I know that the United States exports a lot of locomotives, but are there any cases of the opposite happening and locomotives from different countries being imported here? I know obviously the Siemens locomotives Amtrak uses are German(Although I'm pretty sure they're manufactured in California) and there used to be a handful of Russian TEM-7 diesels just sitting around in Houston, but are there any other cases of foreign rolling stock being used here?
In 1961. Krauss-Maffei AG sent 6 diesel torque-converter drive locomotive to the United States, 3 to D&RGW and 3 to SP. In 1964, 15 more locomotives were sent to SP.
In the late 1970's, Amtrak imported two straight electric locomoives, one from Sweden and one from France to serve as test beds for a GG! replacement. The Swedish design won and provided the basis for the AEM7's.
EMD's main production facility was in London, ON at one time.
There are the five SD50S on the G&W roster built under license by Clyde in Australia for Hamersley Iron and later brought to the US in 1999.
https://donstrack.smugmug.com/UtahRails/Locomotive-Details/Utah-Railway-6061/
Someone else can cover the C36-7s from Oz.
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D.Carleton There are the five SD50S on the G&W roster built under license by Clyde in Australia for Hamersley Iron and later brought to the US in 1999. https://donstrack.smugmug.com/UtahRails/Locomotive-Details/Utah-Railway-6061/ Someone else can cover the C36-7s from Oz.
The 3 Hamersley Iron C36-7's were built by A. Goninan & Co under license for GE in 1978. They were sold to National Railway Equipment in 1998 long with the 5 SD50S's and shipped here to the United States. 1 ended up on the Minnesota Commercial but has long since been retired, traded back to NRE and scrapped. The other 2 were resold to Brazil with 1 of those actually now being preserved down there.
the Washington Terminal RR operated a Romanian built Faur quarter horse switcher. Built in 1974 and retired in 1978, sold and scrapped in the early to mid 1980's.
in the early 2000's before selling out to Genesee & Wyomin, the Ohio Central ended up with some odd switcher that had been built in Czechoslovakia. I don't think it ever turned a wheel in service and was eventually disposed of.
Bryan Jones
PRR imported a French de Glehn-du Bousquet compound for tests (it turned out to be too lightly built for typical service here, but it's interesting to consider what might have been if properly robust construction had been used...)
PRR also had a British-styled 4-4-0, the original class T, with a von Borries 2-cylinder cross-compound arrangement and three-axle tender.
If we expand things a bit, we had the Swedish X2000 and that delightful-in-principle 100mph Leyland railbus, and of course the ACF Talgo and the RTGs.
A few Chinese SY class mikados are used for tourist trains in the US.
DrWA few Chinese SY class mikados are used for tourist trains in the US.
Which reminds me that a whole train of Scandinavian equipment, the locomotive IIRC a 4-6-0, was used to run a tourist service for a while.
It's not the U.S, but CN tried a MaK diesel-hydraulic switcher back in 1956.
http://www.trainweb.org/oldtimetrains/photos/cnr_diesel/demo.htm
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And of course the Baldwin 'Train X' RP-210 or whatever it was called had a German engine and drivetrain. Wasn't the Alco-Haulic transmission also German?
If Canada is involved, why not the Dutch equipment for the Northlander? That came with a 'locomotive' that IIRC did not last too long...
The Metro Rail in Austin, a hybrid light rail/commuter rail, uses Stadler GTW DMUs built in Switzerland.
That Northlander train is sitting in Holland outside of Amsterdam. I saw it 4 years ago and it's still painted in ON colours. The Marklin model train company paid to have it brought back providing that someone would restore it but that hasn't happened.
The Swedish train ran on the Hull-Wakefield scenic railway but that was shut down when the line was washed out. I think it's been sold but to whom I do not know.
DrWThe Metro Rail in Austin, a hybrid light rail/commuter rail, uses Stadler GTW DMUs built in Switzerland.
Obviously you people missed the biggest batch of foreign built locomotives in the USA. All of them are currently running on a US commuter railroad. NJ Transit has sixty-five ALP46 and ALP46A electric locomotives numbered 4600 - 4664. Built by Bombardier in Kassel, Germany.
Sonoma Marin Area Rapid Transit runs these Nippon Sharyo DMUs:
https://www.railpictures.net/photo/831746/https://www.railpictures.net/photo/587004/#remarkshttps://www.railpictures.net/photo/725659/
https://www.railpictures.net/photo/676455/
Overmod PRR imported a French de Glehn-du Bousquet compound for tests (it turned out to be too lightly built for typical service here, but it's interesting to consider what might have been if properly robust construction had been used...) PRR also had a British-styled 4-4-0, the original class T, with a von Borries 2-cylinder cross-compound arrangement and three-axle tender. If we expand things a bit, we had the Swedish X2000 and that delightful-in-principle 100mph Leyland railbus, and of course the ACF Talgo and the RTGs.
An additional permanent resident was an LNWR 2-2-2-0 three cylinder compound (named "Pennsylvania") built in 1888 for the Pennsylvania Railroad by Beyer Peacock (since an injunction had been taken out against the LNWR Crewe Works to prevent them building locomotives for outside customers.) It became PRR 1320 and apparently operated for at least a few years.
In 1893 a larger LNWR 2-2-2-2 "Queen Empress" was displayed in Chicago. It worked itself and two coaches to and from New York. Also at the Chicago Exhibition was the GWR 4-2-2 "Lord of the Isles" which being 7 foot gauge presumably rode on flatcars on both sides of the Atlantic. Apparently it had been exhibited new at the first international exhibition at the Crystal Palace when new in 1851.
These items are described in surprising detail in a magazine "Back Track" for April 2001.
I think you have confused your descriptions of Talgo trains. While a number of Talgo trains were imported to the USA, the ACF Talgos were built in the USA and exported to Spain, including a set built for demonstrations in the USA. The ACF Talgos were the first passenger carrying Talgo trains built. Some modified versions of the original Talgos were built by ACF for use by Rock Island and Boston and Maine.
Peter
We could also count the HHP-8s and Acela power cars as 'foreign' by manufacturer, and there is a class of NJT diesel engines with Polish-sourced blocks in their 710s -- these are railfan-notable for being the best-sounding in acceleration of any locomotive I have heard...
The Frank Webb divided-drives span an interesting era in motive-power evolution, the years that high speed and coupled wheels were supposed to be incompatible. The earlier ones, with the dustbin LP cylinder in the middle that turned the wheels both ways when the locomotive was drifted downgrade onto its train, were duly weird, but the later class (I think 'Greater Britain') were supposed to have been comparatively good, and I believe these were the model for PRR 1320. (It has been a long time since I last looked at the experimentals...)
While on the subject of single-axle divided-drive locomotives, the James Toleman locomotive (which was designed by an Englishman) may count. This was judged a failure for interesting engineering reasons that should have been comparatively easy to correct, and was in a collection at Purdue University for what appears to have been many years.
I was thinking of the ACF Talgo as 'foreign-inspired' even though, as noted, it was built in Berwick. Along the same lines, Amtrak actually owned (and technically still does) one of the original sets of LRC cars.
As a consolation prize: the genset I had the pleasure of using a few times had Deutz Ag engines.
It's been fun. But it isn't much fun anymore. Signing off for now.
The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.t fun any
zugmannAs a consolation prize: the genset I had the pleasure of using a few times had Deutz Ag engines.
Overmod zugmann As a consolation prize: the genset I had the pleasure of using a few times had Deutz Ag engines.
zugmann As a consolation prize: the genset I had the pleasure of using a few times had Deutz Ag engines.
My recollection is that the Deutz engine model was "632". I have a copy of a page from a trade journal showing a cross section of the "V" engine. As I understand it, Deutz only built inline engines to this design and GE were intended to build all the V-type engines. Of course this might have changed after GE abandoned the design.
This was all during the great evolving cavitation scandals, where documentation changed almost from week to week (as did some of the stories and excuses...)
As I recall, in both the original EMD H-block and the GE engine, they were using thin-section castings for the block, and the firing stresses for 6000hp caused ultrasonic vibrations at unfortunate 'reinforcing' or resonant locations which then had that sonoluminescent augmented wear and corrosion boogie... in all sorts of little nooks and crannies engineers hadn't predicted the trouble would occur. Exactly what the observed cumulative problems manifested as was never entirely clear, but metal thinning and a distressing number of potential pinhole coolant leaks into various places seem to be part of what could be expected.
Overmod We could also count the HHP-8s and Acela power cars as 'foreign' by manufacturer, and there is a class of NJT diesel engines with Polish-sourced blocks in their 710s -- these are railfan-notable for being the best-sounding in acceleration of any locomotive I have heard... The Frank Webb divided-drives span an interesting era in motive-power evolution, the years that high speed and coupled wheels were supposed to be incompatible. The earlier ones, with the dustbin LP cylinder in the middle that turned the wheels both ways when the locomotive was drifted downgrade onto its train, were duly weird, but the later class (I think 'Greater Britain') were supposed to have been comparatively good, and I believe these were the model for PRR 1320. (It has been a long time since I last looked at the experimentals...) While on the subject of single-axle divided-drive locomotives, the James Toleman locomotive (which was designed by an Englishman) may count. This was judged a failure for interesting engineering reasons that should have been comparatively easy to correct, and was in a collection at Purdue University for what appears to have been many years. I was thinking of the ACF Talgo as 'foreign-inspired' even though, as noted, it was built in Berwick. Along the same lines, Amtrak actually owned (and technically still does) one of the original sets of LRC cars.
To return to the Webb three cylinder compounds, "Pennsylvania" built in 1888 was described as belonging to the first "Experiment" class, but was in any case a 2-2-2-0 while "Greater Britain" built in 1891 was a 2-2-2-2. "Queen Empress" which visited in 1893 was a "Greater Britain" type. All of these had the large diameter inside low pressure cylinder. I understand that this cylinder had no separate control of the valve gear but just reacted to the steam from the outside cylinders.I recall that there were problems on starting from a stand where the inside cylinder depending on its position, could start in either direction. I don't recall of problems where the locomotive was moving and the cylinder and valves would be operating in the normal forward mode.
I was unaware of any 710 engines being built outside the USA, although 645 engines and 265 engines had been built elsewhere.
One of the the features of the EMD two stroke was the complex fabication of the "top deck" which formed an exhaust manifold, which replaced a casting used in the very earliest 567 engines. Somewhere I heard that some 645 engines that were built in Europe, I think for MK or GE (before the merger) had reverted to cast top decks because modern techniques allowed a better result than the late 1930s engines and this cost less than the complex fabrication where the shop was not set up for mass production.
Overmod This was all during the great evolving cavitation scandals, where documentation changed almost from week to week (as did some of the stories and excuses...) As I recall, in both the original EMD H-block and the GE engine, they were using thin-section castings for the block, and the firing stresses for 6000hp caused ultrasonic vibrations at unfortunate 'reinforcing' or resonant locations which then had that sonoluminescent augmented wear and corrosion boogie... in all sorts of little nooks and crannies engineers hadn't predicted the trouble would occur. Exactly what the observed cumulative problems manifested as was never entirely clear, but metal thinning and a distressing number of potential pinhole coolant leaks into various places seem to be part of what could be expected.
I recall that the HDL engines had a very distinct "hollow" exhaust sound. There was a spot just outside Port Hedland where a train appeared over a hump in the track, but could be heard approaching for some time before this. You could also tell that the train had GE locomotives by the column of smoke, EMDs not giving this indication.
But you could hear the distinctive sound of the HDL before the train appeared. This was a "hollow" sound, and might be due to the thinner castings.
The cavitation problem had been experienced much earlier in German high speed diesel engines, the Mercedes Benz MB 820 being one of the early victims. This was used in the DB V200 locomotive, but was interchangeable with Maybach and MAN engines of similar power. Some Krupp engines also suffered from cavitation. Maybach engines were constructed from cast sections welded together and these, including those used in SP and DRGW locomotives suffered much less from this problem.
M636CI understand that this cylinder had no separate control of the valve gear but just reacted to the steam from the outside cylinders.
Where the problem developed was when the locomotive was backed onto a train that was departing upgrade. Naturally the train would have been marshalled with no slack, and when the locomotive was backed down (with the slip link fully and correctly in reverse) there would likewise be no slack against the train.
I think you see where this is going. On starting, you had one axle providing all the TE to start the whole train, engine and at least the first cars, UPGRADE. Naturally this might produce a slip. Even a couple of rotations would liberate enough exhaust mass flow to activate the LP cylinder... but the locomotive had not advanced far enough to slip the link, and the slip mass flow even with cylinder cocks open might well be -- and apparently often was -- enough to make the LP driver pair slip... in opposite rotation. Naturally the two TEs tended to cancel each other out, so the train wouldn't go anywhere but applying any steam to move it would only amplify the slipping.
If you have read Sinclair's History of the Locomotive Engine, he goes into some detail on a similar characteristic of the pre-Civil War Winans cam gear. This could get into a similar mislocked state, but it was equipped to take a so-called starting bar that was inserted and heaved over to set the gear in correct orientation. I do not know if this sort of thing was formally fitted to the Webb engines or if the engineman just grabbed a handy fire tool or pinch bar and 'got out and got under'.
Apparently the Greater Britains had enough improvement in either design or operation that they weren't considered the laughingstock the 2-2-2-0s were. But just the same when Whale came in he got rid of the lot in short order.
M636CMy recollection is that the Deutz engine model was "632". I have a copy of a page from a trade journal showing a cross section of the "V" engine. As I understand it, Deutz only built inline engines to this design and GE were intended to build all the V-type engines. Of course this might have changed after GE abandoned the design. Peter
The Jitong Railway in China sold five QJ 2-10-2 steam locomotives No. 6988, 7040 and 7081 to the America for tourist trains. Now they were IAIS 6988 ， IAIS 7081 ， R.J. Corman 2008.
postmark The Jitong Railway in China sold five QJ 2-10-2 steam locomotives No. 6988, 7040 and 7081 to the America for tourist trains. Now they were IAIS 6988 ， IAIS 7081 ， R.J. Corman 2008.
Three were ordered and built, but one was lost in transit, in the North Indian Ocean [NYS&W RR}. See link for details.
As to the Krauss-Maffei's [ML-4000]: Their original order for both the SP and DRG&W was documented, during their European test phase, by an article in TRAINS. It was because of their testing in Switzerland, and the Swiss Rail tunnel clearance issues; their inward sloaped cab design was needed.
SPRR also had some similar-builds, that were of an ALCO design (GP style, open side walks on engines).
Apparently, the only survivor of the ML-4000's is SP 9010; It had been converted to be used as a cameral platform for ROW crew training videos(?).
It was re configured back to ts more-or-less delivered condition, by a group affiliatred with a SPRR Historical Society (?).
As for those Russian TEM-7's; There were some photos published in TRAINS ,on a couple of occasions; They came about the time the Pepsi Corp, somehow, wound up with (IIRC) a Russian submarine('s?) (?). I believe those acquisitions, were products of then current, International monetary activities ( in 1980's (?) ).
Sameway, those (Russian TEM-7's), were the property of a Major [EXXON (?)] Oil Corp(?). Curiosities,they were just parked; in Houston Area,unused. They just sat,[ Unable to meet US or ARR rules or regulations for a number of years(?)].
In time they just fell off anyone's list of interests(?)
No idea as to their final fate (?).
The Boone & Scenic Valley has a Chinese JS class Mikado, the 8419. It was the last steam engine built at the Datong locomotive works.
Jeff
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