I headed down to the Reading & Northern for 2102 on Saturday, but unfortunately, the firing table failed and the T1 had to be removed from the train. We had a good time anyway, as seen below.
https://youtu.be/3GKNOQ4KnOk
Harrison
Homeschooler living In upstate NY a.k.a Northern NY.
Modeling the D&H in 1978.
Route of the famous "Montreal Limited"
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Is a firing table another name for a grate?
MidlandMike Is a firing table another name for a grate?
I believe the firing table is a component of the automatic stoking system, it's a "tray" where the coal is delivered before it's sprayed into the firebox by steam jets.
According to Andy Muller's message apologizing for 2102's failure it was supposed to be a NEW firing table! I hope he gets a refund!
I was wondering why the R&N website showed the October 29 trip (even the Pullman rooms) as "sold out". I was ready to buy tickets. Dang!
Rick
rixflix aka Captain Video. Blessed be Jean Shepherd and all His works!!! Hooray for 1939, the all time movie year!!! I took that ride on the Reading but my Baby caught the Katy and left me a mule to ride.
I think those R&N trips are sold out almost as soon as they're posted! That is one popular railroad!
Nothing to see here: there was damage to the table ahead of the stoker distributor, the plate off which the steam jets distribute the coal to different zones in the firebox. They'll replace the casting.
The interesting thing is that, according to a somewhat mysterious post on RyPN, this is the second time the firing table on 2102 has started to crumble. That would be unusual enough to have me question how the foundry is making these up.
Don't go into "why didn't they hand-fire it and push it with the SD50s?"
Overmod Don't go into "why didn't they hand-fire it and push it with the SD50s?"
And then you have the people asking "why didn't they put 425 on the train when 2102 failed?" Some people don't understand how many hours it takes to prepare and fire a locomotive.
If they could have found enough rope I suspect they could have gotten all the help they would need to push and pull the locomotive by "manpower".
Same me, different spelling!
Only 2124, of the preserved T1s, has the roller bearings...
Harrison Overmod Don't go into "why didn't they hand-fire it and push it with the SD50s?" And then you have the people asking "why didn't they put 425 on the train when 2102 failed?" Some people don't understand how many hours it takes to prepare and fire a locomotive.
You mean they don't just flip a switch and have 200 pounds of boiler pressure[/sarcasm]
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
HarrisonAnd then you have the people asking "why didn't they put 425 on the train when 2102 failed?" Some people don't understand how many hours it takes to prepare and fire a locomotive.
Not just that, but 425 couldn't handle a consist that big by itself, not in that terrain, and probably not even in the flatlands it was originally built for. It would need a diesel assist any way you look at it.
OvermodNothing to see here: there was damage to the table ahead of the stoker distributor, the plate off which the steam jets distribute the coal to different zones in the firebox. They'll replace the casting. The interesting thing is that, according to a somewhat mysterious post on RyPN, this is the second time the firing table on 2102 has started to crumble. That would be unusual enough to have me question how the foundry is making these up. Don't go into "why didn't they hand-fire it and push it with the SD50s?"
Is it known if the piece is cast iron or cast steel?
Cast iron, so I have been told, doesn't handle differential heating very well without cracking.
Most of the parts of a stoker like the HT-1 are cast steel. The firing table is cast iron.
http://www.multipowerinternational.com/spec/table.pdf
Overmod Most of the parts of a stoker like the HT-1 are cast steel. The firing table is cast iron. http://www.multipowerinternational.com/spec/table.pdf
I wonder if it was new cast iron or questionable recycled material?
At any rate Andy Muller should ask for a refund!
There is some interesting technical discussion about this on RyPN. Apparently the firing table was considered a 'wearing' part with limited lifetime on the Reading, and there were special tools used to keep the 'heel' at the back of the grate clear of the firing-table structure.
Note that the drawing I posted is from a company in New Jersey that offers HT-1 parts for sale, including firing tables. They might be a sensible source for information on what caused this problem, what the technical basis for the 'crumbling' was, and what instructions go to the foundry to prevent an "encore presentation".
I've ridden behind many 4-8-4s including the RDG species. But I've never been pulled by SD50s. Sorry I missed it.
Editor Emeritus, This Week at Amtrak
D.Carleton I've ridden behind many 4-8-4s including the RDG species. But I've never been pulled by SD50s. Sorry I missed it.
I've always likes SD50s since I first saw a pair at speed. (They will be enormously rare in preservation!)
Word is now in: the crew had a problem with debris in or on the steam jets that caused coal to build up on the firing table long enough for the coal to ignite and heat the table by conduction. Multiple firing tables had been made up, so it turned out to be straightforward to replace with the engine cold. This has already been done, and 2102 will 'make up for it' by running an excursion that was supposed to be 425's swan song before 1472-day.
Is it possible that the coal was dirty enough to clog the jets ?. barely recall some out fit noted it received "poor" coal. do not know coal is prepared.
OvermodI've always likes SD50s since I first saw a pair at speed. (They will be enormously rare in preservation!) Word is now in: the crew had a problem with debris in or on the steam jets that caused coal to build up on the firing table long enough for the coal to ignite and heat the table by conduction. Multiple firing tables had been made up, so it turned out to be straightforward to replace with the engine cold. This has already been done, and 2102 will 'make up for it' by running an excursion that was supposed to be 425's swan song before 1472-day.
Doesn't the fireman have on the engine deck or tender tools that are able to knock coal build up off the firing table when it is observed, before it can damage the firing table from differential heating stresses on cast iron?
blue streak 1Is it possible that the coal was dirty enough to clog the jets?
Someone on RyPN has mentioned that there is a special tool, shaped a bit like a hockey stick, that is meant to clear any 'heel' at the back of the firebox that might overheat the firing-table casting. This tool should logically serve to clear any accumulation of coal or glassy ash that might be adhering to the table or overheating it by conduction.
This discussion just goes to show that I don't belong in the cab of a steam locomotive.
Overmod blue streak 1 Is it possible that the coal was dirty enough to clog the jets? Coal doesn't go through the jets; only steam does. Personally I find it unlikely that fired coal can plug or stick to the nozzles to keep them from acting correctly, but I have not yet seen pictures of the situation that would clarify this. Someone on RyPN has mentioned that there is a special tool, shaped a bit like a hockey stick, that is meant to clear any 'heel' at the back of the firebox that might overheat the firing-table casting. This tool should logically serve to clear any accumulation of coal or glassy ash that might be adhering to the table or overheating it by conduction.
blue streak 1 Is it possible that the coal was dirty enough to clog the jets?
Coal doesn't go through the jets; only steam does. Personally I find it unlikely that fired coal can plug or stick to the nozzles to keep them from acting correctly, but I have not yet seen pictures of the situation that would clarify this.
The use of a tool, requires someone to realize that the tool needs to be used. The Fireman has to do more than just manipulate the controls of the stoker - he has to observe the fire in the firebox as well as the operation of all the parts of the stoker including recognizing that there is a situation that is going to damage the firing table and resolving that situation before there is damage.
pennytrains This discussion just goes to show that I don't belong in the cab of a steam locomotive.
Me neither, but wow would I love to give it a shot!
Folks riding behind those SD50's could have done a lot worse. Those are some classy looking diesels!
CSSHEGEWISCH D.Carleton I've ridden behind many 4-8-4s including the RDG species. But I've never been pulled by SD50s. Sorry I missed it. Not a blasphemous thought. There have been a variety of fantrips pulled by diesels because they were a specific model. The Reading & Northern diesels on this trip did have the special "Fast Freight" paint job, making them somewhat special in their own right.
We're back for the southbound chase, but not before some action in the Lehigh Gorge.
https://youtu.be/Cg-OxxWmU90
As a note: One of the Chessie Steam Specials was unexpectedly 'dieselized' circa 1977, and the substitute power included an early SD (7 or 9) in full Chessie paint. I confess that I was so angry about the absence of steam power that I didn't take notes...
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