http://www.businessweek.com/ap/financialnews/D9M940301.htm
C&NW, CA&E, MILW, CGW and IC fan
This seems to make a lot more sense to me.
So, maybe his decisions making isn't tied to emotion. i.e. he "hates" passenger trains. If it was, then he would be a crazy person. He probably isn't crazy...
-Don (Random stuff, mostly about trains - what else? http://blerfblog.blogspot.com/)
True, but perhaps only up to a point. What seems disturbing about this to some of my Wisconsin friends is a rather impulsive management style. Instead of immediately rejecting the federal money for HrSR to Madison, he should have waited until he had this alternative. Now he may get neither.
schlimm True, but perhaps only up to a point. What seems disturbing about this to some of my Wisconsin friends is a rather impulsive management style. Instead of immediately rejecting the federal money for HrSR to Madison, he should have waited until he had this alternative. Now he may get neither.
What did people in the '60's say? Right on!
If his point was that the line extension to Madison to serve those no-goodnick educators and their hippie radical enablers was a waste of money but that the existing line to Milwaukee to serve those salt-of-the-earth taxpayers is a Good Thing, he should have been out front and up front and negotiated that kind of deal with Ray LaHood. If he wanted the Federal money to be used "more efficiently and more wisely" on the Milwaukee line, he should have said so in the campaign.
And what kind of Conservative is he anyway? Gimme 150 million in Federal, "free" money for new train sets so I can save a few dimes in state money for the maintenance contribution to run the existing equipment?
If GM "killed the electric car", what am I doing standing next to an EV-1, a half a block from the WSOR tracks?
The other stimulous money for trains was bad because a Democrat wanted it. This stimulous money for trains is good because a Rebublican wants it.
Even you looney Liberals should be able to understand that.
Dave
Lackawanna Route of the Phoebe Snow
Sort of analogous the ARC tunnel in NJ. Except, there really wasn't a fall back position for the ARC - and it wasn't a campaign issue.
Sounds like somewhere in the govt in WI, there is someone who convinced him he threw the baby out with the bath water.
Devil's advocate: Would a nuanced approach to passenger rail have been a doable thing in the governor's campaign in Wisc?
My interpretation is he had to reject the former and reapply. Your forgetting that Wisconsin Legislators made an attempt to renegotiate the terms of the HSR grant and were told ALL OR NOTHING. So it was in the terms of the grant I believe. The HSR grants are written in very straight-jacket terms. If the state does not meet the speed or performance goals of the project they have to pay back the money to the Federal Government.
Have to say what I would have done as Governor Doyle was build-up Chicago-Milwaukee first to 110 mph and then do the extension west in incremental and smaller packages. Doyle was stupid to go with Talgo but too late now, what is done is done there. That equipment decision is going to add cost because it is unique equipment in the Midwest and not very easy to share excess or borrow excess with other transit agencies when Wisconsin might need the capacity or shed the capacity.
Chicago-Milwaukee is doing pretty well I must say, I remember ridership in the Corridor at 200-300k and only 3 frequencies a day......way back when it was a two to three car train. 800k a year is pretty decent growth from the late 1970's early 1980's. I think with the speed improvement to 110 mph they could grow that number to 1 million a year or more.
Can't really add anything on Governors Doyle & Walker, but I would like to touch upon CMStPnP's comment, "Doyle was stupid to go with Talgo..."
While it is true that equipment sharing is complicated by this move, does that mean that everyone now has to make decisions based on the lowest common denominator of equipment decisions made by Amtrak? Talgos seem to have superior characteristics, compared to current Hiawatha consists. The Amtrak Cascades Talgos in the Pacific Northwest are some of the most popular trainsets Amtrak operates anywhere, with extremely high availability rates.
Seems to me that the stupid ones may well be those who are chosing equipment other than Talgo!
Dragoman Can't really add anything on Governors Doyle & Walker, but I would like to touch upon CMStPnP's comment, "Doyle was stupid to go with Talgo..." While it is true that equipment sharing is complicated by this move, does that mean that everyone now has to make decisions based on the lowest common denominator of equipment decisions made by Amtrak? Talgos seem to have superior characteristics, compared to current Hiawatha consists. The Amtrak Cascades Talgos in the Pacific Northwest are some of the most popular trainsets Amtrak operates anywhere, with extremely high availability rates. Seems to me that the stupid ones may well be those who are chosing equipment other than Talgo!
Well if you look at what just happened...........Wisconsin is now only going to operate them Chicago to Milwaukee now 85 miles RT mostly straight RoW. How much money did Wisconsin spend on the equipment, how much money to keep the tilting mechanism running........how much schedule speed does the titling mech buy vs maintenence cost. Chicago-Milwaukee they do need the flexibility to increase and decrease trainset size. I've seen them do it.
I just think it was a shortsighted decision given it is supposed to be a "Midwest High Speed System" vs a Wisconsin system. Wisconsin's hope of course is that other Corridors in the Midwest will buy the same equipment.
We'll have to see if that happens. If it doesn't then the equipment decision will haunt them.
Talgo was going to build the trainsets in Milwaukee, but will pull out in 2012 after finishing some more for the Cascades, retaining only a maintenance operation. At the rate Walker is going, by January 2012 he may be recalled.
CMStPnP: Certainly we will have to see what happens. (They have still not been able to fix that crack in my crystal ball ... )
I would like to point out that one of their selling points is that Talgo's tilting system, per se, requires little direct maintenance, because it is a passive system, unlike the active (mechanically-operated) systems on the Acela and the like. And, there are other advertised advantages to Talgos (besides tilting) also, including their light weight, good ride, anti-hunting steeered wheelsets, etc.
In any case, I believe the cost of the Talgo trainsets include full manufacturer-provided maintenance, and Washington State DOT's experience has been quite good.
And, Illinois has been making some positive overtures to Talgo ...
schlimm Talgo was going to build the trainsets in Milwaukee, but will pull out in 2012 after finishing some more for the Cascades, retaining only a maintenance operation. At the rate Walker is going, by January 2012 he may be recalled.
Oh
I saw the pictures of the train cars in the Milwaukee plant thought they were for Wisconsin......apparently they are for Washington state.
Here is an interesting article on the pullout, appears the business community was split 50/50 but wanted to try to amend the proposal but was rejected by the Obama administration stance of ALL or NOTHING.:
http://www.politifact.com/wisconsin/statements/2010/dec/20/talgo-inc/talgo-says-milwaukee-business-community-did-not-sp/
Phoebe Vet The other stimulous money for trains was bad because a Democrat wanted it. This stimulous money for trains is good because a Rebublican wants it. Even you looney Liberals should be able to understand that.
Sometimes one just cannot help throwing in a political barb.
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