The undercarriage of the MTH R17 is a metal chasis, so I will replace it with a plastic one from another vendor. You can use NWSL powered trucks under a plastic undecarriage which looks more detailed and realistic than metal ones.
Seems like the compromises a manufacturer of toy trains would make. But I suppose nothing more like the prototype is available?
Or could one buy these and work them over with powered trucks from someone else, do the interior detailing (not too hard with only side plastic hard seating) and modify the coupling arrangement?
What color schemes are available? In their lifetimes, the R17 were deep almost black green, grey and blue, deep Burgendy red, and flaming red-bird red.
The MTH HO R17 look great but there's allot of improvements. First of all the top round red and green lights are omitted "not lighted" All the lights in the trailer cars are omitted. The train is setup like a traditional locomotive hauled train because a large engine occupies the first car instead of powered trucks or underbelly drives. Last but not least the cars are blatently spaced too far apart. At least there are seats and poles in the interior.
In a sense, married pairs are composed of two single-ended cars run back-to-back. In some casas couplers are used but in many cases only drawbars. On Metro North and LIRR, there are no separate single-ended cars. I believe currently the only single cars are some on Metro North in New Haven service, dual-mode, and they are double-ended. Metro=North was considering some three-car units with "blind" center motor cars, triplexes, but I do not know whether any were actually ordered.
The old BMT standard steels ended up in several configurations. A cars were single cars, double-ended. B cars were triplexes with a cneter blind motor and a motor with one cab at each end. BX's had a trailer in the center instead of a blind motor. BT's were just two cars, basically BX's with the trailer removed. Of course all could multiple together. Trains were limited to only one trailer in a seven-car train, Trailers were also prohibited on trains using the Manhattan bridge because of the grades.
The IRT had both motors and trailers, and until the 1939 Worlds Fair cars came, all motors were double-ended. The limit was three traiklers in a ten car train, two in a five-car train, and one in a three-car train. Except that Flushing and Astoria trains had no trailers because of the grades to and from the Steinway (42nd Street-East River) tunnel. These cars were also called Steinways, because they had a lower-speed gear ratio, made up by field shunting, thus a more powerful car for the grades. The 1939 cars which were styled more like the IND R's than traditional "Low-V's" could mu with them and had identacle electrics and mechanicals, but true single-ended separate cars with one cab in each car, usually run back-to-back so many assumed they were married pairs. But they were separate cars, and I understand there was or is a photo showing one at the head of a train with the rest all regular Steinways. I also remember the shop moves to Coney Island via BMT tracks after the 2nd Avenue Elevated's 59th Street Bridge route was finally ended in 1942, the northern portion north of 57th Street and trains to the Bronx joining those from 3rd AVenue ending two years earlier on Unification in June 1940. These were a mixture of Steinways, Worlds Fairs, and BMT Q's, all in the same train, with only the steel cars, the Steinways and Worlds Fairs powered, usually seven of them and one three-car Q set trailing at the rear. Except for having a cab at the front of the train, the steel cars were in no particular order. (The Q's were the steel-end, sliding-door cars rebult from gate cars for the BMT's Astoria and Fllushing trains, the two lines joint IRT-BMT to 1949.)
So, yes, there were single-ended cars, but usually run back-to-back like married pairs..
All the prewar IND cars, R-1 - R-9, were single motors, double-end.
The old BMT standard steels ended up in several configurations. A cars were single cars, doubloe-ended. B cars were triplexes with a cneter blind motor and a motor with one cab at each end. BX's had a trailer in the center instead of a blind motor. BT's were just two cars, basically BX's with the trailer removed. Of course all could multiple together. Trains were limited to only one trailer in a seven-car train, Trailers were also prohibited on trains using the Manhattan bridge because of the grades.
The IRT had both motors and trailers, and until the 1939 Worlds Fair cars came, all motors were double-ended. The limit was three trailers in a ten car train, two in a five-car train, and one in a three-car train. Except that Flushing and Astoria trains had no trailers because of the grades to and from the Steinway (42nd Street-East River) tunnel. These cars were also called Steinways, because they had a lower-speed gear ratio, made up by field shunting, thus a more powerful car for the grades. The 1939 cars which were styled more like the IND R's than traditional "Low-V's," but could mu with them and had identacle electrics and mechanicals, but single-ended with one cab in each car, usually run back-to-back with many assuming they were married pairs. But when Flushing-Astoria steel IRT cars could no longer access Lenox IRT Shop, the shop moves to Coney Island over BMT tracks from Queensboro Plaza had the cars in random order with of course a cab at front, usually seven IRT cars and a BMT three-car "Q" set running as trailers at the rear. Flushing and Astoria were joint IRT-BMT until 1949 and beyond Queensboro Plaza only narrow IRT-width cars could run. The BMT rebuilt wood gate cars with steel ends and sliding doors for this service. Up to the closure of the 2nd Avenue Elevateds line over the 59th Street Bridge, the Steinways and Worlds Fairs went to Lenox via that rout, up to June 1940 Unification, reversing at 57th Street, Manhattan, then using the Bergen cutoff or 149th Street connection to the current 2-5 structure in the Bronx, back to 135th and Lenox, and reverse again. After June 1940, to south of Chathan Square and then north on the 3rd Avenue Elevated, but they could not be overhauled at its shop and continued to the junction with the present 2-5 line. Then, after 1942, to Coney Island. John Kneeling arranged a shop move middle-of-the-night fan-trip ride.
I don't know about the NYC Subway, but the PATH system between NJ & NY does have powered cars without cabs, kind of like a "B" unit with diesel locomotives. They are run as triple units cab-no cab-cab
Are there single ended cars?
Married pair on the New York subway system, the LIRR, and Metro North means cabs only at one end of each car, batteries, motor-generator or transformer and inverter, and possibly compressor , just one to both cars, equipment distributed for weight balance.
No problem. See if you can get in touch with the Lion after he returns in September as he knows more about the Subway than I do.
You even included the blueprint! Thanks allot! I asked this question because Im getting a 4 car HO MTH R17 train set. There's a general rule that I've applied to my modeling skills, "NO DUMMIES ALLOWED!" If the prototype is AB I will power my models AB if they're all powered, then all my cars will be powered with DCC decoders too! Therefore my models will feel like the real thing. I think the MTH models are one powered and 3 dummy so I will be ordering parts for motoring or I will order more power cars.
They were all singles. 36'0'' truck centers, 6'10'' between axle centers in each truck.
http://www.nycsubway.org/perl/caption.pl?/img/cars/sheet054-r17.jpg
Note that a married pair does not usually mean that one car is unpowered, only that two cars must be operated together as appliances are generally distributed between the two.
I don't think any trailers were built for the NYC Subway after 1930.
Does anyone know if the R17s were all powered A units, or married pairs, with A power and B dummy trailors. What was the wheelbase?
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