Walt Disney World Railroad

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REI
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Walt Disney World Railroad
Posted by REI on Thursday, April 12, 2007 4:32 PM
Is anybody here familiar with the Walt Disney World Railroad? They have 4 engines, #1 Walter E. Disney, #2 Lilly Belle, #3 Roger E. Broggie, and #4 Roy O. Disney. It is my favorite railroad in the world and I feel I grew up with it since I get to go to the Magic Kingdom at Walt Disney World every year.
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Posted by GP-9_Man11786 on Thursday, April 12, 2007 5:33 PM

I've actualy taken the behind-the-scenes tour of the WDWRR. They have two 4-6-0s (Walter E. Disney and Roger Broggie) a 2-6-0 (Lilly Belle) and a 4-4-0 (Roy Disney). The engines were repatriatied from MExico and actualy looked noithing like they do now. They have "before" pictures in the Magic Kingdom. Believe it or not all four engines have cab signals and automatic train stop. Also the railroad's passenger cars, which have open side are grandfathered as this design is no longer permitted.

If you get a chance to take the tour, I highly recomend it.

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Posted by MerrilyWeRollAlong on Thursday, April 12, 2007 5:57 PM

A good source of information is in the book "Walt Disney's Railroad Story" written by Michael Broggie.  The book will help you learn about the trains at Disney World from conception of the ride to the aquiring and building of the equipment to operations.  The WDW railroad is only a chapter in the book which covers Walt Disney's passion for trains, his own backyard railroad, and all the railroad of the all the other Disney theme parks.

It is interesting to learn how his love for trains inspire the creation of Disneyland and how many railroad related rides were originally planned and eventually incorporated in to Disneyland.

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Posted by REI on Thursday, April 12, 2007 6:53 PM

Yes, I have been wanting to take the Magic Behind our Steam Trains Tour for a long time and I'm never able to, usually because it's all booked up (they only take 25 people per tour). And I'm trying to grab Michael Broggie's book on eBay. I was a user for some time at a fourm called Disney Railroads Discussion Board but I only watch the posts now. I don't post anymore because the founder, moderator, and some users are very rude and degenerate, so I would recommend not becoming a member but just read the threads and posts as a guest because it is a great place for anyone who is interested in the Disney Railroads found around the world.

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Posted by Modelcar on Thursday, April 12, 2007 7:48 PM

 

.....When we were younger we were an annual visitor and customer staying right on the grounds...The Contemporary Hotel.  Even several times through Christmas.

Never did go on the tour behind the scenes of the operating railroad physicalities....but I sure did take a close look at the immaculate equipment used on the system.  It was my understanding the engines did come from Mexico and they were totally refurbished even to the point of I believe using clean natural gas for fuel....{I am relying on memory now and could be in error}......Of course did ride the open cars time and time again.  Engines were seemingly in beautiful condition anytime I looked them over and that was quite a few times.

All those years we did our much visiting at the "World" everything seemed to be immaculate.  It's been a few years now since we were regular customers and I hope it is still being cared for and presented as it was in the past.  That goes for the hotel accommodations too.  Not too many more pleasing and beautiful sites than we enjoyed from our Contemporary Hotel balcony on a nice warm evening with all the lights of the Magic Kingdom and with all it's sounds, etc.....Even hearing the train whistles from up there as they came into the "depot"....Just beautiful.

Quentin

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Posted by REI on Thursday, April 12, 2007 10:29 PM
Everything is about the same except that they have modified the coaches a bit, they added side pannels on the left side of the coaches in adition to the restraining bars they have always had. These were added in the summer of 2005. The engines were built by the Baldwin Locomotive Works of Philedelphia,PA. They were then shipped to Yucatan, Mexico to work for the United Railways of Yucatan to haul sugarcane, jute, and passengers. George Britton, a great gentleman I might add, overlooked their complete restoration in 1969 and was the Railroad's foreman until he retired in April, 2006. It was much better when he was around in my opinion.
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Posted by Modelcar on Friday, April 13, 2007 8:22 AM

...No surprise of the added protection on at least one side of the coaches.  Glad to hear the system is still at least almost where it has been for all the past years.

Boy if they would add track {as the monorail is}, out to Epcot, that would be some extended ride.  I'm sure there are no plans for that.

Quentin

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Posted by GP-9_Man11786 on Friday, April 13, 2007 9:01 AM
Actualy, the Animal Kingdom has a train ride as well but the locos are deisel engines designed to look like steamers. In addition you also have to sit through some very annoying naration. You know it's bad when a railfan wants to get of the train.

The engines in the Magic Kingdom actualy burn the same Ruby Deisel that mainline railroads use. I also believe Hartland makes some nice modles of these engines in G-Scale.

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Posted by Modelcar on Friday, April 13, 2007 1:06 PM

....I just did some reading on the WDW RR and updated myself once again to the fact they burn a diesel, clean version of fuel.  Don't remember where I got the idea they perhaps used natural gas....One thing I remember they do do.....Burn clean.

Quentin

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Posted by samfp1943 on Friday, April 13, 2007 2:12 PM
Not exactly a WDW RR question, but I remember seeing years ago, a Disney program of a fullsized backyard rr. One of Walt's close associates; it might have been Roy Disney, the person had an enginehouse, station on their railroad, and the track patern was like a switchback in the pattern of a large letter 'Z'.  I think he[Roy Disney] is now deceased, but what happened to his little operation? Any one remember or know anything about it?  All the details are now, a little foggy,   Thanks. 

Sam

 

 


 

REI
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Posted by REI on Friday, April 13, 2007 2:24 PM

That was Walt Disney's Carolwood Pacific Railroad. It was live steam and was 1/8 scale, and had one locomotive called the Lilly Belle (name sake is for his wife, Lillian Bounds Disney). She is a 4-4-0 American type locomotive with a ballon(diamond) smoke stack. The locomotive itself is on display at the Disney Museum. She is still operable. And I believe that gentleman you saw was not Roy O. Disney, it might be Roger Broggie or Ward Kimball. Walt's brother, Roy died on December,1971.

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Posted by n012944 on Friday, April 13, 2007 2:26 PM

 samfp1943 wrote:
Not exactly a WDW RR question, but I remember seeing years ago, a Disney program of a fullsized backyard rr. One of Walt's close associates; it might have been Roy Disney, the person had an enginehouse, station on their railroad, and the track patern was like a switchback in the pattern of a large letter 'Z'.  I think he[Roy Disney] is now deceased, but what happened to his little operation? Any one remember or know anything about it?  All the details are now, a little foggy,   Thanks. 

Might have been Ward Kimbal, one of Disney's animators.  His railroad was known as the Grizzly Flats, Trains did a article about it a couple of years ago.

 

Bert

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Posted by REI on Friday, April 13, 2007 2:29 PM
Ward Kimball helped Walt Disney very much with the Carolwood Pacific Railroad. So I'm sure it's him.
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Posted by Railfan1 on Friday, April 13, 2007 4:11 PM
Sign - Ditto [#ditto]
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Posted by sffoamer on Friday, April 13, 2007 4:39 PM
     I know that the original Walt Disney Railroad at the orignal Disneyland in Ca. was,  as was Walt himself, greatly influenced by the AT&SF. I've read that they even acted as consultants during its' construction. In the 1950s my family and I rode for free on Santa Fe passes and much of the rolling sock, including the monorail carried the AT&SF circle and cross logo. I still have 8mm movie footage plainly showing them. The locomotives were even then named for Disney and his family. The Orlando property seems almost identical, having ridden there in 2004, and seems a commendable operation, although in a post 9/11 atmosphere they seem very sensitive to inquiring eyes. I knew of no such TOUR at the time, but the right questions got me the essentials. The monorail and steam trains at Orlando move vast numbers of people and do it safely. Bravo!!
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Posted by Modelcar on Friday, April 13, 2007 6:35 PM

.....Sam:  There is a generous amount of info on the RR you are inquiring about at Google.

Quentin

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Posted by Modelcar on Friday, April 13, 2007 6:42 PM

 

....Isn't it a shame W. Disney never got to see his completed creation of Disney World, at Orlando area.....A beautiful place.  He managed to purchase the swamp land....manage the design....was fully involved in getting it all started but did not survive to see and enjoy it's completion and success.  All accomplished and keeping control of the natural survival of the wet lands it was built on, etc....

I have never been anywhere where so many people are moved about so efficiently.

Quentin

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Posted by REI on Friday, April 13, 2007 7:22 PM

I know this is off subject but does anyone have Walt Disney World Railroad G-scale train sets? I have one that I love and I've added a little more stickers to make her look a little bit more like the #1 Walter E. Disney. She's not completely accurate because she should be a 4-6-0 ten wheeler instead of a 2-6-0 mogul, the sand dome and bell are not in the right place, and the smoke stack is not the same, but hey! I find a resemblence in her.Smile [:)] Here are some pictures of her with her Red, 100 series coach:

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Posted by Modelcar on Friday, April 13, 2007 10:45 PM

....Like your photos.....and a really bright pretty red color.

Quentin

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Posted by REI on Friday, April 13, 2007 11:44 PM
I love Walter's stunning red paint scheme too!Cool [8D]I love red and black engines.
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Posted by 1702 on Saturday, April 14, 2007 7:31 PM

There are a couple of articles on wikipedia about the Disneyland and Walt Disney World railroads, go to http://en.wikipedia.org and do a search.  Also mouseplanet.com has many articles on the two railroads, the one I saw was very well-illustrated with both contemporary and historic photos.  http://www.mouseplanet.com/articles.php?art=eo051028bb

The AT&SF Railway sponsored the Santa Fe & Disneyland Railroad until around 1974.  Walt Disney and his brother Roy spent most of their childhood in Marceline, MO, which is on the Santa Fe's Kansas City to Chicago mainline. 

 

 

REI
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Posted by REI on Saturday, April 14, 2007 7:55 PM

Thanks. Yeah I've read them.

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Posted by broncoman on Saturday, April 14, 2007 10:10 PM

Did anyone have a chance to ride the train at Fort Wilderness before it was removed?  The very first time we went to Disneyworld (approx 1986) the tracks were still there but employees had said that the trains had been sent to another park.  What kind of trains were these.  The guage was smaller than standard, but I don't think it was that small.

 

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Posted by emmar on Saturday, April 14, 2007 10:35 PM

I can say one thing Disney sure picked an ugly set of colors to repaint those locomotives. If they had been smart they would have painted them with a paint scheme from their working life, but of course this is Disney and they always have to make everything about money. It is good that the locomotives were preserved in some form. However as a rule Disney shouldn't be let near anything with historic value and should focus their wasteful and useless exploits on supposedly entertaining a populous that can't deal with reality. Well that’s about all I have to say on that subject.

Angry [:(!]
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Posted by REI on Saturday, April 14, 2007 11:20 PM
 emmar wrote:

I can say one thing Disney sure picked an ugly set of colors to repaint those locomotives. If they had been smart they would have painted them with a paint scheme from their working life, but of course this is Disney and they always have to make everything about money. It is good that the locomotives were preserved in some form. However as a rule Disney shouldn't be let near anything with historic value and should focus their wasteful and useless exploits on supposedly entertaining a populous that can't deal with reality. Well that’s about all I have to say on that subject.

Angry [:(!]

I object. I do not agree with this at all. The WDW RR engines are one of, if not the most beautiful surviving steamers in the whole world. First off the colors are magnificent and 100% accurate and fit perfectly with the setting, you think that they would be better and look better if they were kept in their former black, ugly self??!! GIVE ME A BREAK! Second, the great men that had the knowledge, skill and will to take the task of completly rebuilding them one by one, down to every last bolt did the best rebuilding job of locomotives that I have ever known. And third, The engines are the SAME AS THEY HAVE ALWAYS BEEN EVER SINCE THEY LEFT THE BALDWIN LOCOMOTIVE WORKS TO THE UNITED RAILWAYS OF YUCATAN, MEXICO. All four have their original builder's plates on each side of the smoke boxes with their construction number and month and year they were built. And they are pristine STEAM TRAINS AFTER ALL! It shames me to such an extent that there are people like you that demoralize the fine and genius works that nobody but the Walt Disney Co. can create!!!! SoapBox [soapbox] Censored [censored]Angry [:(!]

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Posted by Anonymous on Monday, April 16, 2007 9:22 PM
Roger Broggie was awarded a window on Disneyland's Main Street this week as a memorial of his work not only on Walt's Carolwood & Pacific , but as the first "Imagineer"
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Posted by Stumpie on Monday, April 16, 2007 9:47 PM

That was Ward Kimball's full size railroad.  It had a station with an operator inside.  I think it's all down at the Orange Empire Museum.

 

 

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Posted by Modelcar on Monday, April 16, 2007 9:48 PM

...We're all intitled to our opinions for the most part and yours {emmar}, sure is clear.

I find we {my family},have dealt with reality probably as long as most on this forum and we also have had major enjoyment at Disney's WDW many, many times....For days on end.  Beautiful place and we have wonderful memories from all the family fun being there and enjoying it all.

Quentin

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Posted by Stumpie on Monday, April 16, 2007 9:54 PM

Well, let's see here.  Regarding Disneyland.  In Frontierland, there was a mine train ride that went through the painted desert.  That was there from the '50s I think.  It wasn't a roller coaster.  They tore it up for the Thunder Mountain Railroad coaster ride.  Is that what you're talking about?  Fort Wilderness I believe is on Tom Sawyer's Island and it never had an actual train ride there.

 Somebody will correct me if I'm wrong, I'm confident of that.

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Posted by erikem on Tuesday, April 17, 2007 1:29 AM
 Stumpie wrote:

Well, let's see here.  Regarding Disneyland.  In Frontierland, there was a mine train ride that went through the painted desert.  That was there from the '50s I think.  It wasn't a roller coaster.  They tore it up for the Thunder Mountain Railroad coaster ride.  Is that what you're talking about?  Fort Wilderness I believe is on Tom Sawyer's Island and it never had an actual train ride there.

 Somebody will correct me if I'm wrong, I'm confident of that.

You're correct for Disneyland, but not for Disney World. I did ride the Mine Train Through Nature's Wonderland a few times before it was replaced by Big Thunder Mountain. 

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