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Posted by VGN Jess on Wednesday, March 01, 2017 6:33 PM

BaltACD: That certainly is reasonable with a wood caboose. Did the same restriction apply when steel cabooses were used?

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Posted by BaltACD on Wednesday, March 01, 2017 8:22 PM

PA Code

§ 33.53. Pusher engines.

 All common carrier railroads operating in this Commonwealth shall promulgate or modify existing operating rules and procedures for the government of their respective employes so as to require that the operation of a pusher engine or engines behind an occupied cabin or caboose car, in train, shall be used subject to the following conditions:

   (1)  If the horsepower to be used by a pusher engine or engines behind a cabin or caboose exceeds 3,500, the train crew shall, before such a move is made, vacate the cabin car and occupy the pusher engine or a cabin car or caboose behind the pusher engine or engines, and the train shall be brought to a stop before the pusher engine or engines are detached.

   (2)  The practice of ‘‘cutting off on the fly’’ pusher engines behind occupied cabin cars shall be limited to those instances in which the horsepower used by the pusher engine does not exceed 3,500.

Makes no difference if wood or steel.

Never too old to have a happy childhood!

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  • From: McCalla, Alabama
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Posted by rockymidlandrr on Wednesday, March 01, 2017 9:29 PM

Helper service system wide is restricted to 15 powered axles On CSX.  When DP was introduced it was determined on some coal trains that DP could be ran in the middle.  So instead of having three 110 car coal trains with 3 engine per, you have two 165 car trains with 4 engines per train.  This also allows the manned pushers to do their thing on the rear too.

Now the 165 car trains have 18 powered axles on the front and 18 in the middle in DP helper service, 3 over the legal limit.  But can't have rules getting in the way can we?

Still building the Rocky Midland RR Through, Over, and Around the Rockies
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Posted by NorthWest on Wednesday, March 01, 2017 9:37 PM

rockymidlandrr
Helper service system wide is restricted to 15 powered axles On CSX.

Why an odd number of axles? Steam rule holdover? Strange that it isn't a multiple of 4 or 6.

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Posted by VGN Jess on Wednesday, March 01, 2017 10:05 PM

BaltACD: Interesting. I would have thought that steel cabooses would have allowed more HP. Thanks for the information.

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Posted by YoHo1975 on Thursday, March 02, 2017 1:06 AM
UP uses both run through DPU power and Helpers on the hill. There are captive service ES44AC (C45ACCTE in UP parlance) that run from Roseville to Sparks. My observation is that they are most often actually on the head end of the train. So they build the train in a 2x2 or 3x2x0 (midtrain no end train DPU) then add 2 more on the front for the trip up the mountain. UP also runs some really huge manifests up the hill that have 2/3s back mid train helpers. often 2 or 3 units plus the 3 or 4 up front if not more with helpers.
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Posted by rockymidlandrr on Saturday, March 04, 2017 3:09 PM

NorthWest

 

 
rockymidlandrr
Helper service system wide is restricted to 15 powered axles On CSX.

 

Why an odd number of axles? Steam rule holdover? Strange that it isn't a multiple of 4 or 6.

 

 

Only thing I can figure is it will allow you to use a AC engine and one DC engine in helper service (9 and 6 powered axles).  

Still building the Rocky Midland RR Through, Over, and Around the Rockies
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Posted by BaltACD on Saturday, March 04, 2017 5:27 PM

rockymidlandrr
NorthWest
rockymidlandrr

Why an odd number of axles? Steam rule holdover? Strange that it isn't a multiple of 4 or 6.

Only thing I can figure is it will allow you to use a AC engine and one DC engine in helper service (9 and 6 powered axles). 

Excerpt from CSX Timetable for Mountain Sub - Grafton to Cumberland - which authorizes two AC's as allowed Helper power on the grades and potentially more when specifically authorized.

Never too old to have a happy childhood!

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Posted by Paul Milenkovic on Sunday, March 05, 2017 7:52 AM

That looks to be a mighty long list of rules.

A lawyer friend-of-the-family once offered that for every warning sticker you see on a consumer product, there had been an accident followed by a lawsuit.

There must have been an accident on that Big Hill for every one of those rules?

If GM "killed the electric car", what am I doing standing next to an EV-1, a half a block from the WSOR tracks?
  • Member since
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  • From: US
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Posted by BaltACD on Sunday, March 05, 2017 11:37 AM

Paul Milenkovic
That looks to be a mighty long list of rules.

A lawyer friend-of-the-family once offered that for every warning sticker you see on a consumer product, there had been an accident followed by a lawsuit.

There must have been an accident on that Big Hill for every one of those rules?

More than one!  Once is just an accident.  More than one is something that is beyond accidental and needs a rule.

Never too old to have a happy childhood!

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