOU. After Pullman split they numbered their stainless steel sleepers 2000 - 23xx. Heavy weight sleepers 2400 - xxxx? Numbers were not on side of cars but on the ends out side of bellows.
Most lightweight and many heavyweight Pullmans were owned by individual railroads but leased to Pullman after the split. Many railroads (PRR springs to mind) assigned numbers to the cars they owned for accounting purposes but did not paint the numbers on them, at least not at the time the numbers were assigned. New York Central started painting numbers on the cars after NYC ended its Pullman contract in 1958.
MiningmanWhy is the end near? Orphaned and unwanted?
Was originally purchased by KC Union Station Rail Experience with a Milwaukee Road Diner from a restaurant operation on Jones Island in Milwaukee. KCUS kept the Diner but put the sleeping car up for sale. To my knowledge nobody has stepped forwards to purchase the car but I could be mistaken. At some point if it is not preserved or purchased it's going to be scrap. I think KCUS still owns it but I am not sure. Would be cool if Friends of 261 purchased it and restored it but realistically, they do not have the need or the money.
What a lovely old car, and interesting, too.
Just seeing such a car in Armour Yellow fills me with nostalgia and remorse for all the times I wanted to ride on the Union Pacific somewhere, anywhere, but just didn't have the money. It's tough being a railfan at 14.
"Jefferson River" deserves a good fate with a new owner who'd appreciate this unusual car and the heritage it evokes.
CMStPnP Miningman Why is the end near? Orphaned and unwanted? Was originally purchased by KC Union Station Rail Experience with a Milwaukee Road Diner from a restaurant operation on Jones Island in Milwaukee. KCUS kept the Diner but put the sleeping car up for sale. To my knowledge nobody has stepped forwards to purchase the car but I could be mistaken. At some point if it is not preserved or purchased it's going to be scrap. I think KCUS still owns it but I am not sure. Would be cool if Friends of 261 purchased it and restored it but realistically, they do not have the need or the money.
Miningman Why is the end near? Orphaned and unwanted?
Do Friends of 261 have sleeping car in working order, maybe buy that for they train??
NKP guy What a lovely old car, and interesting, too. Just seeing such a car in Armour Yellow fills me with nostalgia and remorse for all the times I wanted to ride on the Union Pacific somewhere, anywhere, but just didn't have the money. It's tough being a railfan at 14. "Jefferson River" deserves a good fate with a new owner who'd appreciate this unusual car and the heritage it evokes.
I hope it gets restored to the original Milwaukee scheme from 1949, as seen on sister Minnesota River.
C&NW, CA&E, MILW, CGW and IC fan
Wow, I thought I posted the slideshow link with the interior tour, apparently not. Let me see if I can find it again.
Last spike monument......
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/f6/4f/05/f64f05950442a5d8bc7eea0307881621.jpg
Here is the slide show with the interior tour of the Jefferson River.
http://ozarkmountainrailcar.com/detail.asp?id=2056
(Click on View Gallery Link).
Jefferson River, a diesel, a caboose, several other cars and a whole bunch of stuff
https://www.stb.gov/recordations_2000s.nsf/f8e6632940c078dd85256b70005e5183/85257ca8005cf0ca85256efc006ea9d0/$FILE/25161.pdf
wanswheel Jefferson River, a diesel, a caboose, several other cars and a whole bunch of stuff https://www.stb.gov/recordations_2000s.nsf/f8e6632940c078dd85256b70005e5183/85257ca8005cf0ca85256efc006ea9d0/$FILE/25161.pdf
Yes I believe the F7 was Milwaukee Road as well and so was the RPO, the Dining Car and Baggage all were taken out of circulation around 1970-1971 and purchased direct from the Milwaukee Road except for the GN Observation Car and used as part of a railroad themed restaurant on Jones Island in Milwaukee. The F7 had only like 50 hours or something on it since the last rebuild by the Milwaukee but then was stored (1970 ish). Suddenly there appears a freshly repainted F7 at KCUS in KCS colors and if I had to guess I would say that is the repurposed Milwaukee F-7 (could also be KCS Heritage, I am just guessing). At any rate KCUS kept the dining car, baggage and RPO for exhibit purposes but decided against the Sleeping Car and decided to sell it (not sure why,.....maybe to raise money). They restored the GN Tail end observation car (which did not need much restoration as it also was already in excellent condition at time of sale). Allegedly they have the tail end observation on one of the inside tracks at KCUS but I have not had a chance to make it to the track level yet on the KC Rail Experience to look. They also have a BNSF Locomotive Simulator there (working and open to the public).
Thats all I know, currently. Trying to find the ex-Milwaukee Dining Car to see the inside of that. The KCUS Museum does mention that Milwaukee Road was a tenant of KCUS but not much is mentioned about the Milwaukee in any of their exhibits..........they tend to favor Santa Fe, KCS, BNSF as thats where a large portion of their donations came from. They do still have the train boards hanging on the original track ports for the KATY Flyer and a obscurely named FRISCO train which I do not currently remember the name. Both Texas bound from KC.
rcdryeJefferson River had several strikes against it when Amtrak went shopping for cars in 1971 and 1972. It had been out of regular service since the end of the Pioneer Limited in late 1970, it had an unusual configuration with Duplex Roomettes, and it had Waukesha AC. Amtrak later bought cars with Duplex Roomettes and/or Waukesha AC, but only after traffic grew faster than initial projections.
Not an expert but weren't the Pullmans also spec'd to have Nystrom Trucks as well? If so, I think the most important strike against it was the Nystrom Trucks......which were non standard as well and something Amtrak would rather not deal with replacing or maintaining.
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