Since there have been so many deaths though would start thread. The fitness gurus in Atlanta and also California starts this discussion.
Now an unconfirmed report of death Saturday in Union City, Ga. This could be either CSX Manchester sub (ACL) or CSX A&WP sub, These 2 subs cross grade separated then run parallel about 1/4 mile apart in Union City with crossover tracks to connect them both.
Take off the headphones - what you hear could save your life!
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
(1) OLI has been sounding the alarm for at least the last six years in big bold letters along with the issues about private crossings.
(2) In less than a month, NTSB is holding hearings on the subject.
Walking or jogging along a track is every bit as dumb as walking or jogging in the left lane of the freeway. (and there are laws against both types of reckless endangerment)
And, I think of the woman who, a few years back, was running on the FEC's main, listening to something so that she could not hear the train that came up behind her--she came out far better than most people in such a situation; she lost part of each leg.
Johnny
After seeing the reaction to my letter to the local paper regarding a photo that appeared in it of a trespasser walking in the guage, we have a long road ahead of us in trying to prevent such incidents. Virtually every comment to my letter on-line supported the tresspasser. And even the trespasser replied, defending her action.
Far too many people (dare I say "most"?) see the tracks as just another pedestrian walkway to get from here to there.
As was pointed out, most of them wouldn't consider walking along the freeway, but I'd opine that if freeways saw the well-spaced (and often only a few trains a day) traffic that railroads see, they'd be walking there, too. Especially if it was a shortcut between points A and B.
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
Maybe the pedestrian problem is like the graffitti problem... basically unsolvable... something we should learn to live with unless we're prepared to fence in or police every mile of railroad. We should accept that the world cannot be made totally safe and that a certain number of deaths and injuries are unavoidable.
Ulrich Maybe the pedestrian problem is like the graffitti problem... basically unsolvable... something we should learn to live with unless we're prepared to fence in or police every mile of railroad. We should accept that the world cannot be made totally safe and that a certain number of deaths and injuries are unavoidable.
Utopians will never accept that.
Norm
Norm48327 Ulrich Maybe the pedestrian problem is like the graffitti problem... basically unsolvable... something we should learn to live with unless we're prepared to fence in or police every mile of railroad. We should accept that the world cannot be made totally safe and that a certain number of deaths and injuries are unavoidable. Utopians will never accept that.
I would tend to agree with what both Ulirch and Norm stated.
Our society seems to want to be on a course that removes all risk from life and Society.
Progress is not without some risk. Possibly, we are on an impossible path. Tresspass like the motorists who race to beat trains to the crossings, requires some level though process, and evaluation of the risk involved.
It is a CHOICE of the individual. The individual who makes that choice, ultimately accepts the risk to themselves; win/loose. The unfortunate part of that is the choice made will involve another person ( in these cases the humans operating the train). Their only choice is to view the inevitability of the situation.
samfp1943The unfortunate part of that is the choice made will involve another person ( in these cases the humans operating the train). Their only choice is to view the inevitability of the situation.
Simple enough, run the trains without crews. No more hours of service. And if somebody gets in the way, the train will just keep going like nothing happened.
Once they know that the trains will not stop and that nobody is up there looking out for them, maybe they will go away. Well, one way or the other, they will go away.
ROAR
The Route of the Broadway Lion The Largest Subway Layout in North Dakota.
Here there be cats. LIONS with CAMERAS
BroadwayLion And if somebody gets in the way, the train will just keep going like nothing happened.
That is a major hurdle that will prevent driverless trains (or cars) for now. where does the liability fall? And since many of the congress critters are lawyers by trade, it is a question that must be answered before wide-spread adoption of the technology.
It's been fun. But it isn't much fun anymore. Signing off for now.
The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.t fun any
Back when belief in the deity was ubiquitous if someone were daft enough to get hit by a train public reaction ranged from the sanguine (It was his “time.”) to the practical (Fool should have known better than to step in front of a train.). Today the public, especially trial lawyers, trip over themselves in fits of righteous indignation demanding protection from acts of Natural Selection. Oh the irony.
Editor Emeritus, This Week at Amtrak
D.Carleton Back when belief in the deity was ubiquitous if someone were daft enough to get hit by a train public reaction ranged from the sanguine (It was his “time.”) to the practical (Fool should have known better than to step in front of a train.). Today the public, especially trial lawyers, trip over themselves in fits of righteous indignation demanding protection from acts of Natural Selection. Oh the irony.
To D. Carleton's point;[snip] "...Today the public, especially trial lawyers, trip over themselves in fits of righteous indignation demanding protection from acts of Natural Selection. Oh the irony..."
It might be that our salvaion and relief will come from either allowing ONLY Lawyers to tresspass on railroad property; or 'beat trains to the crossings'. Society could enjoy the 'gift' of either smarter lawyers, or a reduced presence of those same lawyers in the population, either way, an effective use of Natural Selection..... OH! What a Relief!
The insurance regulations will need to be overhauled .. maybe wide spread no fault insurance is the answer i..e. if my driverless car runs into yours then my insurance pays for my damages and your insurance pays for yours.
and this should go into journalists and trains post
wanswheel Trespassing is a word railroad spokesmen say when somebody dies, and it seems so pointless. If the objective is to prevent fatal incidents, don’t even mention trespassing, because it too much resembles a victimless crime. Instead, emphasize the plight of the engineer.
Modeling the Cleveland and Pittsburgh during the PennCentral era starting on the Cleveland lakefront and ending in Mingo junction
Network TV paying some attention -
http://www.nbcnews.com/nightly-news/video/feds-concerned-over-high-number-of-railroad-pedestrian-accidents-417042499994
As Forest Gump once said, "Stupid is as stupid done"
http://www.bizjournals.com/atlanta/morning_call/2015/03/ntsb-trespassing-probable-cause-of-movie-set.html?ana=yahoo
http://www.ntsb.gov/investigations/AccidentReports/Pages/rab1501.aspx
Full-page ad in every newspqper and thirty second (accompanied by 'weather alert' beeps) spot on all TV stations for a week...
Railroad right of way is private property!
Any person who enters railroad property, with or without a vehicle, will be responsible for any damage that occurs due to their presence. This includes their own injury or death.
The railroad will pursue compensation for damage to railroad property and injuries to rail personnel.
YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED!!! Stay off, except to cross at marked public crossings. On the latter, once started across, keep moving.
No guarantee that the terminally stupid (and their lawyers) would get the message, unfortunately.
Some years ago Japan was experiencing a growing auto vs. train problem. Then the Diet ((Parliament) passed a law making it possible for every single person, business or governmental entity adversely effected to sue for damages caused by delaying a scheduled train.
The car pilots got the message. Grade crossing accidents plummeted, and stayed down.
Chuck
The 'problem' is that even busy railroad lines, to someone that is used to highway traffic, appear to have little to no traffic. Highways have a steady stream of traffic with vehicles 20 to 30 feet apart. A heavy volume railroad will will normally have trains no closer than every 5 to 10 minutes in each direction - to someone who's idea of busy is based on highway observations, there is little to no traffic on the train tracks by comparison.
This is not an excuse, just a observation.
BaltACDThe 'problem' is that even busy railroad lines, to someone that is used to highway traffic, appear to have little to no traffic.
I've made that point before. Take a line with even 12 trains a day, and you're looking at a train every two hours, on average. If any "fleeting" occurs, it could be several hours before someone sees a train. And if a significant amount of the trains run at night, it could appear during waking hours that there is virtually no traffic on a line. Which means a person making that assumption is going to be greatly surprised when a train does show up during the day...
A line with just a half dozen trains a day may seem to the uninitiated to be positively deserted.
2 separate incidents in Huntington WV on separate CSX trains.
http://www.herald-dispatch.com/news/briefs/x1897056235/Man-dies-after-being-hit-by-train
I'm not totally naive, so I know this won't stop most trespassers. But it might be helpful to the railroad in the inevitable ensuing legal fight over the trespasser's dead body.
How about signage at every point of legal entry onto the railroad property, including grade crossings, that say:
"Trespassing on railroad property is prohibited. The use of ear plugs, headphones, ear buds, or similar devices on railroad property is prohibited. Always be prepared for a train to operate on any track, in any direction."
Persons on legitimate railroad business are not trespassers, so the sign does not restrict their entry. The sign won't be seen by someone entering RR property at some other point of entry.
So as I said, this will certainly not end the problem, but it might weaken the legal case of the trespasser or his survivors. Any thoughts?
Tom
There ARE such signs at various points where the public is allowed to cross RR property (grade crossings), indicating to not proceed along the tracks.
But the prohibition on ear plugs (and possibly headphones) cannot be specified... there are some jobs on the RR where ear plugs are REQUIRED.
Semper Vaporo
Pkgs.
Yes, ear plugs are for employees in certain jobs, subject to the Book of Rules. This sign is intended for non-employees.
An interesting and comprehensive report of various incidents of persons and vehicles in the state of Washington.
http://www.utc.wa.gov/publicSafety/railSafety/Pages/OLCrashStatistics.aspx
Thanks for posting! Interesting.
4/17/2008 SEDRO WOOLEY - 20 year-old male pedestrian struck by BNSF freight train in Sedro Wooley. Incident occurred on the BNSF Northwest Division (Bellingham Subdivision) at milepost 87.1.
Sedro-Woolley is on the Sumas Sub...
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