Santa Fe PA Locomotives

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Posted by schlimm on Saturday, January 07, 2017 9:42 PM

UPENG95
That definitely is NOT Los Angeles.  The L.A. River doesn't curve at any location in the downtown area and the downtown area is the only location where the tracks would be very close.  In addition there would be SP/UP tracks on the oppposite side of the river also. Nice photos regardless!

Easy to say.  So where is it?

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Posted by SSW9389 on Sunday, January 08, 2017 2:35 AM

Likely very near A Tower at the east end of Argentine Yard. The TR4s were assigned to Argentine for most of their service.

schlimm

 

 
UPENG95
That definitely is NOT Los Angeles.  The L.A. River doesn't curve at any location in the downtown area and the downtown area is the only location where the tracks would be very close.  In addition there would be SP/UP tracks on the oppposite side of the river also. Nice photos regardless!

 

Easy to say.  So where is it?

 

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Monday, January 09, 2017 8:23 AM

Firelock76

Original ALCO PA six-wheel trucks are impossible to find, so I've been told, so both Doyle and the folks in Texas are doing the best they can. 

And as RME says, if they get them running again, who cares?

I'm not going to complain, either.  A PA with a 251 engine inside isn't that much of a stretch and keep in mind the Rock Island FA1's that were repowered with 567 engines and later re-trucked with Blomberg trucks when the Type B trucks were needed for trade-in for U25B's.

The intern might complain.  He griped mightily about re-powering the Flying Yankee with a 567 engine.

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
RME
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Posted by RME on Monday, January 09, 2017 9:58 AM

CSSHEGEWISCH
I'm not going to complain, either. A PA with a 251 engine inside isn't that much of a stretch ...

MUCH less so than any EMD or other Christine Jorgenson repower; it could even be argued that most of the 'experience' is the same from a modern 12-cylinder 251 as from a debugged-as-far-as-possible 244.  To say nothing of the fact that apparently there are no 16-cylinder 244s anywhere ... or, perhaps more importantly, any cranks to install in fabricated blocks, which really shuts down any thought of producing one right there.

and keep in mind the Rock Island FA1's that were repowered with 567 engines and later re-trucked with Blomberg trucks when the Type B trucks were needed for trade-in for U25B's.

The thing here is a bit different - Blomberg trucks are prototypical for a Rock Island FA 'restomod', but there really isn't any way Erie-built trucks work under anybody's PA.  (Keep in mind that the visible pieces from the Brazilian trucks are all correct for duplication, if any purists want to ante up the funds, cold hard cash please, to make the 'right' trucks for one of these units.)

Part of the situation with Flying Yankee, as I understood it, was that the proposed 567 installation was to be made as 'modular' as possible, so that little or no change in the historic fabric of the train itself was needed to install the more reliable and infinitely more maintainable engine.  It could be argued (I myself would so argue, but I don't know the full 'internal' or political story) that spending all that money on restoring the 201A to operating condition would much better have been spent on the train itself -- Preston Cook, who knows as much about these engines as anyone, thinks it extremely unwise to actually operate using any 201A.  That's not to say the money was wasted, as having at least one 201A in fully restored condition is important historically ... just saying that if the train is to recoup the money, time, and trouble put into its restoration by running in excursion service, it makes little or no sense to run the restored 201A into the ground doing so.  I don't want to open another can of worms discussion about where the Flying Yankee restoration is going, but I definitely think a 567 (ideally D block or later?) is a useful part of it.

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Posted by rcdrye on Monday, January 09, 2017 11:43 AM

The 201-A was basically complete in Claremont before the train was moved to Lincoln. 

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Posted by mudchicken on Monday, January 09, 2017 2:13 PM

SSW9389

Likely very near A Tower at the east end of Argentine Yard. The TR4s were assigned to Argentine for most of their service.

 
schlimm

 

 
UPENG95
That definitely is NOT Los Angeles.  The L.A. River doesn't curve at any location in the downtown area and the downtown area is the only location where the tracks would be very close.  In addition there would be SP/UP tracks on the oppposite side of the river also. Nice photos regardless!

 

Easy to say.  So where is it?

 

 

 

 

OK _Agree - It's somewhere around AY tower at the east end of Argentine yard near the 12th Street Bridge (18th Street Freeway Br/ US-69 had not been built yet, pre 1959)

Mudchicken Nothing is worth taking the risk of losing a life over. Come home tonight in the same condition that you left home this morning in. Safety begins with ME.... cinscocom-west
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Posted by MrATSF on Monday, January 09, 2017 9:29 PM

From May 1949 until it was re-engined in 1954, the 51-B cab unit was numbered63. It took the number 51-C in February 1955 to identify the 51 set as unique. In a general renumbering of all second cab units on A-B-A sets of the Santa Fe PAs the 52-B became 64 and others followed consecutively through 57-B becoming 69. Two units sets 70-70A through 73-73A were run around and 58-B through 62-B took the numbers 74 through 78.
 

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Posted by M636C on Tuesday, January 10, 2017 12:25 AM

RME

 

 
CSSHEGEWISCH
I'm not going to complain, either. A PA with a 251 engine inside isn't that much of a stretch ...

 

MUCH less so than any EMD or other Christine Jorgenson repower; it could even be argued that most of the 'experience' is the same from a modern 12-cylinder 251 as from a debugged-as-far-as-possible 244.  To say nothing of the fact that apparently there are no 16-cylinder 244s anywhere ... or, perhaps more importantly, any cranks to install in fabricated blocks, which really shuts down any thought of producing one right there.

 

 
and keep in mind the Rock Island FA1's that were repowered with 567 engines and later re-trucked with Blomberg trucks when the Type B trucks were needed for trade-in for U25B's.

 

The thing here is a bit different - Blomberg trucks are prototypical for a Rock Island FA 'restomod', but there really isn't any way Erie-built trucks work under anybody's PA.  (Keep in mind that the visible pieces from the Brazilian trucks are all correct for duplication, if any purists want to ante up the funds, cold hard cash please, to make the 'right' trucks for one of these units.)

Part of the situation with Flying Yankee, as I understood it, was that the proposed 567 installation was to be made as 'modular' as possible, so that little or no change in the historic fabric of the train itself was needed to install the more reliable and infinitely more maintainable engine.  It could be argued (I myself would so argue, but I don't know the full 'internal' or political story) that spending all that money on restoring the 201A to operating condition would much better have been spent on the train itself -- Preston Cook, who knows as much about these engines as anyone, thinks it extremely unwise to actually operate using any 201A.  That's not to say the money was wasted, as having at least one 201A in fully restored condition is important historically ... just saying that if the train is to recoup the money, time, and trouble put into its restoration by running in excursion service, it makes little or no sense to run the restored 201A into the ground doing so.  I don't want to open another can of worms discussion about where the Flying Yankee restoration is going, but I definitely think a 567 (ideally D block or later?) is a useful part of it.

 

What 567 is being suggested for use in the "Flying Yankee"?

Remember that the 201A was a straight eight, and sat very low in the frames. Since all 567s are vee-type, could one be fitted without modifying the power car frames?

A Cummins QSK 19 would sound like a good option as an in line six and these are good for 750 HP. You would need a matching alternator too, of course.

It would probably sound different. I don't think I've ever heard a 201A running.

On the subject of sound and back on topic, a 244 sounds quite different from a 251. Certainly a 12-244 has much more of a distinctive "snarl" than a 12-251, sounding perhaps more like an Italian sports car when in notch 8. Sixteen cylinder Alcos (251s, anyway, I've never heard a 16-244) have a distinctive chugging, not heard with a 12 cylinder, and the 244 might have  a chugging under load (one earlier post mentioned this) as well as a snarl not heard  from a 16-251....

Of course, I don't imagine you'll find a !6-244 to drop in the Texas PA locomotive but there might be a working 12-244 for it somewhere.

Peter

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Posted by kgbw49 on Saturday, January 14, 2017 10:32 AM

ATSF PA 75 at Fort Worth TX under the lights...

Image result for atsf texas chief

A-B-B PA 58 at Joliet IL...

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A few other early-model Alcos on the ATSF roster...

RS-2 2099 - the only unit of this type on the roster...

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S-4 1536...

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S-2 2329...

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RSD-5 2134...

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RSD-15 units...

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RSD-5 2135 from two angles...

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RSD-15s on tonnage in Crozier Canyon AZ...

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RSD-15s on tonnage at Summit CA...

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RSD-15s on tonnage at unidentified location...

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Posted by kgbw49 on Sunday, January 15, 2017 9:18 PM

San Bernardino shops...

A-B-A on Raton Pass...

Image result for santa fe passenger trains on raton pass

 

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Posted by Blackcloud 5229 on Monday, January 16, 2017 2:22 AM

Santa Fe 1536 is misidentified as a S-2 it actually is a S-4. A-2 have Blount trucks and S-4 have AAR type A trucks.

 Great photos brings me back to the early 70s when Penn Central had ALCO switchers and road switchers everywhere. To this day an ALCO 539T powered switcher is my favorite power in the yard. While I haven't see a live ALCO S class switcher operating in a few years there is still an ALCO S 539T powered switcher at the old 1st street yard Boston, Massachusetts ex New Haven sitting behind chain link fence. It hasn't run in years but how many intact S class ALCO switchers do you know off?

 

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Tuesday, January 17, 2017 8:56 AM

The RSD15's in Crozier Canyon are proof that there are already locomotives in an ATSF Heritage paint job, they are working in Long Beach on Pacific Harbor Line.

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
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Posted by RAY HEROLD on Tuesday, January 17, 2017 1:34 PM
The Santa Fe PA's when re-done by the Delaware and Hudson, were also beautiful to see, hear, and photograph.
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Posted by Al Baum on Wednesday, February 22, 2017 8:48 AM

In the early 50s the Erie used PAs occasionaly in their commuter ops out of Jersey City.  I recall a holiday (Labor Day?) in 1950 or 51 when the afternoon local from JC to Waldwick was made up of a PA and two Stillwells.  After turning in the Waldwick yard the PA with its "train" need only idle to go east to Hohokus.

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Posted by TrainMan5632 on Tuesday, March 07, 2017 9:46 AM
The Mail Train No. 4 looks like it is A-A-B-B

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Posted by ERIC LANG on Monday, March 13, 2017 6:33 PM

BaltACD

Better days in the past

 

Really sad; makes you wanna cry.

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Posted by kgbw49 on Friday, March 31, 2017 8:03 PM

A-A-B waiting to tie on to 76 at Clovis NM...

Image result for santa fe in clovis nm

A-B on the ready track at Clovis NM...

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A-A-B-A on the Fast Mail in Kansas City...

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In the lineup at Clovis NM...

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On the platform in Clovis NM...

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Kansas City Union Station...

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PAs meet at speed...

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Texas Chief at speed...

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Unidentified three car train - company private varnish, perhaps?...

Image result for santa fe passenger trains in texas

The Golden Gate in the San Joaquin Valley...

Image result for santa fe passenger trains in fresno

Line up at Barstow CA...

Image result for santa fe passenger trains in chicago il

Grand Canyon in Chillicothe IL...

Image result for santa fe passenger trains in arizona

 

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