Stein,
No apologies needed on your verbose" answer, as the information is quite interesting. Guess my original question was a bit like asking if Rock Springs Wyoming was on the Central Pacific line, with Rock Springs being on UP's side of the original transcon.
One reason for asking is that my grandfather (farfar) was from a village about 15 km north of central Arvika. I downloaded a modern map of Arvika and noted the rail line, some googing showed that is the line between Oslo and Stockholm - amused to note that Arvika is closer to Oslo than Stockholm.
Takk,
- Erik
P.S. Just found out that Stein died at the age of 47 (this being written 8:10PM PDT on Oct 8). I thoroughly enjoyed the conversation with him on this thread and am feeling very sad that that he's no longer with us.
erikem steinjr 2) "My" line - branching off from the main line at Lillestrøm east of Oslo, and running along the Glomma river up to Kongsvinger on the border with Sweden, and Is this part of the line that passes through Arvika?
steinjr 2) "My" line - branching off from the main line at Lillestrøm east of Oslo, and running along the Glomma river up to Kongsvinger on the border with Sweden, and
2) "My" line - branching off from the main line at Lillestrøm east of Oslo, and running along the Glomma river up to Kongsvinger on the border with Sweden, and
Is this part of the line that passes through Arvika?
Kinda - the part from Lillestrøm in Norway to Kongsvinger (later extended to Magnor on the border with Sweden) is the Norwegian State Railroad's "Kongsvinger line".
The line going from Magnor on the Norwegian/Swedish border though Charlottenberg, Arvika, Karlstad, Kristineham to the junction town of Laxå on the mainline between Stockholm and Gothenburg is the Swedish Railroad's "Värmland line"
But trains run from Oslo through Kongsvinger to Charlottenberg, from Oslo through Kongsvinger to Karlstad/Kristinehamn and from Oslo through Kongsvinger etc to Stockholm, so for practical purposes it is the same line.
From my local depot at Sorumsand, I can take several passenger trains into Oslo - the NSB class 69 and NSB class 72 (and from December also the new NSB class 75) Electric Motor Unit commuter trains operated by NSB from Årnes or Kongsvinger to Oslo, the Swedish State Railroad's Intercity trains from Stockholm to Oslo (RC4 electric locos - similar to the AEM7s, pulling passenger cars), and the two car X-52 Regina EMUs of Swedish private railroad company "Värmlandstrafik" which runs from Karlstad to Oslo. The Kongsvinger Line is one of four connections between the Norwegian and Swedish railroad lines - the four, from south to North are: - Between Halden and Gothenburg in Sweden (and onwards to Denmark and the continent) - Between Kongsvinger and Karlstad/Stockholm in Sweden (Kongsvingerbanen) - Between Trondheim/Meråker in Norway and Østersund in Sweden (mid-central Norway/Sweden) and - Between Narvik in Norway and Kiruna in Sweden ("Malmbanan" - "The [iron] Ore Line")
I guess that was an overly verbose way of saying "yes" ;-)
Smile, Stein
steinjr The narrow gauge (which is the pride of my small home town of Sørumsand, thanks to the many volunteers who run the railroad on their spare time) is a small segment of a few miles left of the tertiary railroad Urskog-Hølandsbanen (ø = o with a slash). It is 750 mm (about 2 1/2 foot) gauge. Operated from 1896 to 1945 as a private railroad company, from 1945 until 1961 as a branch line of the Norwegian State Railroads, and then a group of enthusiasts took over to run it as museum railroad on a small part of the track.
The narrow gauge (which is the pride of my small home town of Sørumsand, thanks to the many volunteers who run the railroad on their spare time) is a small segment of a few miles left of the tertiary railroad Urskog-Hølandsbanen (ø = o with a slash).
It is 750 mm (about 2 1/2 foot) gauge. Operated from 1896 to 1945 as a private railroad company, from 1945 until 1961 as a branch line of the Norwegian State Railroads, and then a group of enthusiasts took over to run it as museum railroad on a small part of the track.
Sounds like they served pretty much the same purpose as the 600mm lines in Sweden - I rode the Mariefred line in 1986.
I'll try a quick and dirty translation of the article from Indre Akershus Blad: Photo caption:
It was a historic moment when "Tertitten" [the nickname for UHB - derived from the fact that the railroad was a "tertiary railroad" - i.e. narrow gauge railroad with gauge even narrower than 1067 mm] lead by the locomotive "Setskogen" and the "carriage train" with Caroline in front ran side by side outside Sørumsand [a small town about 35 miles east of Oslo].
A "carriage train" is a passenger train with old fashioned passenger cars, where each compartment has it's own door to the outside, and there is not central corridor down through the car. The conductor walked down along the outside of the train on a foot board, knocking on each door window to collect tickets from the passengers. It is a style of car that comes from Britain, and which wasn't all that popular with conductors - Norway has a worse climate than Britain - no fun walking on a board on the outside when it snows, is icy, cold and windy.
Main article:
Five minutes past ten today railroad history happened at Sørumsand - a historic moment it may be a long time until the next time you can experience.
In connection with the Kongsvinger Line's 150th anniversary the 151 year old locomotive Caroline fronted the jubilee, while the UHB locomotive Setskogen and it's cars and passengers took part in the celebration.
After departing from Sørumsand station about at the same time, the two trains met at Fyen [a farm name] outside Sørumsand.
The two trains flirted over a stretch of a few hundred yards between Sørumsand station and Bingsfos station [on the narrow gauge line], before Caroline continued towards Årnes [further east, upriver] and Setskogen continued towards Fossum [the end of the line for the museum railroad]
The 150th anniversary gathered thousands of people at the depots both at Fetsund [population about 6600] and Sørumsand [population about 4300].
At Sørumsand both the Tertitten [museum railroad], Bingen lenseminneforening [a volunteer society dedicated to preserving remnants of the log floating installations on the river], Sørumsand Senior High School, the [elementary school] marching band and the volunteer's association [who organize volunteers to help the sick and elderly with various errands] got to present themselves as part in the celebration.
Read more about the 150th anniversary in the paper edition on Monday.
It's a small town - people tend to be members of lots of different volunteer organizations :-)
Another local newspaper had more pictures showing the carriage cars etc here - just go through the pictures to see em: http://www.rb.no/lokale_nyheter/article6260356.ece
Btw - good to see that mayor Are has recovered from his marathon. In a moment of ill advised hubris he promised to run a marathon race if his party won the municipal election. They won the election. After finishing in about 5 hrs 30 he vowed to never make such dumb promises again :-)Smile,Stein
To steinjr: Thanks again for the photos AND the history lesson!
steinjr Today, our normal gauge mainline (Kongsvingerbanen - The Kongsvinger Line, running between Lillestrom and Kongsvinger in Norway) today celebrated it's 150th anniversary, and had a visit from a very classy old lady - the steam engine "Caroline" - which was built in 1861 by Robert Stephenson & Co in Newcastle on Tyne in England. She pulled a train consisting of old passenger cars from the same era. Our local newspaper caught an excellent picture of Caroline on the standard gauge main (upper right) and a double headed narrow gauge passenger train pulled by locomotives "Setskogen" and "Prydz" on the narrow gauge line at lower left: http://www.indre.no/lokale_nyheter/article6260731.ece Smile, Stein
Today, our normal gauge mainline (Kongsvingerbanen - The Kongsvinger Line, running between Lillestrom and Kongsvinger in Norway) today celebrated it's 150th anniversary, and had a visit from a very classy old lady - the steam engine "Caroline" - which was built in 1861 by Robert Stephenson & Co in Newcastle on Tyne in England. She pulled a train consisting of old passenger cars from the same era. Our local newspaper caught an excellent picture of Caroline on the standard gauge main (upper right) and a double headed narrow gauge passenger train pulled by locomotives "Setskogen" and "Prydz" on the narrow gauge line at lower left: http://www.indre.no/lokale_nyheter/article6260731.ece
Steinjr:
You'll have to bear with me, as a slightly linguistically challenged American- I was raised in Tennessee and Mississippi, and then move to Kansas ( Am still trying to learn Kanglish from my Native Kansan wife.
My fall back here is Google Translator; I ran your link through that and did, I think get a reasonable Translation @ http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=no&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.indre.no%2Flokale_nyheter%2Farticle6260731.ece&act=url
Anyway: Here is the ranslated caption from the 'Foto' by Mr. Samuelsen :"...It was a historic moment when Tertitten with Setskog in front and tub train with Caroline at the helm ran side by side outside Sørumsand. Foto: Svein Samuelsen..."
At first glance I failed to notice there were TWO locomotives on the Narrow Gauge train (750mm(?). They are really beautifully preserved. Also from the caption, referencing the train pulled by the locomotive" Caroline" . What is a "TUB" train? { Is this possibly a 'glitch' in the translator function?}
here is more of the translated article by Mr. Svein Samuelsen:
"It was formed railway history at Omega this morning, the anniversary of Kongsvingerbanen."
Published 29/09/2012 at 11:55 am Updated 9/29/2012 at 12:28
"...Five minutes past ten today happened railway history of Omega, a story it will be long until the next time one can experience.
In connection with Kongsvinger Railway 150th anniversary set it 151 years old Caroline locomotive at the head of the anniversary, while Tertitten locomotive Setskog with their wagons and passengers participated in the celebration.
After leaving the Omega station about the same time met the two trains at Fyen off Omega.
The two trains flirted over a distance of several hundred meters between Omega Bingsfos station, before Caroline continued to Årnes and Setskog against Fosssum.
150-year anniversary together the way thousands of people on both Fetsund and Omega Drive.
The Omega got both Tertitten, Bingen Lens Memory Association, school music, Omega High School and Central Voluntary Sørum mark.
Read more about the 150th anniversary of the printed editions of Inner sheet Akershus Monday..."
Thanks for sharing this with us. It is always gratifying to know the enthusiasm that others share with us in railway preservation.
Thanks for pictures, there wonderful! Everything looks so very well cared for.
Tim
It is 750 mm (about 2 1/2 foot) gauge. Operated from 1896 to 1945 as a private railroad company, from 1945 until 1961 as a branch line of the Norwegian State Railroads, and then a group of enthusiasts took over to run it as museum railroad on a small part of the track. Here is the Wikipedia entry in English for it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Urskog%E2%80%93H%C3%B8land_Line
They run quite often - three or four trips every Sunday in the summertime, as well as on various other occasions and for photo charters and tours. Me and my family has made a tradition of going for the New Year's Ride.
Locos on the UHB aren't that old - the newest - 2-6-2T no 7 ("Prydz" - named for a former manager of the railroad) was built by Henschel in Germany in 1950 - i.e. only 11 years before the narrow gauge side line was taken out of service due to increased competition from buses, trucks and cars post WW2. The loco heading the narrow gauge consist in the newspaper photo (No 4 - "Setskogen" - named for one of the parishes served) was built by Hartmann in Chemnitz, Germany, in 1909, so it is just over 100 years old.
Caroline is an older locomotive. She was built by Robert Stephenson & co in Newcastle on Tyne in 1861 - i.e. in the opening year of the American civil war. And yes - Robert Stephenson was the son of George Stephenson - of "The Rocket" fame. Early railroading in Norway was built by British engineers. Our first railroad was the narrow gauge (later normal gauge) "Hovedbanen" ("main line") from Oslo (which back then was called Christiania) to Eidsvold on Lake Mjøsa. People and goods could be transported from the harbor in Oslo to the lake, and then transported far inland on Lake Mjøsa. This was completed in 1854.
Then in the early 1860s three new lines were built - 1) From Hamar on Lake Mjøsa east to Grundset (near present day Elverum in the Østerdalen (Eastern Valley) Valley, so lumber floated down that valley could be taken across to lake Mjøsa, brought south by boat and then taken to the export harbor at Oslo
2) "My" line - branching off from the main line at Lillestrøm east of Oslo, and running along the Glomma river up to Kongsvinger on the border with Sweden, and 3) A line from Trondheim in mid-central Norway uphill (southwards) to Støren, where two valleys meet, and where ore could be collected for shipment downhill (northwards) to Trondheim. Caroline - which is the third oldest steam engine in the world still operating - is an NSB class 2a - i.e. the second class of locomotives built for NSB - a 2-4-0 steam engine. She (NSB loco no 17) and her two sisters (locos #15 and #16) ran for the Norwegian State Railroads on the Kongsvinger Line from 30+ years from the line opened in 1862, but in 1896 she couldn't keep up with the need for power any more and was transferred to another line with less traffic. In 1906 her two sisters suffered the same fate. In 1920 no 17 was sold to a paper mill, which used her from 1921 to 1953, when the Norwegian State Railroads repurchased her to use her for their 100th anniversary in 1954. Two of the three Stephenson locos built for the start of the Kongsvinger Line is still with us - no 16 is a static display at the Railroad Museum at Hamar and no 17 ("Caroline"), who also belongs to the railroad museum at Hamar, is used for excursions and PR work. Several of the UHB narrow gauge locos are still with us as well. The line originally had 7 locos - not all in use at the same time. Of these seven, five are preserved - three (no 4 "Setskogen", no 6 "Høland" and no 7 "Prydz") are still used for the museum railroad line, one - no 2 "Urskog" is at the railroad museum at Hamar, and one - no 5 "Bjørkelangen" is preserved in operating condition at my alma mater - the Norwegian Institute of Technology in Trondheim, where the mechanical engineering students keep her running - on about one and a half loco length of track :-) In total there are about 45-48 preserved steam locomotives in Norway, of which maybe 25% are still operational. The rest are static display models. A lot of us like trains :-) Smile, Stein
Nice!
I'd also be interested in the gauge of the narrow gauge line. FWIW, I could make out maybe half of the text of the article, took German in High School, was exposed to Svensk in the 1980's and mi farmor was from near Stavanger.
Wonderful photo, thanks so much for posting! Who says "ghosts" don't exist? Anyway, what can you tell us about "Caroline"? Is she kept in a museum in Norway and trotted out for special occasions?
Beautiful photo! I've saved it - now all I have to do is photoshop the catenary poles and wire out of the picture to backdate it to 1880 or so.
Incidentally, what gauge do those doubleheaded minilocos run on?
Chuck
Today Yesterday, our normal gauge mainline (Kongsvingerbanen - The Kongsvinger Line, running between Lillestrom and Kongsvinger in Norway) celebrated it's 150th anniversary, and had a visit from a very classy old lady - the steam engine "Caroline" - which was built in 1861 by Robert Stephenson & Co in Newcastle on Tyne in England. She pulled a train consisting of old passenger cars from the same era. Our local newspaper caught an excellent picture of Caroline on the standard gauge main (upper right) and a double headed narrow gauge passenger train pulled by locomotives "Setskogen" and "Prydz" on the narrow gauge line at lower left: http://www.indre.no/lokale_nyheter/article6260731.ece
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