Roanoke Locomotives

[Beach Bill]

This entry from today's Roanoke Times:

http://www.roanoke.com/news/breaking/wb/211908

"Several steam locomotives rusting in a Roanoke scrapyard have finally found homes.

In a complex arrangement involving the Virginia Museum of Transportation in Roanoke, The Railroad Museum of Virginia in Portsmouth and Goshen businessman William Harris, the locomotives will be removed from the former Virginia Scrap Iron and Metal Co. in the coming weeks and distributed around the state. The Roanoke museum will receive an historic steam locomotive, the M2c #1151, that was made in Roanoke in 1911.

The dilapidated engine will require restoration work, which could be a lengthy and expensive process, given its condition. The other locomotives need restoration work as well. "The goal right now for us is to save them," said Bev Fitzpatrick, executive director of the transportation museum.

The old locomotives are often referred to by rail buffs as "The Lost Engines of Roanoke." The yard they sit on off South Jefferson Street was recently sold to Carilion Clinic, which is building a medical campus in that area"

(end of article) 

One of the TV stations there listed that the Virginia Museum of Transportation would also get one of the diesel locomotives from that scrapyard - there were several former Chesapeake & Western switchers there.  This will not entail making any of these operational, but its better than being melted down for scrap.

Bill

 

[jfallon]

Here's a link to more of the story:

http://hamptonroads.com/2009/07/new-railroad-museum-set-chug-portsmouth

 In return for paying for the relocation of the locomotives, the RMV will get one of them and a tender. Not a bad deal!

                                                              John

[dinwitty]

 I am with the Western Virginia Railroad Preservation Society and we have been involved in finding ways to get the engines moved. Will Smith, a Lumber Yard owner is doing the move, he will get one of the engines, he has several other steamers he has moved also, he's kinda a hobbyist...with real engines...

The VMT gets 1151, Portsmouth gets 1134, and Will gets 1118.  1151 probably the worst of shape is Roanoke built by the N&W, the others were Baldwins, the N&W after recieving the Baldwins, the N&W shops virtually duplicated the engines in their own shops. 1118 and 1134 were M2a class while 1151 was classed M2c because it had superheaters installed, but 1118 and 1134 got superheaters eventually and got  reclassed M2c. 

The N&W evaluated their locomotive needs and they needed all possible weight on the drivers to get over the heavy mountains, which is why they decided on the 4-8-0 arrangement vs 2-8-2's of the time, those engines proved themselves well till big mallets came along when the N&W did scrappings of the older power, however knowing their equipment and value and their skills on their own engines, they kept the 4-8-0's for other duties such as switching service instead of getting 0-8-0's. 

These engines ran up to about 1951 when the N&W finally decided to buy some 0-8-0's off the C&O. When that happenned they sent more 4-8-0's to the scrappers, (but they stilllll kept some 4-8-0's to the end of steam running)

The scrap yard engines were part of that one scrapping sweep in 1951, but the scrap yard owner did not scrap them figuring they would still have a value to them. He also had the Strasburg N&W M-1 4-8-0 which Strasburg tooks and restored to operating condition.He also had a Y6b, but that was scrapped, unfortunately.

The scrap yard owner passed away a few years ago, and the site was purchased to redevelop the site, but the engines needed to be moved...somehow. TWVRPS has kept a long watch on this and has been active working on all the situations. With the publicity generated, interest in the engines and who and what to do developed. It came down to 3 parties, the VMT, The Portsmouth Museum and Will Smith. Will Smith could do the move, Portsmouth is doing the funding, and the VMT essentialy had protection on the engines to prevent them from being scrapped or whatever, however, the company buying the scrap yard land knew the importance of the engines and figured they could fence the engines till they could get moved.

1118 and 1134 will go to Goshen first to do initial restoration work, then 1134 will get moved to Portsmouth. The critical issues on the engines is rollability after sitting ages the bearings may be rusted and can damage the bearing surfaces if tried to roll as is. They cannot be rolled as they are now. Thats why initial restoration work is needed first.

Now, probably the other question about the engines is...well, could any one of them be brought to steam operating condition?

I helped with the initial 765 restoration work in 1974-1979, I have been all over 765 inside the boiler and out etc etc shooting film of its restoration work and heres what I say.

All the engines could be brought to running condition given the werewithall to do it. But its a long road getting there of restoration work. I believe Will may try to bring 1118 to steam, 1134 for now may be for display, but there is interest to try to get it to steam possibly. 1151 probably will not happen to become display at the VMT. A lot of appliances are removed from the engines and must be replaced. But there are sources for that. Thats why I believe you could see at least one of these engines under steam...sometime.

Keep your fingers crossed, those of us at TWVRPS will keep our eyes on it and see what roles we can take to help out more.

cheers.

 

 

[dinwitty]

 

All the engines have been moved out and cars and distributed among interested groups/museums.

More data later.

[jfallon]

 The first of the lost engines to be displayed has been set up in Portsmouth, Va. The 16,000 gallon tender arrived last month and has had "coal boards" added to look right. The locomotive itself arrived May 16 or 17 in three pieces (cab, boiler, running gear) on flat cars via CSX to the old Belt Line yard. The parts were then trucked to the museum site and assembled during the evening of the 17th. The folks at VMT and the WVRHS did a great job with the cosmetic restoration, #1134 looks %10000 better than she did before being moved. Some photos I took are on the website for the NMRA's Tidewater Division, http://www.nmra-mer-tidewater.org/ . I will post more when I can.

                                                                                     John

[Aikidomaster]

Just wondering if Class J #611 or Class A #1218 will ever feel the heat of a fire in the firebox? I understand that 1218 is not in good working shape but that 611 is much better condition. What do the "powers that be" at Norfolk Southern have to say about ever running either locomotive?

[jfallon]

From what I've heard, 1218's boiler tubes are all gone. She was being overhauled when NS cancelled the steam program, and her tubes were sold to another steam engine group. This doesn't make it impossible for her to steam again, but it would take more money than returning 611. As for the J, we can hope that NS or some other large company would see an advantage in the future to have her steaming. Of the major RRs, only UP thinks the publicity is worth the costs of a steam locomotive program.

                                                             John

 

P. S.     New #1134 photos are on the Tidewater Division website (link on previous post). From the home page, click on Railroad Museum of Virginia on the left.

[daveklepper]

and CP.   Don't forget CP!