Does anyone know why EMD never built a 6 axle version of the GP-30. Or did they. It would be interesting to see what it would look like. Especially in the beautiful colors of the Chessie System. Any of you virtual designers/painters wanna try it? I would if I had the skill.
Also, was there ever a GP-45?
Thanks and happy train spotting.
oarb00 Does anyone know why EMD never built a 6 axle version of the GP-30. Or did they. It would be interesting to see what it would look like. Especially in the beautiful colors of the Chessie System. Any of you virtual designers/painters wanna try it? I would if I had the skill. Also, was there ever a GP-45? Thanks and happy train spotting.
A better question might be "Why wasn't the GP30 a GP24?" i.e why wasn't the GP30 a 2400 HP unit. I have read that the then current production EMD traction motor couldn't handle 2400HP in 4 axles,thus the GP30's 2250HP rating. The SD24(and SD28) were EMD's main 6 axle offering at the time of the GP30 and EMD saw no need to offer another 6 axle unit with 150 less HP to customers...
Now an upgraded SD24 with GP30 styling would have been an interesting locomotive. At that time B-B locomotives were the standard in the U.S RR industry, C-C locomotives were largely viewed as special purpose units, that changed a few years later, O.C..
"I Often Dream of Trains"-From the Album of the Same Name by Robyn Hitchcock
The GP22 prototype was changed to GP30 by GM marketing. The GE U25B had a 2 year jump on EMD, and marketing did not want a model designation that was 'less' than the competition. The '30' sounded bigger, and marketing listed '30 new features' to justify the GP30 tag. It must have worked as the GP30 did sell well(950 units vs 478 for the U25B).
EMD had an existing 6 axle offering(SD24 at the time), and by June 1964, was offering the SD35 model(2500 hp) in their catalog(as well as the GP35). The GP30 was a 'transitional' unit that pioneered many new technologies for EMD.
I have seen 'kit-bashed' HO models of SD30's that ride on Atlas SD35 chassis...
Jim Bernier
Modeling BNSF and Milwaukee Road in SW Wisconsin
oarb00Does anyone know why EMD never built a 6 axle version of the GP-30. Or did they. It would be interesting to see what it would look like. Especially in the beautiful colors of the Chessie System. Any of you virtual designers/painters wanna try it? I would if I had the skill. Also, was there ever a GP-45? Thanks and happy train spotting.
SD24 sales started off with a couple of good orders and then just died(AT&SF and UP). Only one SD24 was built during the production run of the GP30 and that was the single unit for Kennecott Copper. The companion non-turbocharged SD was the SD18 which also didn't sell well after and initial good start. Sales of all new diesel locomotives fell in the early '60s as all railroads completed the replacement of steam locomotives. It wasn't until late in 1963 that railroads began to replace failed designs, and worn out WW2 era locomotives that sales picked back up. Since railroads were not convinced that six-axle power was necessary or desirable for road power, four axle types were chosen, hence the sales went to GP30s,U25B, and C424 types. Sales of the SD35 were fairly limited, mainly going to eastern coal hauling roads.
You also have to remember that we were in a recession that started in 1959 and lasted into the early 60s (Which also killed off the remaining pockets of steam that were on standby and expected to be used for several more years at such roads as the Nickel Plate and Union Pacific). Most railroads had a surplus of modern power with the recession and had already retired many of their minority makes and early EMC/EMD power (SC switchers, FT's, early E's, etc.) before it started. The recession is the single biggest reason that the SD24 (Along with the SD18, GP18 and GP20) had such small production runs.
By the time things started to grow again in 1962, the GP30 was on the market and it sold in large numbers over a very short period of time. American railroads still considered CC locomotives as best suited for special duties and so bought large numbers of GP30's to finish off things like remaining Baldwins, FT survivors, FA's, to cascade GP7's and GP9's to local and yard service to replace such things as Alco's and FM switchers, and even as replacements for relatively modern EMD road locomotives like F3's.
The railroads that had wanted SD24's for specialized duties and for it's high horsepower had already made significant purchases just before the recession hit that had filled those duties (Usually mountain service on such roads like the Union Pacific, Santa Fe, Southern, and the Burlington). Most everyone else had had no interest and saw little need for it and purchased GE models and the GP30 when the economy improved and new locomotive purchases started back up.
As Leo points out, GP-30s are often cited as the first "second generation" diesels, i.e., diesels designed to replace first generation diesels (which were diesels designed to replace steam). I suspect by 1962 railroads that needed bigger engines had already bought all the SD-7, -9 or -18 engines they needed, and were buying GP-30's to replace early road engines like FTs (many of which were traded in during the early sixties for road switchers) or GP-7s (which could be downgraded from mainline service to secondary jobs and even yard switching).
In appearance the GP40X looks like a possible "GP45". Earl...
nssd70m In appearance the GP40X looks like a possible "GP45". Earl...
In appearance, yes; mechanically, definitely not. The only North American locomotives of which I'm aware that had V-20 engines were the various SD45 permutations and the SD80MAC.
CSSHEGEWISCH nssd70m In appearance the GP40X looks like a possible "GP45". Earl... In appearance, yes; mechanically, definitely not. The only North American locomotives of which I'm aware that had V-20 engines were the various SD45 permutations and the SD80MAC.
carnej1CSSHEGEWISCH nssd70m In appearance the GP40X looks like a possible "GP45". Earl... In appearance, yes; mechanically, definitely not. The only North American locomotives of which I'm aware that had V-20 engines were the various SD45 permutations and the SD80MAC. I would suspect that the 20 Cylinder 645 prime mover and larger cooling system would be too heavy for a 4 axle locomotive...
In addition, EMD would've had a lot of trouble effectively applying 3600hp to 4 axles in 1966-1971 with a fictional GP45 without creating a very slipperly locomotive like the U36B (This was years before they developed their Super Series wheelslip control like used on the GP50).
And I wouldn't be surprised to find out that the D77 traction motors couldn't of supported the full 3600hp going to just 4 of them (Much like why the the GP30 was derated 150hp since the four D57 traction motors couldn't handle the full 2,400hp load).
The other reason might be such a beast would have no job to do. What's the economic case for it? What does it replace or what does it allow you to do that you couldn't before?
-Don (Random stuff, mostly about trains - what else? http://blerfblog.blogspot.com/)
oltmannd What does it replace or what does it allow you to do that you couldn't before?
Wheelslip in notch 1 coming off the sand track comes to mind... I thought I read somewhere the U36B could do that as well...
Mike WSOR engineer | HO scale since 1988 | Visit our club www.WCGandyDancers.com
There was an article some years ago in, I think, Model Railroading about a person that decided to put together an HO SD-30 model from two GP-30 shells. Although a real SD-30 was never produced, the article was an interesting look at what might have been.
oarb00
do not know if you've seen this site on the SD30Take a look anyway
a hug
http://dieseldetailer.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=huh&action=display&thread=5285&page=1
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