NYC Streetcar Proposal

[CPM500]

http://www.progressiverailroading.com/passenger_rail/news/NYC-Mayor-de-Blasio-unveils-25-billion-BrooklynQueens-streetcar-proposal--47212?email=[e-mail]&utm_medium=email&utm_source=prdailynews&utm_campaign=prdailynews02/05/2016

[CMStPnP]

He must have liked the trolley's in Cuba during his illegal honeymoon there.

[Phoebe Vet]

I strongly support rail mass transit for it's efficiency, but it is a mistake to mix it with those rubber tired individually operated vehicles.  Grade level crossings are just accidents that haven't happened yet...but they will.

[Firelock76]

Even with a dedicated lane I just can't see it happening.  Not in this day and age.  The streetcar era in NYC is over.

In a way, it came to an end over 100 years ago when the subway was built.  A subway is nothing more than an evolution of a streetcar system when you come right down to it, faster and out of everyone's way.

[BaltACD]

Firelock76

Even with a dedicated lane I just can't see it happening.  Not in this day and age.  The streetcar era in NYC is over.

In a way, it came to an end over 100 years ago when the subway was built.  A subway is nothing more than an evolution of a streetcar system when you come right down to it, faster and out of everyone's way.

While I would agree the streetcar era ended a century ago - for the route indicated, it would take until the next century for it to be done as a subway at probably 20 times the cost.

[Firelock76]

No argument with you there Balt.  My concern is exactly as PhoebeVet expressed it, what happens when you mix streetcars with regular vehicular traffic, especially in this day and age when the average driver isn't used (for lack of a better term) to dealing with them.  They even had problems back in the Model T era, so much so the Ford Motor Company put out safety films on the subject.  Nothing new about dumb drivers.

Mind you, I have nothing against streetcar systems, nothing at all.  Depending on location they can certainly be a viable option for mass transit.  I'm not so sure NYC is the place for them anymore.  I could be wrong, I admit it.

[DSchmitt]

Phoebe Vet

I strongly support rail mass transit for it's efficiency, but it is a mistake to mix it with those rubber tired individually operated vehicles.  Grade level crossings are just accidents that haven't happened yet...but they will.

 

Mixing sucessfully:

San Francisco, CA

http://www.friends4expo.org/images/sf-tline-800.jpg

Houston, TX

https://austinrailnow.files.wordpress.com/2013/10/arn02_hou-lrt-preston-stn-main-st-ohdview_hou-metro.jpg

Jersey City, NJ

http://cityphile.com/photo/wp-content/uploads/yapb_cache/hudson_bergen_light_rail_right_of_way_on_essex_street_6386.30sfrtxr82g4c8g48ggk0ocg0.c4xtg9uu3r404wggo4ss0ss8s.th.jpeg

 

Portland, OR

http://www.gcpvd.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/portland-transit-flickr.jpg

Sacramento, CA

https://austinrailnow.files.wordpress.com/2013/04/sac-lrt-12th-str-mixed-trf-15347-20010428x_eric-haas.jpg

Sydney, Australia

http://tdu.to/a40939/Sydney%20Light%20Rail%20-%20LRV2104%20and%20LRV2108%20at%20the%20corner%20of%20Hay%20and%20Sussex%20Streets,%20Haymarket.jpg

Essen, Germany

http://citytransport.info/Digi/678a.jpg

Berlin, Germany

http://citytransport.info/Digi/3744a.jpg

Basle, Switzerland

http://citytransport.info/PhotoCD/1144_69a.jpg

http://citytransport.info/Digi/3163a.jpg

Wolverhampton, England

http://citytransport.info/Digi/P1030934a.jpg

Turin, Italy

http://citytransport.info/PhotoCD/1144_83a.jpg

 

[Phoebe Vet]

https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=light+rail+collisions&qpvt=Light+rail+collisions&qpvt=Light+rail+collisions&FORM=IGRE 

 

[daveklepper]

With maganetic track brakes, modern streetcars can stop as fast as an auto, faster than most buses and trucks, even faster in wet  weather.

Streetcars are making a comeback and are appropraite for specific situations.

 

visit Toronto

[CSSHEGEWISCH]

While I will agree that a streetcar is appropriate for some situations, I would hardly say that it is making a comeback, unless you are referring to light rail in its entirety.  Streetcars are not a real improvement over rubber-tired vehicles since they still have to contend with the other vehicles on the roadway.  That being said, street running can serve a function of bringing a light rail route that is otherwise on private right-of-way into the central business district without paying a small fortune to obtain a separate right-of-way.

[daveklepper]

On a heavily traveled line, more than 25000 fares/day, a streetcar line is more economical to operate than a bus line, despite capital costs and track and wire maintenance.  Fuel vs electricity is not the main item, but daily vehicle maintenance and useful life of the vehicle are.

When Seattle converted the Ballard bus line from diesel to trolleybus, patronage rose 30%  People prefer electic vehicles.  But certainly, private rights of way and light rail as a goal are prefereable. Except when the streetcar operates as a horizontal streetlong department store shopping elevator, like San Francisco's F line, and like streetcars on Manhattan's Broadway 59-125, Coney Island's Surf Avenue, and Boston's S. Huntington Avenue and Center St. to the Arborway should be.

Nearly all light rail lines do have grade crossings.  Doesn't seem to be as much of a problem as with railroads.

[jgfuller]

Dear Mayor De Blasio -- try the route with "Bus Rapid Transit"-type buses - on 5-10 minute headway. See if anyone wants to ride. before spending $2.5B

[Wizlish]

daveklepper

With magnetic track brakes, modern streetcars can stop as fast as an auto, faster than most buses and trucks, even faster in wet weather.

The problem is that many of the passengers don't when the streetcar does...

[daveklepper]

EXCEPT jACK, THAT MANY PEOPLE WILL RIDE A ATREETCAR, BUT NOT A BUS.