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Military Railways from the WWI Era (France)

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Posted by JimValle on Monday, December 19, 2011 4:57 PM

According to Fred Westing ( The locomotives that Baldwin Built  )  The Eddystone works started building two foot guage trench locomotives for the British and French as early as late 1914.  The French ordered a double ended Peshot type 0-4-4-0 and the British specified a ten wheeler.  Both types were tank locomotives.  After the U.S. entered the war the Government ordere up a large batch of standard guage 2-8-0s based on locomotives being supplied to the British at the time.  These became the famous Pershing engines.  Westing specifies that they were shipped structurally complete and on their wheels except for the headlight, smokestack and cab which were added when the engines were set up for running at St. Nazaire.  At peak production these engines were being turned out at the rate of 300 a month.  During World War II the design became the basis for the G.I. 2-8-0.  Baldwin narrow guage trench engines built for the U.S. government included 2-6-2s and some of these were still in use on domestic military posts, notably Fort Dix, during WWII.

 

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Posted by Firelock76 on Friday, December 23, 2011 7:46 PM

Per 54light15's comment about the US being an angry place after the war, I think a frustrated place would be closer to the mark.  You see, patience has never been an American strong suit, we tend to want what we want NOW and don't like waiting for it.  It takes time for things to return to normal after a cataclysm like WW2, and the people of the time didn't seem to realize that.  There's an old cowboy saying:  "There's gonna be a lot of torn up ground after a herd's  stampeded."  Folks would do well to remember that.

Besides Bill Mauldins "Back Home"  an excellent history of the immediate postwar years can be found in a book called  "The GI War"  by Ralph G. Martin.  It's been out of print for a number of years but it's a superb history of the war and its aftermath from the GI's point of view.  Be on the lookout for it and grab it if you can find it!

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Posted by 54light15 on Saturday, December 24, 2011 2:50 PM

Firelock, I think you're right. One of Mauldin's cartoons show Willie and Joe visiting a friend in a hospital with both of his legs in casts. He says, "How's things outside, boys? Am I still a war hero or a drain on the taxpayers?"

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Posted by Firelock76 on Saturday, December 24, 2011 6:25 PM

Bingo!   And to swerve us back to the main topic:  We all refer to the WW2 generation as "The Greatest Generation".  Know who THEY consider the greatest generation to be?.  The Doughboys of World War One.  I should know, I've met and talked to quite a few of them over the years.

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, January 2, 2012 3:08 AM

The Turks with German partners built military railways in the Holy Land in WWI. a;; 600mm gauge, with German steam locomotives.   They also used the Hijaz Railway for military purposes.   The Germans had an air base (yes WWI "airoplanes") at Afulla, a still existing, now mostly Israeli Jewish, town about half way between the Sea of Galilee (Lake Tiberius) and Haifa, the latter then being quite a cosmopolitan city as the region's major ship port.   The German airmen liked to take their pass or leave time to sample varous pleasures in Haifa, not necessaly limited to the excellent beach.  For transportaton to and from, they mounted a regular aircraft engine and propeller on a 4-wheel gondola car and with enough gasoline used propeller driven rail transportation to and from their vacation spot until the front collapsed and the British took over.  This line was slightly different than meter gauge, the same as Jordan's Railways today.

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Posted by Firelock76 on Tuesday, January 3, 2012 4:55 PM

To DaveK:  Thanks for the story about that German propeller driven gondola.  I'm a student of the First World War, especially the aviation history, and this is the first I've heard of it.  I wonder if any of those Germans aviators were involved in the "RailZeppelin" project later on?

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Posted by 54light15 on Wednesday, January 4, 2012 1:32 PM

A propeller driven rail car? I would imagine that there would have been a few adult beverages enjoyed by the passengers while riding it. I wonder if T.E. Lawrence ever attacked it as he did the Hedjaz railway which is still abandoned in Saudi Arabia.

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Posted by samfp1943 on Thursday, January 5, 2012 9:28 PM

Folks:

          While on the subject of WWI and things railroading and military, I'd offer up this link to a discussion around here in July of 2010;  Some of the newerr members may not have seen it, but it covers an aspect of American WWI history that is seldom mentioned these days.   I hope some will find it of interest and in line with this Thread as well.

link: http://cs.trains.com/TRCCS/forums/p/193887/2116648.aspx#2116648

Covers the  40 hommes& 8 Chevaux Boxcars of WWI,  and the resultant American Friendship Train,[ put together from and idea by columnist Drew Pearson]; and the Response to it from Europe.

This link is one that may also interest those who are following large bore artillery weapons of WWI;

http://freepages.military.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~cacunithistories/Railway%20Artillery.html


 

 

 


 

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Posted by erikem on Sunday, January 8, 2012 11:45 PM

samfp1943
This link is one that may also interest those who are following large bore artillery weapons of WWI;

http://freepages.military.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~cacunithistories/Railway%20Artillery.html

Somewhere in 1927 or 1928, Popular Science carried an article on the deployment of the 14 inch naval rifles on the Baldwin built rail mounts. The issue(s) in question is(are) available on Google Books.

- Erik

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, January 9, 2012 4:47 AM

Lawrence of Arabia did not have to attack Affula.   When the German's learned that Jerusalem had been suffended by the Turks to the British (General Allenby, and there is a Tel Aviv avenue named for him today) they vacated in a hurry.  The Turks left leaving the workers orders to blow up everything, which they did not do.   The Jewish and Arab employees of the rail line offered to keep their jobs and became employees of the British!   But then one less sympathetic British officer had them all put in prison until the war was over.   There is talk now and some engineering done about rebuilding this line in standard gauge and giving Jordan access to Haifa port.

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Posted by 54light15 on Tuesday, January 10, 2012 12:37 PM

Dave- Does Jordan still run steam locomotives? I recall reading about them a while back. That's an interesting development about connecting the Jordan railway to Haifa. 

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Posted by daveklepper on Wednesday, January 11, 2012 3:46 AM

Jordan's portion of the railroad built for pilgrams is really in two parts, one the diesel-operated potash trains from the potash fields to Aqaba for overseas shipment and a decent economy for Jordan and its people; the other charted tourist trains using steam power out of Aman on the line southward some 10 or 20 miles toward Aqaba and northward toward Damascus.  I don't believe there is any scheduled passenger service, but I may be wrong.   Their operating steam is considered preserved heritage and is treated as such.   I think there are at least one 2-8-2, 2-6-0, and 2-8-0.   A very beautiful 4-6-2 is cosmetically restored and on display.

As far as I know, no "real" locomotoviles were ever actually built in either Jordan or Israel.   However, as many as 20 or 30 kibbutzim (collective farms) at one time or another had 600mm (approx. 2ft.) gauge interal rail lines to haul produce to wharehouses or processing plants.   In all cases human-power (better than wheelbarrows) and horsepower were used.   However, on two kubbutzim the remains of homemade locomotives may be seen, where a truck or auto engine was geared and chained to a gear installed on one axle of one of the 4-wheel gondolas.  

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