Locomotive "Class Lights"

[bubbajustin]

Greetings all!

I recently downloaded Jointed Rail's freeware F7/F7B pack for Trainz 2010. (The locomotives are great may I add!)

What are the "Class Lights" used for? Their are red (which I assume means emergency) green, and lunar white. What do these colors mean, and when running a passenger train what color should I set them as? 

Thanks for the information!

-Justin

[mudchicken]

http://trn.trains.com/en/Railroad%20Reference/ABCs%20of%20Railroading/2006/05/Locomotive%20classification%20lights.aspx 

You almost don't see them anymore with GCOR and NORAC in place, and there are no more extra sections of passenger trains.

[bubbajustin]

Cool! Thanks for the link. Lots of good informtaion in there!

-Justin

[BaltACD]

Class lights have become a victim of two of the realities of railroad.

The current rules for Class I carriers GORC & NORAC have eliminated the old 'Timetable & Train Orders' method of operation.  With the elimination of that type of operation there is no need for class lights as there are no scheduled trains to have extra sections of and there are no Extra trains for class lights to be displayed on.

Secondly the FRA decrees if something is on a locomotive - it must work.  With the carriers not needing class lights to operate within their book of rule, class lights become just another problem area by which crews can SHOP a engine.  The FRA decrees, if it is there - it must work; the FRA does not decree that a locomotive must have them; ergo if the carriers don't need them - they physically remove them from the locomotive.

In TTTO operations; the display of GREEN class lights indicated there were following section(s) of specified scheduled train - in theory, if a train was to meet No. 97 at X, the train was on the siding at X until ALL sections of 97 had passed.  Schedules could be implemented for all classes of trains. 1st Class was normally (but not always) Passenger Trains.  2nd class was normally the lines feature merchandise trains.  3rd class was for secondary merchandise trains and local freights.  Trains were assigned their schedule by the Train Dispatcher and the Train Orders he issued.  In Train Orders, trains were referred to by both their schedule number and their locomotive number.  ie. No 1 Engine 1444 displaying no Class Lights or 1st No1 Engine 1444 and the lead locomotive would display Green Class lights; 2nd No 1 Engine 1452 etc.  If 2nd No 1 was the last of the sections of No 1 - the lead locomotive would have the class lights turned off.  The schedule for No. 1 was printed in the Timetable.  Trains that weren't either 1st, 2nd or 3rd Class were Extra trains and had to receive specific train order authority to run as a Extra train. ie. Extra 4444 West, Extra Trains would display White Class lights.   If a locomotive were on the rear of a train it would display Red Class Lights on the rear facing locomotive as Markers to denote the end of the train.  

TTTO was a method of operation that took time and experience to successfully operate - both from the Train Dispatcher and the train crews - time that is not available to train today's new employees that are hiring into the railroad with Conductor and Train Dispatcher being considered entry level positions.

[Rikers Yard]

Just a note, flags  served the same purpose as the lights. This is why fan trips and tourist lines fly white flags on the locos, they are an extra train, or "running extra".( If I remember rightly that was once the name of a colunm in Trains.) And it looks cool too!

Tim 

[CSSHEGEWISCH]

GM&O may have been the last major railroad to fly white flags on trains operating as extras.  I'm also old enough to remember both "Second Section" and "Running Extra" as features in TRAINS.  "Second Section" usually carried some extra commentary related to stories in that month's issue and "Running Extra" was a listing of upcoming fan trips, tours, etc.

[carnej1]

Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe Conrail ordered Class lights on all new locomotives right up until the end of it's independent existence. Even the SD8MAC's had them...

[cefinkjr]

CSSHEGEWISCH

 I'm also old enough to remember both "Second Section" and "Running Extra" as features in TRAINS.  "Second Section" usually carried some extra commentary related to stories in that month's issue and "Running Extra" was a listing of upcoming fan trips, tours, etc.

I'm right there with you on "Second Section" and "Running Extra".  Do you recall "Railway Post Office" in MR?  That was so much more appropriate than "Letters to the Editor".  If you recall "Railway Post Office", do you also recall that it carried a copy of a different, real RPO postmark every month.  THAT was a nice touch.

[erikem]

The "Railway Post Office" in MR had a drawing of a letter sorter at work in an RPO car, the Trains RPO section was the one with RPO cancellations.

When I started reading MR as a young lad, the front section started off with Off the Train Wire, followed by the AHC ad (BTW, whatever happened to them?), Trade Topics, Railway Post Office and finally At The Throttle. Remembered picking up a lot of railroad fundamentals (e.g. axle loading, narrow gauge vs standard gauge, etc) from the Bull Session appearing near the back.

- Erik

[ndbprr]

I suspect radios had a lot to do with the demise. Before them there needed to be something physical to identify the train. Now the engineer can tell someone.

[CSSHEGEWISCH]

I would tend to agree since the use of radio to contact train crews was a major factor in the operational change from timetable and train order to Track Warrant Control.

[ndbprr]

I suspect radios had a lot to do with the demise. Before them there needed to be something physical to identify the train. Now the engineer can tell someone.

[jeffhergert]

The rules for TWC, DTC and other similiar operating methods no longer used superiority between trains.  Without a need to classify trains as an extra train, a train running on a schedule, or a train running on a schedule with another section following,  the class lights became unnecessary.   

Even during the time of TT & TO, at least one railroad had notes in the time table on some subdivisions that didn't have regular trains that white classification signals need not be displayed by extra trains in CTC and/or multiple track territories.  They were still required in TT & TO territories.  

Until a few years ago, I noticed the new GE engines still had a blanked out spot for a toggle switch on the cab wall marked, "class lights."

Currently, when given authority to occupy the main track behind a train, we can no longer identify the train only by observing the engine number.  We must verify identity by talking by radio either to a crewmember of that train or the dispatcher.

Jeff

[nyc#25]

On Conrail locomotives, what was in the space normally allotted to

class lights were actually red rear end markers for when the locomotives

were running light or pushing a train as in helper operation.

[blue streak 1]

nyc#25

On Conrail locomotives, what was in the space normally allotted to

class lights were actually red rear end markers for when the locomotives

were running light or pushing a train as in helper operation.

Back in TT days class lights on some RRs  were just laterns that could be placed on fron of engines or on rear passenger car or caboose. Several old passenger cars near me still have the brackets.

So for Conrail class lights when a loco leading could be displayed and when loco at end becomes markers.

[Sunnyland]

The link given was very interesting, I didn't  know a lot about the lights, never saw a train with different sections where lights would have been needed. 

I always like the rotating lights, I've been told they are the Mars lights.  Used to see them flashing and knew the train we were waiting for was coming, it would reflect off the boxcars in the Yards where Dad worked. 

#844 has a red light on her front and I've been told that is the emergency light to be used if needed.

[Deggesty]

Sunnyland

The link given was very interesting, I didn't  know a lot about the lights, never saw a train with different sections where lights would have been needed. 

I always like the rotating lights, I've been told they are the Mars lights.  Used to see them flashing and knew the train we were waiting for was coming, it would reflect off the boxcars in the Yards where Dad worked. 

#844 has a red light on her front and I've been told that is the emergency light to be used if needed.

The red light on the front of 844 is lit if the engine is moving backwards and is at the rear of the train; it is not a class light or emergency light, but a marker indicating the rear of the train. See BaltACD's post on this thread on 3-8.