String Lining.

165226 views
2426 replies
1 rating 2 rating 3 rating 4 rating 5 rating
  • Member since
    September 2003
  • 10,039 posts
Posted by Overmod on Thursday, May 16, 2019 8:32 PM

Erik_Mag
The author who got the visit from the FBI was Cleve Cartmill for his 1944 short story, which wasn't that good.

I was sure Cleve Cartmill was a pen name.  I was apparently wrong.

Read the reference page I provided for Blowups Happen - it contains the chronology (written in 1940, published in 1941)

NDG
  • Member since
    December 2013
  • 1,308 posts
Posted by NDG on Saturday, May 25, 2019 6:11 PM

Elevating.

For Mr. Mining Man.

 
 
Years ago we went down the Main Shaft in the C.M.&S. Mine here, two cages parallel in shaft, one coming up as the other went down.
 
Shaft on slant and you could look up at the Landings above.
 
Bell signals in code to signal Hoistman, and he replied in kind.
 
As sound takes time to travel, Hoist Signals would be heard in sequence diminishing from bells at other Levels Up and Down shaft.
 
Very Cool.
 
We were allowed in Hoist House at a distance and viewed the Winding Drum, Electric Motor, Two Cables, about 5 inch Diameter, one winding out, the opposite winding in, out and over large sheaves at top of head frame at shaft.
 
On our travel down, the opposite cage went by going up.
 
Small electric N G trolley motors at Landings to load cages with ore cars.
 
Lovely, and now all gone.
 
Hoist cables cut up in 4 foot lengths in large pile at siding here for loading into Gondolas by Magnet Crane.
 
The Compressor Plant still exists and is on tour as a museum.
 
Pelton Wheel on 36 inch once wood stave pipe.
 
The history of Hard Rock Mining.
 
Underground Coal Mining once not far away.
 

Thank You.

 

  • Member since
    September 2013
  • 5,346 posts
Posted by Miningman on Saturday, May 25, 2019 8:23 PM

Shaft Signals  Universal or Exceutive in North America) Bells or buzzers but called Bells 

1 Bell - Up if stopped, or Stop if in motion

2 Bells- Down 

3 Bells- Cage door open, ( men or material being loaded or unloaded)

4 Bells- Blasting signal

5 Bells- Release of cage or skip to Hoistman.. usually to park it, not in use

9 Bells- Emergency 

These are standardized across North America 

But!... Each individual Mine has its own designation for each level example- 1440 Level is designed 2-5 

So here's a run starting from surface going to the 1440 Level

Cagetender rings 3 Bells Hoistman answered back with 3 in acknowledgment ( the cage is locked and cannot move). The cagetender opens the doors, men or material enter.

Everyone on, doors secured so we are ready to go.

Cagetender rings 2-5 as destination 1440 level 

Hoistman rings back 2-5 in acknowledgement 

If correct Cagetender rings 2 Bells for Down

Hoistman acknowledges with 2 Bells for Down

And away we go

We go fast and after a couple of minutes the Hoistman slows down as his marker approaches the 1440 Level on his huge circular dial with markings. 

Amazingky these guys can put a cage on an arrived level to within an eight of an inch even 2 miles down.

 The cagetender Rings 1 Bell. 1 Bell acknowledged by Hoistman All Stop

But!... the ropes ( cables) are stretched and there is a little bounce and the cagetender waits for the bounce to settle to imperceptible before ringing 3 Bells, doors opening. Hoistman rings back 3 Bells in acknowledgement. 

These guys go real fast with their signals so I can see where it sounds like code. 

Inclined shafts in Hard Rock are rare in Canada. We like it straight up!

More often found in Coal and Potash Mines. That's just cuttin'cheese these days anyway. 

One other interesting thing. Absolutely no talking to the Hoistman in his perch when working. It's posted, its the Law. The Hoistman cannot be distracted or make an error even once. Everyone knows this. 

 

 

 

 

 

  • Member since
    December 2017
  • From: I've been everywhere, man
  • 2,109 posts
Posted by SD70Dude on Saturday, May 25, 2019 8:31 PM

That bell/buzzer system sounds very similar to the air communication line once found on passenger trains. 

And what a high-quality photo.  You can really see all the details of that intricate machinery.

Greetings from Alberta

-an Articulate Malcontent

  • Member since
    December 2017
  • From: I've been everywhere, man
  • 2,109 posts
Posted by SD70Dude on Saturday, May 25, 2019 8:44 PM

Just found this, CN speeder safety training video from 1985:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p9F1L3FETas

One of the "actors" was and still is an accomplished photographer:

http://www.railpictures.ca/author/poshell

Greetings from Alberta

-an Articulate Malcontent

  • Member since
    December 2001
  • From: Northern New York
  • 20,209 posts
Posted by tree68 on Saturday, May 25, 2019 8:48 PM

SD70Dude
And what a high-quality photo.  You can really see all the details of that intricate machinery.

Virtually all of the photos on Shorpy are amazing - likely large format glass plates, and the images are scanned at high resolution.  There's a lot of detailed history in all of them.

LarryWhistling
Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) 
Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you
My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date
Come ride the rails with me!
There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...

  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: US
  • 17,776 posts
Posted by BaltACD on Saturday, May 25, 2019 9:24 PM

SD70Dude
Just found this, CN speeder safety training video from 1985:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p9F1L3FETas

One of the "actors" was and still is an accomplished photographer:

http://www.railpictures.ca/author/poshell

Is there any question of why railroads have stopped using 'Track Car Lineups' as the method of operation for non-train on track operations?

NDG
  • Member since
    December 2013
  • 1,308 posts
Posted by NDG on Sunday, May 26, 2019 12:23 AM

 

For Mining Man.
 
Mine showing Head Frame and angle of shaft. Under Construction.
 
 
 
Hoist. Motor and gearing, left. Operating Platform Right Front.
 
 
Operating Platform later enclosed.
 
 
 
 
No 1 Compressor. Low Pressure Cylinder, Left. High Pressure Cylinder, Right.
 
Connected by Intercooler. 
 
 
 
On side wall, Right, Outside were Two 2 Locomotive Whistles, their handles Inside, which were sounded for above ground shift changes and in emergency. Whistle Signals posted on sign adjacent.
 
Machine ran constantly, but ' Loaded ' in 1/4 stages depending on Air requirements.
 
On 3/4 Load, it would lope and move it's foundations below in Cellar.
 
Later, a small Air whistle installed w pull rope top of Intercooler to summon Engineers, etc.
 
Compressor. Rope Drive from Pelton Wheels under housings Fed by 36 inch wood stave pipe into eighties.
 
Electric Motor foreground part of M G Set for Trolley Voltage Underground. Switchboard in rear.
 
 
Pelton Wheels in housings running compressor thru Rope Drive.
 
 
Back in the day there were steam cylinders on far end, Tandem on piston rod, which would operate compressor in low water. Steam plant demolished c. 1949?? and steam cylinders torched off.
 
Coal brought up by CPR.
 
Museum.
 
 
 
CPR Ore Train. Note Caboose. Push Pull operation. About one mile.
 
RoW for later Electric Mine Haulage above Caboose.
 
 
 
 
CPR Train Loading at Rock House at Adit from Underground.
 
 
 
Electric Ore Train. 3 GE Locomotives. Mercury Arc Substation. 1949.
 
 
From this Site.
 
 

Thank You.

  • Member since
    September 2013
  • 5,346 posts
Posted by Miningman on Sunday, May 26, 2019 2:22 AM

NDG-- Holeeeee Mackinaw.. that's a whole PowerPoint presentation I can do, ready made, for my 1st Year students! 

Absolutely fanatastic Sir! 

The Engineers that design hoisting systems are incredible people with special gifts of mind. 

Shaft Crews ( always a crew of 5, including the Hoistman) work together for life. It's a special job, demanding mental and physical abilities, (and bravery),  a touch above your regular skilled blue collar guy. They would be the Navy Seals of Mining. 

They even have competitions across the country, much like Firefighters do. In the modern era it's been my keen observation that the best Hoistman are Women. When I worked for St. Andrews, two gold mines in Ontario, Lucy, one of our Hoistman, was hands down the best Hoistman I ever encountered anywhere. She was from Quebec, rural Quebec right out of a book, and perhaps the most intensely focused and precise individual I have known. Also I have seen photos of the Canada Talc Mine in Tweed, Ontario that had not one but two female Hoistman in the 1890's. They looked like Annie Oakley.

Once a year a Geologist is required to ride with the Shaftman on top of the cage from surface to the bottom, past the loading pocket and down where the Big pumps are. The cage travels very very slowly and could take all day in a deeper mine. The Geologists role is to check geological structure, faults and joint openings and the general 'health' of the Shaft  host rock. Years of blasting ( sending shock waves through solid rock) and new mine openings for stopes and development work also create an ever changing dynamic throughout. 

I did this once only in 34 years and I was 25 or 26 so still naive enough to do it. Kept dodging that bullet for the rest of my career. I get the willies in my chair just typing this up thinking about it. A mile and half down is one heck of a lot of empty vertical space between up and down.

Thanks again NDG. It is a testament to man's skill and intelligence.  

  • Member since
    December 2017
  • From: I've been everywhere, man
  • 2,109 posts
Posted by SD70Dude on Sunday, May 26, 2019 2:50 PM

Another story from that site, the great Cranbrook Elephant Hunt of 1926:

https://basininstitute.org/exhibit-elephant/1.html

I've never liked heights, or depths for that matter.  Just something about being trapped in a tunnel gives me the willies.  Probably a good thing that I don't work through any long tunnels, our high bridges are bad enough!

Greetings from Alberta

-an Articulate Malcontent

  • Member since
    December 2017
  • From: I've been everywhere, man
  • 2,109 posts
Posted by SD70Dude on Sunday, May 26, 2019 3:00 PM

Off topic?

Marilyn Monroe in Jasper, with some railroad shots:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWxLhKIEAPg&t=617s

Greetings from Alberta

-an Articulate Malcontent

NDG
  • Member since
    December 2013
  • 1,308 posts
Posted by NDG on Sunday, May 26, 2019 3:27 PM

Thanks Again for more interesting information. Great old images on How it was done back when.

  • Member since
    September 2013
  • 5,346 posts
Posted by Miningman on Sunday, May 26, 2019 8:38 PM

Library of Congress version of the Shorpy photo NDG posted a link to.

The legendary Calumet and Hecla Mine .. Copper mine in the Upaper Penisula, Michigan 

 
  • Member since
    September 2013
  • 5,346 posts
Posted by Miningman on Sunday, May 26, 2019 11:52 PM

Above from Mike. Also this! Boom Copper!

 

 
  • Member since
    January 2019
  • From: Henrico, VA
  • 3,246 posts
Posted by Flintlock76 on Monday, May 27, 2019 9:10 AM

That name "Keweenaw" triggered a memory!

Several years back I read an article in (I believe) "Railfan and Railroad" magazine about a preserved steam railroad in that area.  So, I went looking, and here it is!

www.houghtonhistory.org/railroad.html  

For more of the story of the Keweenaw mining railroads, there's this...

https://www.nps.gov/kewe/learn/photosmultimedia/railways-of-the-keweenaw.htm   

And for a surviving locomotive, look here...

https://www.midcontinent.org/equipment-roster/steam-locomotives/copper-range-29/  

Have fun!

NDG
  • Member since
    December 2013
  • 1,308 posts
Posted by NDG on Monday, May 27, 2019 1:06 PM

FYI.

CPR Lidgerwood Cars. On ebay.
 
Here is a view of a Steam Shovel loading CPR Lidgerwood Cars of the type thru which a Lidgerwood Plow was drawn by a Steam Winch and a long cable, the winch powered from the locomotive.
 
 
Hinged metal plates were at each end of car and lowered over the gap between cars so the Plow could slide car-to-car.
 
Such a plate can be seen in the raised position inside car to left.
 
Depending on which way the plow was angled, the fill was pushed out the side doors which were hinged at the top.
 
Plow unloading fill from flat cars.
 
 
 
One style of  Plow.
 
 
As here.
 
 
On Churchill Route.
 
 
The plow is crossing over between cars, metal plates laid across the gap.
 
 
Lidgerwood Winch. Locomotive beyond.
 
 
 
 
From this site.
 
 
More.
 
 
 

Thank You.

  • Member since
    September 2003
  • 10,039 posts
Posted by Overmod on Monday, May 27, 2019 1:13 PM

A 2-8-0 is nifty, but why not a far more significant engine?

https://www.railpictures.net/showimage.php?id=292137&key=2554481

These had an extensive workup in Trains Magazine a couple of decades ago ... probably more like half a century, as the years keep slipping. 

NDG
  • Member since
    December 2013
  • 1,308 posts
Posted by NDG on Monday, May 27, 2019 3:56 PM

 

FYI.
 
38/1/8 OP Engine Fire.
 
Different Exhaust layout than in a Locomotive or Ship,
 
Exhaust on one side of engine only into Manifiolds.
 
 

Thank You

NDG
  • Member since
    December 2013
  • 1,308 posts
Posted by NDG on Monday, May 27, 2019 4:06 PM
  • Member since
    September 2003
  • 10,039 posts
Posted by Overmod on Monday, May 27, 2019 4:58 PM

NDG
Kinder Morgan Oil Loading Facility.

I humbly submit that your map is the pipeline terminal facility -- even the Keyera facility to the immediate north has only marginal rail access.  

The thing I think you're looking for is north of Rt. 16 and a little west, adjacent to the Alberta Diluent Terminal, where Kinder Morgan and Keyera set up a joint rail loading facility about 5 years ago.  Note that it is easily accessible to both CN and CP.

  • Member since
    December 2017
  • From: I've been everywhere, man
  • 2,109 posts
Posted by SD70Dude on Monday, May 27, 2019 8:34 PM

Overmod
NDG
Kinder Morgan Oil Loading Facility.

I humbly submit that your map is the pipeline terminal facility -- even the Keyera facility to the immediate north has only marginal rail access.  

The thing I think you're looking for is north of Rt. 16 and a little west, adjacent to the Alberta Diluent Terminal, where Kinder Morgan and Keyera set up a joint rail loading facility about 5 years ago.  Note that it is easily accessible to both CN and CP.

NDG has it right, the big loop of track just west of 17 St is the Kinder Morgan Rail Terminal.  CN's Camrose Sub and CP's Scotford (formerly Willingdon) Sub cross at a diamond immediately northwest of the terminal, this location is known as East Edmonton Jct.  CN has better access to this terminal, our trains can head in and head out to and from the mainline, while CP's trains all come from the south and must back in and back out. 

The Alberta Diluent Terminal is older than Kinder Morgan's oil terminal, and that site used to be a Celanese Canada plant which manufactured fibre for cigarette filters, among other things. 

I spent much of my formative railfanning years in this area, due to the prescence of regular traffic on both CN and CP, which has only grown in recent years along with Alberta's petrochemical industry.

Keyera and Shell both have much larger facilites north of Fort Saskatchewan, AB.  Shell's refinery in particular is quite large and has its own switchers in addition to direct service from both CN and CP.

Also, the AltaSteel plant immediately southwest of Kinder Morgan is where many steam locomotives were scrapped during the years of dieselization.  This is where the fledgling Rocky Mountain branch of the Canadian Rail Historical Association managed to save Northern Alberta 2-8-0 #73 from scrap, and over the years that little group and one engine grew into today's Alberta Railway Museum. 

Greetings from Alberta

-an Articulate Malcontent

NDG
  • Member since
    December 2013
  • 1,308 posts
Posted by NDG on Monday, May 27, 2019 11:04 PM

 

Kinder Morgan.
 
Thank You, SIRS!!!!
 
I was ' Fishing ' for Data.
 
I was dimly aware by word of mouth that a ' Huge Oil Terminal built similar in shape to a " Race Track " had recently been constructed at a CN/CP Diamond just outside Edmonton.'
 
Until this morning I knew not where until a clarifying telephone call......AND GOOGLE MAPS!
 
Amazing, all around!
 
My knowledge for that area is Nilch.
 
Last there the day Mount St. Helens erupted and my flight could have been delayed by ash, but was not.
 
I understand much of the rail from the CP Willingdon Sub. went to the Border along Mexico.
 
 
Rolled @ Algoma, at The Soo ( Sault. ) 1907.
 
 
Which ALSO swallowed steam locomotives, including this one and a Twin.
 
 
The Odd Two-span Bascule Bridge just to the South swallowed a steam locomotive, but, they got it back.
 
 

Thank You.

NDG
  • Member since
    December 2013
  • 1,308 posts
Posted by NDG on Monday, June 3, 2019 8:12 AM
  • Member since
    January 2019
  • From: Henrico, VA
  • 3,246 posts
Posted by Flintlock76 on Monday, June 3, 2019 9:44 AM

The bus is interesting, but it can't hold a candle to that PCC on the "cool" scale!

  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: US
  • 17,776 posts
Posted by BaltACD on Monday, June 3, 2019 11:46 AM

NDG

Looked like the bus was carrying signals for a following section!

  • Member since
    July 2010
  • From: Louisiana
  • 1,928 posts
Posted by Paul of Covington on Monday, June 3, 2019 3:17 PM

   As opposed to a "derailment", if the trolley comes off the overhead wire, is that a "dewirement"?

_____________

   "A stranger is just a friend you ain't met yet."  ___ Dave Gardner

  • Member since
    September 2003
  • 10,039 posts
Posted by Overmod on Monday, June 3, 2019 6:23 PM

Paul of Covington
As opposed to a "derailment", if the trolley comes off the overhead wire, is that a "dewirement"?

I believe that is exactly what it is!  

  • Member since
    March 2016
  • From: Burbank IL (near Clearing)
  • 11,733 posts
Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Tuesday, June 4, 2019 7:02 AM

Overmod
 
Paul of Covington
As opposed to a "derailment", if the trolley comes off the overhead wire, is that a "dewirement"?

 

I believe that is exactly what it is!  

 
And that's why retrievers were invented.  They would keep the pole from flailing around and damaging the overhead after a dewirement.
The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
  • Member since
    January 2002
  • From: Equestria
  • 7,274 posts
Posted by zugmann on Tuesday, June 4, 2019 7:47 PM

BaltACD
Looked like the bus was carrying signals for a following section!

Used his right turn signal to go left.  It's training, I guess.

 The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer or any other railroad, company, or person.

  • Member since
    December 2007
  • From: Georgia USA SW of Atlanta
  • 9,541 posts
Posted by blue streak 1 on Tuesday, June 4, 2019 10:16 PM

CSSHEGEWISCH
And that's why retrievers were invented.  They would keep the pole from flailing around and damaging the overhead after a dewirement.

 
But the operator of the car did not rewind the  retriever and it did not do its job as the pole eend was in the plane of the wires.
 

Join our Community!

Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account.

Search the Community

Newsletter Sign-Up

By signing up you may also receive occasional reader surveys and special offers from Trains magazine.Please view our privacy policy