I have yet to see one of these unique locos. Do they run in a particular area or over a certain route?
"Red Barns" are SD40-2F"s, numbers 9000-9024. They were built in 1988.
I see on another thread that you are in the Chicago area. I'm not sure you are going to see any of these units anymore, as I don't think they qualify for use in the US due to these EPA Tier "whatever" requirements.
Bruce
So shovel the coal, let this rattler roll.
"A Train is a Place Going Somewhere" CP Rail Public Timetable
"O. S. Irricana"
. . . __ . ______
The SD40-2F's have turned up in the Chicago area in the past, although they didn't seem to have a specific assignment.
AgentKid "Red Barns" are SD40-2F"s, numbers 9000-9024. They were built in 1988. I see on another thread that you are in the Chicago area. I'm not sure you are going to see any of these units anymore, as I don't think they qualify for use in the US due to these EPA Tier "whatever" requirements. Bruce
As far as the emissions requirements; are the SD40-2Fs different than the large number of conventional SD40-2s still operating in the US? Do the emissions regs differ for locomotives operating in cross border service?
"I Often Dream of Trains"-From the Album of the Same Name by Robyn Hitchcock
The Red Barns are often seen in Southern Ontario. I don't think CP uses any SD40-2s anymore on trains to/from Western Canada, but there are still used on the shorter runs like Toronot-Montreal and Toronto - Buffalo/Detroit.
carnej1As far as the emissions requirements; are the SD40-2Fs different than the large number of conventional SD40-2s still operating in the US? Do the emissions regs differ for locomotives operating in cross border service?
I don't really understand these EPA ratings, but by reading between the lines on Canadian RR forums, I think the knock against the SD40-2F's, as compared to other SD40-2's, is that they were all built at EMD's former London, ON facility. A country of origin issue, moreso than a border crossing issue.
That doesn't make any sense since EMD switched all of their production to London in the 90s.
There are no EPA restrictions on these engines either unless they've been rebuilt recently without having the parts added to meet Tier 0+.
The last I saw, 10 of the 25 were tied up unserviceable. I think the rest can be found anywhere in Canada on trains that are usually assigned SD40s. If they don't get used in the USA at the moment it is probably because the slightly different inspection rules and intervals between the two countries mean that their FRA cards have expired.
John
The red barn locomotives are still in operation, and are one of my favorite types of locomotive. Although small in numbers they are a still pretty common on the mainline. They are almost always used on freight trains instead of coal or grain trains which typically have the newer locomotives. Vancouver always had them laying around the yards.
Canadian national has several ex BC Rail C40-8M's which are cowl units as well as a fair number of SD60F's. These locomotives are very welcome in the winter time as there is no snow to walk through on the walkways. They are also helpful in snow plow duty.
I have never heard anything about locomotives having to meet emissions requirements in order to operate in America and that statement seems far fetched to me. Certainly cars or trucks coming from Canada or Mexico do not have to meet our emissions requirements. Even with the emissions rules it cuts a lot of slack towards the older locomotives. You can keep running the same emissions at the old rate as long as the engine stays in the locomotive. If you take the engine out for overhaul it has to be rebuilt to new emissions standards. But those laws are from the USA and I doubt if Canada gives a hoot about emissions with a population of under 35 million for the entire country.
Your chances for seeing these historic locomotives operating in the USA are pretty minimal. They were fairly common in the Vancouver,BC area mostly working lines 100 miles or less from the main yard. Vancouver to Squamish trains and Squamish to Vancouver trains typically had older power with the cowl units.
A good way to find out where the locomotives are is to go to a website such as railpics.com or similar. Then type in the locomotive type and make sure the website gives you the most recent photos first. This will give you a good idea of what town they are likely to be in.
Thomas 9011I have never heard anything about locomotives having to meet emissions requirements in order to operate in America and that statement seems far fetched to me.
You are incorrect, as the captions to the following photo's indicate. To quote PDN jr. "neither photo is mine"
http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=403332&nseq=1
http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=403175&nseq=0
Why exactly do we trust those captions?
Union PAcific has tons of SD9043s working in the states. I see them every day in Roseville yard. They have not been modified at all.
so again I do not believe emissions has anything to do with it.
Can't vouch for the veracity of the captions but-I suspect these locos are old enough to received Tier O+ kits during overhaul.
Assuming they were overhauled recently (talking about the SD40-2s here)
Haven't seen Red Barns out this way (Vancouver) for a long time. I think they may still run on the prairies, but they don't come west of Calgary these days.
Thomas 9011 The red barn locomotives are still in operation, and are one of my favorite types of locomotive. Although small in numbers they are a still pretty common on the mainline. They are almost always used on freight trains instead of coal or grain trains which typically have the newer locomotives. Vancouver always had them laying around the yards. Canadian national has several ex BC Rail C40-8M's which are cowl units as well as a fair number of SD60F's. These locomotives are very welcome in the winter time as there is no snow to walk through on the walkways. They are also helpful in snow plow duty. I have never heard anything about locomotives having to meet emissions requirements in order to operate in America and that statement seems far fetched to me. Certainly cars or trucks coming from Canada or Mexico do not have to meet our emissions requirements. Even with the emissions rules it cuts a lot of slack towards the older locomotives. You can keep running the same emissions at the old rate as long as the engine stays in the locomotive. If you take the engine out for overhaul it has to be rebuilt to new emissions standards. But those laws are from the USA and I doubt if Canada gives a hoot about emissions with a population of under 35 million for the entire country. Your chances for seeing these historic locomotives operating in the USA are pretty minimal. They were fairly common in the Vancouver,BC area mostly working lines 100 miles or less from the main yard. Vancouver to Squamish trains and Squamish to Vancouver trains typically had older power with the cowl units. A good way to find out where the locomotives are is to go to a website such as railpics.com or similar. Then type in the locomotive type and make sure the website gives you the most recent photos first. This will give you a good idea of what town they are likely to be in.
Dan
They were used exclusively during the lifting of the Chalk River Sub in the Ottawa Valley this past summer. Not something I want to remember them for.
Steve
With the slow economy the majority of older power has been sitting on dead tracks waiting until traffic levels pick up. I know CP (or it could have been CN) recently bought 43 ex Oakway SD60's and gave them fresh paint jobs. Quite a unusual move for a class one railroad. I think it is safe to say that CP loves the SD50's and SD60's. It's also a strong indicator that the railroad is expecting a surge in traffic levels in the near future. The purchase and painting of the SD60's is also a good news for the red barns as CP seems to want to keep the SD50's and SD60's for what ever reasons.
Here in Denver there is long lines of C40-8's sitting dead in the yards. I haven't seen them run in years and they have been sitting dead for years. But once this economy picks up I think railroads will need every locomotive they can get their hands on.
CN bought the ex-Oakway SD60's, they are to numbered in the 5400 series.
CSSHEGEWISCH CN bought the ex-Oakway SD60's, they are to numbered in the 5400 series.
Here's a shot of one of the CN SD60s with a CN Dash 8MFlickr Link http://flic.kr/p/dgvgGa
I've also heard recently that the CP Red Barn SD40-2Fs are candidates for the SD30ECO rebuild program too.
Two reasons why older Canadian power disappears from time to time. First Canada allows one extra year between tear down inspections of the air brake equipment, so some Canada locomotives reach the end of their Air Brake certification in the US and then they are confined to Canada for a year until they have their Air Brake equipment overhauled at which time they have their US certificates renewed and they again can run in the US. The second is that when the CP SD90MACs were built there were no emissions standards, when Congress passed the Tier 0 standard and made it retroactive back to 1973 these locomotives were included if they were used in the US when it came time for an overhaul. CP was cheap and didn't bother to make them compliant and instead ordered them kept in Canada, there were a few incidents of them sneaking in to the US briefly, but they were hurriedly sent back. This past spring a very small handful, I have heard both two or three received the necessary upgrade to Tier 0+ standards, but EHH's decision that CP has excess power sent all SD90MACs back into storage, including the rebuilds.
Does anyone have any photos of the engine room of any of these units? Can you walk through either side either coming or going from the cab? I know the Canadian versions had a part of the cowl body pushed inward for visibility reasons on the engineers side. Those BC rail cowl units seemed massive when I used to watch them around Vancouver. They seem much bigger than another other locomotives.
Great shots CNW 6000. Where was the locations?
Thomas 9011Can you walk through either side either coming or going from the cab?
I'm not sure if I quite understand your question, but here are photos from mountainrailway.com of both the engineer's and fireman's side of the 9001. This is an excellent site to answer many CP loco questions.
http://www.mountainrailway.com/Roster%20Archive/CP%209000/CP%209001.htm
http://www.mountainrailway.com/Roster%20Archive/CP%209000/CP%209001-2.jpg
there's a few sd40-2s that roll through mn but mostly gevo's. i usually see a pair of gp 38's doing local frieght so i doubt emissions are the issue. i bet fuel cost is the main reason we don't see anything other than gevo's. also the pilots i've talked with don't like the good old emd's.
i wish they would run a red barn on the holiday train. that would be way cool.
I took a photo of 9023 in Calgary, Alberta on 30 March 2004.
It seems to me that CN had some of these as well, but I can't remember. Neat locomotives for sure!
The road to to success is always under construction. _____________________________________________________________________________ When the going gets tough, the tough use duct tape.
They ran on the ex D&H in New York as late as 2006, and were quite common there. See below:
Leading on the NS Southern Tier
http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=3263728
Trailing coming into Binghamton NY on the Tier
http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=3263760
A pair trailing about to enter East Bingamton yard
http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=3239755
Leading 164 south at the south end of East Binghamton
http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=3239763
And one for the Christmas season
http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=2787188
They used to run routinely on the D&H, though I have not seen any sightings of them there in the last few years. They were fairly common in the middle of the last decade:
Binghamton NY
http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=2869179
Two trailing at Sanitaria Springs
http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=3080029
Three on this one, also at Sanitaria Springs
http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=2872884
And Merry Christmas, 9014 is the leader
TAB
bubbajustin It seems to me that CN had some of these as well, but I can't remember. Neat locomotives for sure!
Closest thing that CN had would be the SD50F's and SD60F's.
All of CN's SD50F's are off roster. They have SD60F's from 5500-5563 (5512, 5514, 5555, & 5557-59 are gone). The ex-Oakway SD60s are CN 5400-5442.
CN's remaining SD40s are:SD40-2W CN 5242-5299, 5303-5362 (CN 5243, 47-9, 51-7, 58-60, 71, 78, 82, 85, 90, 92, 94, 97, 5306-15, 24, 27, 32-4, 42, 44, 53, 55, & 59-61 are retired)
SD40-25366-73, 5376-86 & 5391-2 (CN 5380, 5382, & 5384-5 retired)
SD40u6000-6028 (CN 6002, 04, 11, & 26 retired)
Thomas 9011 Great shots CNW 6000. Where was the locations?
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