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Double Stack vs. TOFC

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Posted by SD70Dude on Sunday, September 5, 2021 11:47 AM

We haven't had lights on switches since the days of oil lamps.

They started painting the rails green to mark the fouling point.  This is indeed hard to see when buried in snow but it's better than nothing, and if we can't see the green line or there isn't one we are to use the old school arms length test to determine if a car is foul or not.

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Posted by tree68 on Sunday, September 5, 2021 12:39 PM

I added reflectorized material to one switch stand (an old timer) that was hard to spot otherwise, due in part to a pile of rusty RR debris a distance behind it.  The rest of ours are reflectorized.  Our foul points are marked with yellow.

One foul point has an unused post nearby that makes it easier to spot.

Am I old if I remember oil lamps on switch stands on the old C&O in my old home town?  My morning paper route put me near one, ca 1961/2 and I remember seeing it flicker.

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Posted by jeffhergert on Sunday, September 5, 2021 1:40 PM

We started getting those little lights at the switch points.  Some use white lights, some are yellow, and some are red.  I don't like them using red lights for this application.

SD70Dude, I'm sure a manager could find those marks for you, after the fact.  Ours are yellow paint on the rail with a plastic cone between the rail.  Leave any part of the car, including the coupler, "in the paint" and you'll get a talking to.  The marks are usually two car lengths away from the actual point where equipment would foul.

Jeff

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Posted by Overmod on Sunday, September 5, 2021 2:03 PM

tree68
Am I old if I remember oil lamps on switch stands on the old C&O in my old home town?

I am not quite old enough for the grand AAR plan for nuclear switch lamps, but I was born about that time... DunceLightning

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Posted by mvlandsw on Sunday, September 5, 2021 3:46 PM

Overmod
 
tree68
Am I old if I remember oil lamps on switch stands on the old C&O in my old home town?

 

I am not quite old enough for the grand AAR plan for nuclear switch lamps, but I was born about that time... DunceLightning

 

 

There were a number of kerosene powered switch lamps in service on the B&O when I hired out in the 1970's.

I have one of the nuclear powered switch lamps in my basement which used to house nuclear tipped Nike missles.

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Posted by BaltACD on Sunday, September 5, 2021 3:54 PM

mvlandsw
 
Overmod 
tree68
Am I old if I remember oil lamps on switch stands on the old C&O in my old home town? 

I am not quite old enough for the grand AAR plan for nuclear switch lamps, but I was born about that time... DunceLightning 

There were a number of kerosene powered switch lamps in service on the B&O when I hired out in the 1970's.

I have one of the nuclear powered switch lamps in my basement which used to house nuclear tipped Nike missles.

I recall the B&O having oil lit switch stand lamps in Baltimore in the early 70's.  The were replaced by reflective targets in the late 70's.

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Posted by Shadow the Cats owner on Monday, September 6, 2021 12:00 AM

Oh please one of the biggest wish list items on the DOT wish list for OTR trucks is forced removal of snow and ice from the roofs of the trailers.  Several states have passed laws requiring this but implantation of it has been a disaster.  Why OSHA requires tie off and fall protection over 12 feet in the air and on slick surfaces.  Also just brushing it off won't work and it tends to reoccur during a snowstorm.  Short of electrically heating roofs there is no way to prevent it.  

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Posted by nickelplaterick on Tuesday, September 7, 2021 12:27 PM
The state of Illinois used to set portable scales at the exit of APL Global One in Chicago(around 14th and Ashland Avenue to catch overloaded outbound boxes when I was doing drayage work from 1988-1996. If they didn't catch an overloaded container, they would find DOT mechanical issues to shut the driver down along with the requisite fines!
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Posted by Overmod on Monday, September 13, 2021 1:36 PM

nickelplaterick
If they didn't catch an overloaded container, they would find DOT mechanical issues to shut the driver down along with the requisite fines!

What would they do with the trucks that they interdicted this way?  To what extent did this scramble drayage out of and into the facility?  Did they pay special attention to drayage that was part of JIT or otherwise time-critical?

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Posted by Shadow the Cats owner on Monday, September 13, 2021 9:55 PM

They did it for one reason and one reason only.  Revenue any semblance of safety improvements are imagined by the lawmakers that come up with some of these things.  Here's a fun fact.  The OTR truck gross weight for 5 axles is 80k.  Normally that's the truth.  However you pay the DOT for a permit they're willing to let you go up to 92k on closed tandems and 96 on spread axles.  

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Posted by Ulrich on Tuesday, September 14, 2021 7:10 PM

Shadow the Cats owner

They did it for one reason and one reason only.  Revenue any semblance of safety improvements are imagined by the lawmakers that come up with some of these things.  Here's a fun fact.  The OTR truck gross weight for 5 axles is 80k.  Normally that's the truth.  However you pay the DOT for a permit they're willing to let you go up to 92k on closed tandems and 96 on spread axles.  

 

Nondivisble loads only. They realize some big stuff like oil tanks need to move, and they can't obviously be shipped in pieces. They don't issue permits where loads can be broken down into two loads .. like a load of soup on pallets.. they'll make you take pallets off until you're below the 80,000 lbs. gross. 

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Posted by Shadow the Cats owner on Wednesday, September 15, 2021 10:32 AM

https://www.kkgloballlc.com/client-tools/container-weight-limitation-pennsylvania.html 

Go here and be amazed by how the DOT can be bought by big businesses.  

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Posted by Overmod on Wednesday, September 15, 2021 10:44 AM

Shadow the Cats owner
Go here and be amazed by how the DOT can be bought by big businesses.

$100 to $200 per year is big business?

Or are there bogus fees and charges running the expense up, or artificial restrictions on who can get permits a la taxi medallions?

Somebody with patience tell me the states in which footnote [11] in the reference applies.

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Posted by zugmann on Wednesday, September 15, 2021 10:52 AM

Shadow the Cats owner
Go here and be amazed by how the DOT can be bought by big businesses.  

So are the states supposed to allow trucks to be as big as they want, or not allow anything bigger? 

   The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer or any other railroad, company, or person.

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Posted by Overmod on Wednesday, September 15, 2021 11:49 AM

zugmann
So are the states supposed to allow trucks to be as big as they want, or not allow anything bigger?

Would be interesting to see the relative weight of all the lobbying in the postwar Forties that led to Missouri implementing weight and size restrictions... killing off what were shaping up to be competing articulated Nite Coach services on a grand scale.  Everyone's familiar with buses as replacements for cheap accommodation trains and coach service -- not as many remember the promise of more luxurious service between city pairs that would ill support trains.  Much of that effectively vanished when one key state between Chicagoland and Southern California changed to forbid it...  with enormous increases in road maintenance but only a 'flyover' share in revenue or benefits, already said to have been in considerable evidence by 1947.

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Posted by blue streak 1 on Wednesday, September 15, 2021 6:34 PM

Overmod

 Somebody with patience tell me the states in which footnote [11] in the reference applies.

 

 
You select a state in this case I selected Arizona.  To right of the black Georgia rectangle you will see comments to its right you will note "see {11} below "  Then you can select any state and see if that note is referenced or any other note(s) !
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Posted by Backshop on Wednesday, September 15, 2021 7:27 PM

Ulrich

 

 
Shadow the Cats owner

They did it for one reason and one reason only.  Revenue any semblance of safety improvements are imagined by the lawmakers that come up with some of these things.  Here's a fun fact.  The OTR truck gross weight for 5 axles is 80k.  Normally that's the truth.  However you pay the DOT for a permit they're willing to let you go up to 92k on closed tandems and 96 on spread axles.  

 

 

 

Nondivisble loads only. They realize some big stuff like oil tanks need to move, and they can't obviously be shipped in pieces. They don't issue permits where loads can be broken down into two loads .. like a load of soup on pallets.. they'll make you take pallets off until you're below the 80,000 lbs. gross. 

 

Not in Michigan.  We were grandfathered in and have been paying for it in bad roads for decades.  The weight limit in Michigan is 162,000# GVW spread over 11 axles.  You are plated for the weight that you want and no special permit is required.

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Posted by SD60MAC9500 on Wednesday, September 15, 2021 9:34 PM
 

Backshop

 

 
Ulrich

 

 
Shadow the Cats owner

They did it for one reason and one reason only.  Revenue any semblance of safety improvements are imagined by the lawmakers that come up with some of these things.  Here's a fun fact.  The OTR truck gross weight for 5 axles is 80k.  Normally that's the truth.  However you pay the DOT for a permit they're willing to let you go up to 92k on closed tandems and 96 on spread axles.  

 

 

 

Nondivisble loads only. They realize some big stuff like oil tanks need to move, and they can't obviously be shipped in pieces. They don't issue permits where loads can be broken down into two loads .. like a load of soup on pallets.. they'll make you take pallets off until you're below the 80,000 lbs. gross. 

 

 

 

Not in Michigan.  We were grandfathered in and have been paying for it in bad roads for decades.  The weight limit in Michigan is 162,000# GVW spread over 11 axles.  You are plated for the weight that you want and no special permit is required.

 

 

Backshop you forgot to add 2000lbs. 164K is our limit.

 
Rahhhhhhhhh!!!!
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Posted by Backshop on Thursday, September 16, 2021 9:46 AM

Thanks...Sad

The "unofficial" limit is much higher.  Before I retired, I would travel I-275 between Livonia and the airport exit almost every day.  I could average at least one 11-axle load per mile.  One day, I was seeing a few steel haulers but no gravel trains, which were normally in the majority.  I got my answer when I passed the closed rest area on the NB side.  The MSP CVE had a mobile scale set up there.  Steel haulers had BoL that had correct weight but dirt haulers just load as much as they think that they can get away with.  They were all exiting several miles down the road at I-94.  I guess the MTA must have a very well funded lobbying (bribery) setup.

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Posted by SD60MAC9500 on Thursday, September 16, 2021 9:29 PM
 

Backshop

Thanks...Sad

The "unofficial" limit is much higher.  Before I retired, I would travel I-275 between Livonia and the airport exit almost every day.  I could average at least one 11-axle load per mile.  One day, I was seeing a few steel haulers but no gravel trains, which were normally in the majority.  I got my answer when I passed the closed rest area on the NB side.  The MSP CVE had a mobile scale set up there.  Steel haulers had BoL that had correct weight but dirt haulers just load as much as they think that they can get away with.  They were all exiting several miles down the road at I-94.  I guess the MTA must have a very well funded lobbying (bribery) setup.

 

No doubt the guys moving gravel and earth in those dump trains are pushing over the limit. They know when, and where to avoid Smokey..

 
Rahhhhhhhhh!!!!
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Posted by Shadow the Cats owner on Friday, October 15, 2021 9:38 AM

Thought I would bring this one up front again after the presidents remarks yesterday basically blaming everyone in the supply chain for it's failure.  Hello how about your administration taking some of the blame also.  My bosses fuel costs have just about doubled since you took office 10 months ago.  That alone has had a huge impact on just how much we as a company are able to grow.  We're facing a multi million dollar increase in our costs that we didn't even see coming.  Then throw in to this mess even more restrictions on ports containers then paying people more to stay at home then they're getting to work and you can't figure out why the supply chain is this nation is broken.  

 

One of your first acts as president was to end the HOS regulation waivers that were in place.  Yes that allowed my driver's to get more rest however the simple fact is that those waivers were the only thing keeping the supply chain intact.  Now it's busted to hell and beyond and you and your transportation secretary are both missing in action on how to fix it.  

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Friday, October 15, 2021 10:06 AM

I guess that means that potentially unsafe operation is to be allowed in order to keep the supply chain moving.

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
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Posted by n012944 on Friday, October 15, 2021 11:28 AM

Shadow the Cats owner

 

One of your first acts as president was to end the HOS regulation waivers that were in place.  Yes that allowed my driver's to get more rest however the simple fact is that those waivers were the only thing keeping the supply chain intact.  Now it's busted to hell and beyond and you and your transportation secretary are both missing in action on how to fix it.  

 

 

Ahh the horrors.   The truckers had to follow the law?  Poor things.....

An "expensive model collector"

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Posted by zugmann on Friday, October 15, 2021 11:46 AM

Shadow the Cats owner
One of your first acts as president was to end the HOS regulation waivers that were in place.  Yes that allowed my driver's to get more rest however the simple fact is that those waivers were the only thing keeping the supply chain intact.  Now it's busted to hell and beyond and you and your transportation secretary are both missing in action on how to fix it.  

Maybe it's broken partly because people DON'T want (and shouldn't be forced) to work 14-18+ hour shifts?

For years, people have been treated like crap and whenever they complainined the ol' tired response was: "if you don't like it - quit!"

Now they are doing just that. 

 

And everyone is surprised? 

   The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer or any other railroad, company, or person.

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Posted by Euclid on Friday, October 15, 2021 12:28 PM

Maybe the supply chain is cutting their plans for routine upgrades and investment as they worry about the rising financial risk of investing with hyperinflation on the horizon.  Maybe they are not convinced of the childlike premise of the Fed and the Administration that spending multi trillions will lead us all into the good life. 

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Posted by Shadow the Cats owner on Friday, October 15, 2021 12:59 PM

Zugman as usual you have zero clue how or what the logistics in this nation actually are run.  So instead of just being able to ignore when the shipper or receiver has held the truck for 8 hours and burned the clock of the driver that day now those driver's are being forced by the HOS regulations regardless of if they slept through their delivery or shipping delays to stop and rest another 10 hours.  You can't keep crap moving when the truck is sitting 18 hours a freaking day.  But what would I know about HOS regulations considering I have 250 driver's I have to keep in compliance with.  

 

If you think inflation is bad right now just wait until the democratic proposal of a 8 cent per mile tax rate driven goes through.  That means for an average OTR truck a tax increase of between 10 to 15 grand a year.  Guess who will be paying that. 

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Posted by zugmann on Friday, October 15, 2021 1:37 PM

Considering the trucker shortage - it seems like the industry is pretty clueless, too. But expecting people to work like robots with lax/no HOS seems like the absolute worst solution to this.  The days of people spending their entire lives working is starting to come to its natural close, methinks.  But hey, keep grasping at the good ol' days. 

But hey, don't let me get in the way of your thinly-veiled political rants and boogeymen regulator fearmongering. 

 

   The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer or any other railroad, company, or person.

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Posted by Euclid on Friday, October 15, 2021 1:53 PM

Shadow the Cats owner

If you think inflation is bad right now just wait until the democratic proposal of a 8 cent per mile tax rate driven goes through.  That means for an average OTR truck a tax increase of between 10 to 15 grand a year.  Guess who will be paying that. 

 

I don't think inflation is bad now.  It is hardly anything right now.  I am talking about hyperinflation that can drain everyone's life's savings overnight.  I suspect few people understand the concept because it has been rare.  Meanwhile people think inflation is just that gradual erosion of buying power a few percentage points now and then that the Fed is always stewing about.   

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Posted by n012944 on Friday, October 15, 2021 1:58 PM

Shadow the Cats owner

Zugman as usual you have zero clue how or what the logistics in this nation actually are run.  So instead of just being able to ignore when the shipper or receiver has held the truck for 8 hours and burned the clock of the driver that day now those driver's are being forced by the HOS regulations regardless of if they slept through their delivery or shipping delays to stop and rest another 10 hours. 

 

Yep, that is the way hours of service work.  Should a pilot not count the hours sitting on a taxiway waiting for a storm to pass if they can get a couple winks of sleep while doing so?  Should train crews not count the time waiting in the siding for a meet?  Of course they should.  And truck drivers should not be any different.  The truck industry has too long taken the public safety for granted, and it is time to stop.

Shadow the Cats owner

You can't keep crap moving when the truck is sitting 18 hours a freaking day. 

Hire more drivers.

Shadow the Cats owner

But what would I know about HOS regulations considering I have 250 driver's I have to keep in compliance with.  

 

Scary.

Shadow the Cats owner

If you think inflation is bad right now just wait until the democratic proposal of a 8 cent per mile tax rate driven goes through.  That means for an average OTR truck a tax increase of between 10 to 15 grand a year.  Guess who will be paying that. 

 

 

Good.  Maybe less of the general fund will have to get transferred over to cover the highway fund.   And shippers can find other ways to ship if the taxpayers stop subsidizing truckers ROW.

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Posted by Electroliner 1935 on Friday, October 15, 2021 2:42 PM

Shadow, 

I understand most of what you are saying but I would like to understand what your drivers are facing. I percieve that they arrive with the tractor at a shippers dock to pick up a loaded trailer or do they bring a trailer to be loaded. If they arrive with a trailer to be loaded, I presume their clock is running. Does the shipper have any monetary skin in the game to load the trailer quickly? Then when on the road, the clock is ticking and when they reach their time limit, they have to park and get rested (sleep) before resuming the trip. Or if team driving, swap drivers and continue. Are there any operations that use a pony express type of operation where they have a pool of drivers that swap out like Railroads do? Do  your drivers deliver a loaded trailer to its destination and have to wait for it to be unloaded or can they drop and  go? If they have to wait, can the receiver be billed after a period of time? What happens if their time expires while waiting? 

A second question. Back when I was a teen (late 40's), my dad worked for a local trucking company based in Cincinnati as a rate clerk. LTL. Common carrier. Every thing had a rate and there was a tarriff that covered it. He was licensed to practice befor the ICC. I understand that deregulation did away with that. How does trucking work today? If I call Hunt or Roadway to name two, and want to ship 4 tons of boxes of XYZ to Cincinnati, or a full truckload of whatever, how is my cost determined. Dad had rates that were based on the material, value, damageability, etc weight, distance, and of course, what the competion's rate was. Is there anything like that today?

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