Any locomotive, self-propelled railcar, whatever type, requires inspection four times as frequently as equipment used only as trailers. Not sure about cabcars. Anyone know for sure?
Semper Vaporo Every freight car would have to have an electric motor (of sufficient power to move a fully loaded RR car) and a battery pack (also of sufficient power), and the computer and sensors to be able to detect/calculate where it is so it could position itself, plus, if you want control of switches, then an on-board transmitter (low power) to control them (and the switches equipped with a receiver to accept control signals) and maybe both need transceivers to talk to each other in case the switch cannot be thrown and the car must be stopped. Are you willing to give up available space and weight allowance to have all this added to each car? I bet the battery pack would be pretty big to move a RR freight car.
Every freight car would have to have an electric motor (of sufficient power to move a fully loaded RR car) and a battery pack (also of sufficient power), and the computer and sensors to be able to detect/calculate where it is so it could position itself, plus, if you want control of switches, then an on-board transmitter (low power) to control them (and the switches equipped with a receiver to accept control signals) and maybe both need transceivers to talk to each other in case the switch cannot be thrown and the car must be stopped. Are you willing to give up available space and weight allowance to have all this added to each car? I bet the battery pack would be pretty big to move a RR freight car.
And any offset in reduced crew costs might be obliterated now that you have to pay or contract to a much larger and mobile team to keep all these things working in the first place. Your maintenance requirements just go way more elaborate and involved.
I have been impressed by the artificial intellegence used to program "automatic" trains in train simulators like "Open Rails." They can set up an AI train to do switching, setting off and picking up cars. I imagine it could be done on the prototype, with time.
The idea of self propelled and autmated freight cars is an interesting one. Not too different than trucks on rails. Perhaps that would involve a fleet of "tractor" drone units riding on one truck that could be positioned strategically, sometimes moving in trains, sometimes left on sidings. A couple of these would be enough to pull a whole local.
The labor and assets tied up in the time it takes for switching are a drag on carload service, but if that could be slashed, new possiblities open up.
Of course as rail automation advances, so does truck automation and labor is a bigger factor for them than for railroads. On the other hand, solving the productivity drain of switching is a bigger gain for railroads.
tree68 With the way PTC will likely go, the idea of an "autopilot" might work in areas where manual train handling is less of an issue. Eventually, enough information will probably be available to the locomotives to properly handle most profiles. Given known characteristics (length of train, power available, loads/empties, terrain) a computer will be able to make appropriate adjustments at appropriate times.
With the way PTC will likely go, the idea of an "autopilot" might work in areas where manual train handling is less of an issue. Eventually, enough information will probably be available to the locomotives to properly handle most profiles. Given known characteristics (length of train, power available, loads/empties, terrain) a computer will be able to make appropriate adjustments at appropriate times.
Already have it. GE's Trip Optimizer has auto throttle/dynamic operation. I don't have it on my territory, but it is used on some of the Sunset Route. I've been told it can operate through temporary slows and crossovers. It also will alert the engineer to take manual control if it can't resolve some situation.
We have the NYAB's Leader system. Newer versions also have auto throttle/brake capability. We're supposedly getting them, but I've only seen the old version that just prompts the engineer to make throttle/brake changes.
Jeff
Dixie Flyer There was an article on the internet a few days ago that Freightliner has liscensed a truck cab in the state of Nevada that can drive itself. I remember Trains had a video on freight cars that could automatically couple and uncouple. It appears you could have batteries on a freight car so it could have a range of five miles and be switched through a yard on its own without a hump and retarders. It would simplify spotting cars at industries and other sit-out situations (like passenger cars).
There was an article on the internet a few days ago that Freightliner has liscensed a truck cab in the state of Nevada that can drive itself. I remember Trains had a video on freight cars that could automatically couple and uncouple. It appears you could have batteries on a freight car so it could have a range of five miles and be switched through a yard on its own without a hump and retarders. It would simplify spotting cars at industries and other sit-out situations (like passenger cars).
we have two other discussion threads on this very subject over the last couple weeks:
http://cs.trains.com/trn/f/111/t/90871.aspx
http://cs.trains.com/trn/f/111/t/246456.aspx
Worth checking out as there were some interesting responses..
the second thread covers the exact idea the O.P mentions..
"I Often Dream of Trains"-From the Album of the Same Name by Robyn Hitchcock
Semper Vaporo
Pkgs.
ndbprrWhat will get off it to throw turnouts and apply the handbrake?
I see that as analogous to the "city driving" with the Freightliner truck. A human is required.
Just like precisely spotting a car at an industry.
That's not to say that the technology couldn't be developed to do so (and probably exists, in another application), but it's a ways out for railroads.
OTOH, there are already remotely controlled switches - hardly a technological innovation, and remotely activated "parking" brakes, as have been suggested elsewhere on the forum, would take care of the handbrake problem.
Please note that I am not advocating for "driverless trains." But they'll come when it's economically feasible to do so, ie, when the technology and equipment are cheaper than hiring a human to perform the same function.
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
There's a lot of technology to be built between the current model and self guided trains.
As tried and true as current systems are, problems still occur that are beyond the ability of even onboard, qualified crew to prevent.
There are "people movers" that run sans any sort of crew - but they are on dedicated track with no conflicting movements. Their ROWs are usually pretty well protected (and often indoors/underground) so externally caused problems (trees on the tracks, crossings, etc) are virtually nil.
You'll still need someone qualified available to deal with problems and the unforseen.
As I say, though - we aren't really close yet.
The Freightliner can't really drive itself. It still needs a driver although once on a clearly marked highway it can take over from the driver to a limited extent much as autopilot takes over from the pilot. The driver is required to take control in adverse conditions or for city driving. Currently this is a test truck that can be operated in the state of Nevada only and must have two drivers in the cab. It's quite an advance but still quite far from a self driving truck.
I'm sure the same is coming to railroads. Onboard personnel will go from being skilled operators to technicians and trouble shooters. In my view the engineers who design these things need to figure how to keep the "drivers/operators" occupied.
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