M636CSiemens are very good at providing technical detail on their website, often in English as well as German and circuit block diagrams are provided.
I was hoping we could get you out from 'under the wharf' to address this!
Can you provide some specific URLs (in either English or German) that point to specific technical pages?
Also: a poster on one of the other lists (the PRR catenary electrics Yahoo group) had a detailed cut of the ACS64 truck, but didn't provide any of the other information about its detail, particularly the way the torque linkage is arranged, or the specific routing of the shafts and gearboxes for final drive. Can you give us URLs that show truck mechanical detail, as well?
(As a partial defense: I was being a bit humorous about the 'inverter feeding a DC link' because of the way it was worded without comment. I thought it would have been more appropriate to say 'inverter functioning as a rectifier' (or something else similarly accurate at low word count). Same way I'd refer to the 'speaker' in a yard telephone when somebody is talking into it -- not a microphone, of course, but acting as one. On the other hand, I easily lapse into pedanticism -- hey, at least I recognize the problem!)
erikem I would suspect that the there may be separate primary windings for the different voltage levels, though one way of handling 25Hz would be to use the same number of turns for 11kV/25Hz primary as for the 25kV/60Hz primary, but increase the number of secondary turns for 25Hz to maintain the same secondary voltage. This would result in about the same peak magnetic flux in the transformer core. - Erik
I would suspect that the there may be separate primary windings for the different voltage levels, though one way of handling 25Hz would be to use the same number of turns for 11kV/25Hz primary as for the 25kV/60Hz primary, but increase the number of secondary turns for 25Hz to maintain the same secondary voltage. This would result in about the same peak magnetic flux in the transformer core.
- Erik
oltmanndI modified C to back into 8 miles and 125 mph (or thereabouts)
oltmannd[Davis said] R=1.3 + 29/W +0.045V +0.0005kAV^2/WN in #/ton
in #/ton
If you drop a one-ton object off a tall building it will accelerate downward at 9.80665 meters per second per second, which is 21.937 mph/sec. In other words 2000 lb will accelerate a ton at 21.937 mph/sec-- so it takes 91.171 lb per ton to accelerate at 1 mph/sec, assuming no rotational inertia.
timzThe 0.045 is for freight cars-- it's 0.03 for passenger.
Kinda. There really aren't "freight cars" and "passenger cars" anymore. Even 0.0005 x cross section area is an approximation.
Agree that F=ma, always. Well for speeds <0.1c anyway.
-Don (Random stuff, mostly about trains - what else? http://blerfblog.blogspot.com/)
oltmanndAgree that F=ma
Turns out if we set the train's resistance to zero (except for inertia) it will reach 125 mph in 7 miles from the start.
timz(Didn't think it would take you this long to find your error.)
Please stand by!
My acceleration calc is OK. Didn't convert mph to fps to calc time.
Here is table again. I bumped up my aero drag to something more realisitic (0.0375)
Can get to 125 mph in 8 miles if loco can do 50% over rating for 4 - 1/2 min. Have no idea if this is reasonable or not.
With aero coeff at 0.03, only need 40% short time overload
Blue Streak,
Inverters intended for variable speed drive with induction or synchronous motors are almost invariably variable voltage variable frequency. With that, the inverters should be able to handle a wide range of AC side voltages, though with a maximum set by the devices used in the inverter (this may be what sets the Silverliner 5's 13.4 kV crossover). It is entirely possible, though not necessarily optimal, that the locomotives could operate without any tap changing on either the primary or secondary side (note that this is how the locomotives could be configured, not how they actually are configured).
One advantage of using the inverters on the catenary side of the DC link is that they can do power factor correction, i.e. that the current drawn is (mostly) sinusoidal and in phase with the voltage. Rectifiers generally induce rather non-sinusoidal currents, typically slightly trapezoidal square waves when choke input filters are used. Using thyristors to control the DC link voltage also introduces a significant phase difference between the voltage and current, with consequent reduction in power factor, where the inverter can control the DC link voltage and maintain unity power factor. Anything less than unity power factor requires more current to transmit the same power and thus more conductor area.
Overmod I was hoping we could get you out from 'under the wharf' to address this! Can you provide some specific URLs (in either English or German) that point to specific technical pages? Also: a poster on one of the other lists (the PRR catenary electrics Yahoo group) had a detailed cut of the ACS64 truck, but didn't provide any of the other information about its detail, particularly the way the torque linkage is arranged, or the specific routing of the shafts and gearboxes for final drive. Can you give us URLs that show truck mechanical detail, as well?
To my disappointment, Siemens have been progressively dumbing down their website, which was one of the last to give real technical detail and most of my sources just lead to broken links on Siemens' website.
This is still better than nothing:
https://www.mobility.siemens.com/mobility/global/SiteCollectionDocuments/en/rail-solutions/locomotives/vectron/vectron-creating-corridors-technic-en.pdf
This might (just) help with explaining the truck design (assuming the ACS-64 truck is basically similar).
https://www.mobility.siemens.com/mobility/global/en/interurban-mobility/rail-solutions/locomotives/vectron/technology/modular-locomotive-concept/flexible-drive/Pages/flexible-drive.aspx
I might have some better data stored away somewhere....
I haven't even been ON a wharf in some time. I've been trapped at a desk in our Navy Headquarters trying to get projects to meet certification requirements which is much less enjoyable.
M636C
oltmannd time speed Short time factor distance TE trn resist 4.700979 5 0 0.009794 100,000 4071 9.41684 10 0 0.026168 100,000 4379 14.14991 15 0 0.049176 100,000 4725 18.90437 20 0 0.078892 100,000 5109 23.67769 25 0 0.115354 100,000 5531 28.47435 30 0.1 0.158658 100,000 5991 33.29656 35 0.3 0.208889 100,000 6489 38.14657 40 0.5 0.266146 100,000 7025 43.50619 45 0.5 0.336863 91,733 7598 49.57122 50 0.5 0.425312 82,560 8210 56.38348 55 0.5 0.534119 75,055 8860 63.99394 60 0.5 0.666245 68,800 9548 72.46481 65 0.5 0.825073 63,508 10274 81.87237 70 0.5 1.014531 58,971 11039 92.31073 75 0.5 1.239246 55,040 11841 103.897 80 0.5 1.504765 51,600 12681 116.7786 85 0.5 1.817858 48,565 13559 131.1431 90 0.5 2.186948 45,867 14475 147.2341 95 0.5 2.622746 43,453 15429 165.3737 100 0.5 3.139218 41,280 16421 185.9987 105 0.5 3.755106 39,314 17451 209.7218 110 0.5 4.496452 37,527 18519 237.4367 115 0.5 5.401035 35,896 19625 270.519 120 0.5 6.526753 34,400 20769 311.2446 125 0.5 7.969118 33,024 21952
Assuming 100000 lb TE from 0 to 41.28 mph, then constant 11008 rail hp, and traditional Davis resistance the standing-start mile takes 92.3 seconds. The train reaches 125 mph in a bit more than 8 miles.
While not really relevant to the ACS-64, Vossloh have a circuit diagram in their "UK Light" diesel locomotive, fitted with a Caterpillar C175 engine.
The circuit diagram appears on the last page:
http://www.vossloh-innotrans.com/media/downloads/pdfs/vrv/Vossloh_UKLIGHT_us.pdf
In this case there is a rectifier on the alternator, but an inverter on the dynamic brakes.
It shows that the HEP inverters are basically similar to the traction inverters.
From a copy of the ACS64 Familiarization and Orientation manual:
No weight given for the main transformer (which is between the trucks) but it is p/n A2V00002028490, and using that information might get you physical parameters.
It includes two 480VAC dedicated HEP transformers.
The two stepdown voltages for different catenary voltages are given as 1957 VAC and 1878 VAC, "depending on the catenary input".
"Voltage switching Is Done Electronically By The Primary Side Tap Changer"
There is a modular "HEP Rack" (A2V00002106069) which produces 480 VAC "to locomotive as a secondary source of electricity ... it can be used during full catenary line operation". (This to me indicates that the inverter modules do not perform any HEP duty...)
The traction converters are A2V00002028491. The nominal DC link voltage is 3600 V nominal. Nothing is said about having HEP-compatible outputs in these converters.
Overmod From a copy of the ACS64 Familiarization and Orientation manual: No weight given for the main transformer (which is between the trucks) but it is p/n A2V00002028490, and using that information might get you physical parameters. It includes two 480VAC dedicated HEP transformers. The two stepdown voltages for different catenary voltages are given as 1957 VAC and 1878 VAC, "depending on the catenary input". "Voltage switching Is Done Electronically By The Primary Side Tap Changer" There is a modular "HEP Rack" (A2V00002106069) which produces 480 VAC "to locomotive as a secondary source of electricity ... it can be used during full catenary line operation". (This to me indicates that the inverter modules do not perform any HEP duty...) The traction converters are A2V00002028491. The nominal DC link voltage is 3600 V nominal. Nothing is said about having HEP-compatible outputs in these converters.
I'm much more familiar with diesel electric locomotives with AC traction.
However, I understood that the Amtrak supply was 3 Phase AC 480 volts at 60Hz.
The overhead line supply is single phase AC at either 60Hz or 25Hz.
The only way of getting 3 phase AC from the OHL supply would be rectifying it and feeding it through an inverter.
If however the train only requires single phase 60Hz, transformers would suffice on 60Hz overhead but this would be unavailable under 25Hz supply.
Certainly the Amtrak P32s use an inverter for HEP supply and a traction inverter can be used in case of failure of the HEP inverter, the locomotive then running on three motors.
The Alaska Railroad SD70MAC can divert one inverter for HEP use on passenger trains with the remaining one powers the train.
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