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Great Drone Vid of NS Winter Freights. Watch while still legal.

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Great Drone Vid of NS Winter Freights. Watch while still legal.
Posted by trackrat888 on Friday, February 20, 2015 3:29 PM
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Posted by LensCapOn on Friday, February 20, 2015 3:56 PM

Does that view remind anyone of a model train? At Christmas?

 

 

Don't think bulk freights ran that fast in the good-old-days, or ever.

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Posted by Firelock76 on Friday, February 20, 2015 4:31 PM

Superb video!  Someone's got a great eye for the camera, and that's no lie.  A cut above the somewhat typical railfan video where the angles are poor, the camera's being held as if by a drunk in an earthquake zone, and no sense of time or place.

And I am amazed at how rock-solid the images from the drone are.

And LensCaps' right, it DOES kind of remind me of a Christmas layout.

What I don't get is "...watch while still legal."  As far as I know there's no up-coming prohibitions on private drone use.  The rules in effect are common sense:

Keep the altitude at 500 feet or less.

Keep the drone within eyesight.

Don't fly the drone near an airport, or near government installations.

Don't overfly private property.

DON'T invade anyones privacy, EVER!

Follow these rules and you won't get in trouble.

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Posted by Norm48327 on Friday, February 20, 2015 4:52 PM

Firelock,  Never underestimate the FAA. Confused

Norm


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Posted by BaltACD on Friday, February 20, 2015 5:27 PM

Norm48327

Firelock,  Never underestimate the FAA. Confused

 

And never overestimate paranoia.

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Posted by Firelock76 on Friday, February 20, 2015 5:27 PM

Oh, I don't underestimate the FAA or any government bureaucracy, but as I understand it from a news story I read recently the rules I mentioned ARE the current FAA rules.  They sound pretty reasonable to me.

The only drone use the FAA has forbidden is commercial drone use, at any rate at this time.  So Amazon can forget drone deliveries.  The FAA is considering allowing SOME commercial use, but what kind hasn't been decided yet.

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Posted by Norm48327 on Friday, February 20, 2015 6:30 PM

But I have a right to be paranoid. They were looking over my shoulder for thity years. Wink

Norm


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Posted by tree68 on Friday, February 20, 2015 6:33 PM

I suspect that in the end, "consumer grade" drones will only see some common sense rules.

The "commercial use" issue will not be as easily resolved, as a drone with a GoPro can shoot some pretty amazing video that might not start out as intended for commercial, but could go that way fairly quickly.  And if it is done for commercial purposes, see my next comment.

The problem for the drone user is social media.  Where the FAA used to have to go out and look for violations, they now need only log onto YouTube.  

Consumer use could theoretically go the way of CB radio, requiring a free (or very inexpensive) license that is little more than a paperwork shuffle.  I haven't heard anything to this end, however, so don't count on it.

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Posted by oltmannd on Saturday, February 21, 2015 7:54 AM

Really well done video!  Great editing, too.

-Don (Random stuff, mostly about trains - what else? http://blerfblog.blogspot.com/

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Posted by samfp1943 on Saturday, February 21, 2015 9:45 AM

Firelock76

Oh, I don't underestimate the FAA or any government bureaucracy, but as I understand it from a news story I read recently the rules I mentioned ARE the current FAA rules.  They sound pretty reasonable to me.

The only drone use the FAA has forbidden is commercial drone use, at any rate at this time.  So Amazon can forget drone deliveries.  The FAA is considering allowing SOME commercial use, but what kind hasn't been decided yet.

 

     Just a thought, addded to what Firelock76 (Wayne) Noted: "...The FAA is considering SOME Commercial use, but what kind hasn't been decided yet..."

Not exactly sure how much drones could be utilized by the rail industry, to monitor areas of special concerns(?)..       Possibly, where landslides are a concern, potential for flooding; or even areas where tresspass can be constant and problematic(?). 

  Out here,in the Midwest, pipeline companies "fly their routes' to observe possible problem areas (leaks(?) or incursions on their ROW's.   They use helo's and fixed wing aircraft to monitor their ROW's.  Drone aircraft could be a 'cost effective' alternative for them. I had read recently, somewhere,  that the BNSF has asked(?); or had applied for permission(?) to overfly some of their property with Drones. As the technology improves, we may very well see more drone activity as they go to work for the railroads?

 

 

 


 

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Posted by CShaveRR on Saturday, February 21, 2015 5:15 PM

LensCapOn

Don't think bulk freights ran that fast in the good-old-days, or ever.

 

Oh, they did, and they do!  We had one blow by us during lunch on which I could read car numbers only with great difficulty (and missed the next three or four while writing down what I needed).  If he didn't have any restrcted cars on him, he'd have been going even faster a few miles to the west.  (In my experience these restrictions on equipment have gotten more severe...they're going to try to eliminate accidents by not moving anything!) 

Carl

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Posted by tree68 on Saturday, February 21, 2015 6:07 PM

LensCapOn
Don't think bulk freights ran that fast in the good-old-days, or ever.

CSX holds manifests to 50 MPH on the Chicago Line through NYS.  IM can run 60 MPH except in those places where it's desirable to run slower...

That's clicking them right along...

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Posted by NittanyLion on Saturday, February 21, 2015 8:06 PM

Firelock76

Oh, I don't underestimate the FAA or any government bureaucracy, but as I understand it from a news story I read recently the rules I mentioned ARE the current FAA rules.  They sound pretty reasonable to me.

The only drone use the FAA has forbidden is commercial drone use, at any rate at this time.  So Amazon can forget drone deliveries.  The FAA is considering allowing SOME commercial use, but what kind hasn't been decided yet.

We've had RC planes for, what, 40 years now and all the sudden people decided to start tagging "drone" on to what we used to call RC helicopters and the layperson is freaking out over it for some reason.  True drones are still relatively uncommon, but everyone seems to call a quadcopter a drone.

The FAA's gotta wait on NASA's UAS in the NAS project to do its thing before they can do anything.  FAA handles the operation of aviation, but NASA handles the development (remember what the first A in NASA stands for!).

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Posted by tree68 on Saturday, February 21, 2015 8:33 PM

NittanyLion
We've had RC planes for, what, 40 years now and all the sudden people decided to start tagging "drone" on to what we used to call RC helicopters and the layperson is freaking out over it for some reason.

I don't think it's the aircraft itself that's causing the alarm - it's the cameras that are going aloft with them.  

R/C aircraft enthusiasts of old had to have a certain amount of skill and didn't have video - it was simply too bulky.  R/C helicopters weren't all that stable and didn't have the GPS capabilities now available.

Since R/C fliers were few and far between, and need a runway to take off and land, there could be a certain discipline, however self imposed.

The quad (and more) copters can be flown fairly easily (I can fly my Parrot with my smart phone), are stable, and some will actually find their own way home if they lose signal from their controller.  Just about anyone can fly one.

And, they'll carry a "GoPro" camera very nicely, thank you.  In fact, I saw one demonstration that had two cameras - one regular, one infrared, both with downlinks.  They were showing its use at a drill fire.

Back in the day, about the only thing the neighbors had to worry about was sunbathing in the back yard, and then only briefly as the aircraft flew over (never mind that it probably didn't have a camera in the first place).  Now you can hover one outside someone's window.

Because of the camera capability, users are seeing myriad commercial possibilities that never really existed with traditional RC.  And there lies the rub.

 

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Posted by BaltACD on Saturday, February 21, 2015 9:31 PM

tree68
NittanyLion
We've had RC planes for, what, 40 years now and all the sudden people decided to start tagging "drone" on to what we used to call RC helicopters and the layperson is freaking out over it for some reason.

 

I don't think it's the aircraft itself that's causing the alarm - it's the cameras that are going aloft with them.  

R/C aircraft enthusiasts of old had to have a certain amount of skill and didn't have video - it was simply too bulky.  R/C helicopters weren't all that stable and didn't have the GPS capabilities now available.

Since R/C fliers were few and far between, and need a runway to take off and land, there could be a certain discipline, however self imposed.

The quad (and more) copters can be flown fairly easily (I can fly my Parrot with my smart phone), are stable, and some will actually find their own way home if they lose signal from their controller.  Just about anyone can fly one.

And, they'll carry a "GoPro" camera very nicely, thank you.  In fact, I saw one demonstration that had two cameras - one regular, one infrared, both with downlinks.  They were showing its use at a drill fire.

Back in the day, about the only thing the neighbors had to worry about was sunbathing in the back yard, and then only briefly as the aircraft flew over (never mind that it probably didn't have a camera in the first place).  Now you can hover one outside someone's window.

Because of the camera capability, users are seeing myriad commercial possibilities that never really existed with traditional RC.  And there lies the rub.

All of which highlights one of mankinds foibles - we are ashamed of how we act in 'private', rather than taking pride in our private actions.

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Posted by Firelock76 on Saturday, February 21, 2015 10:17 PM

Balt ol' buddy, I don't think it's a question of being ashamed of how we act in private.  Most of us (I think) realize there's a time and place for everything.  We just don't want the time and place intruded upon.  If you know what I mean.

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Posted by trackrat888 on Sunday, February 22, 2015 10:49 AM

Well the guy has his tripod on the NS ROW. Then there are air rights such as flying over railroad yards and major industrial instilations. I dont know how flying a drone over Clearing or UP Baily and then having to explain to the bulls that U want your drone back after crashing in their yard.

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Posted by Firelock76 on Sunday, February 22, 2015 10:59 AM

I would say the thing is if you're not sure, just don't do it.  As railyards are private property I wouldn't fly a drone over one, at least not unless I was invited or cleared on the property to do so. 

On the right of way?  I'm not sure I'd go on the right of way either.  There's plenty of places to observe railroad action without tresspassing on the ROW.  Why take chances?   Are taking pictures really worth getting in trouble over?   Mind you, if you're not tresspassing and following the rules I think you should be left alone to enjoy your hobby.  I have a libertarian frame of mind that way.

By the way, I watched that video again.  I can't get over how GOOD it is.

Hollywood good. If there was a "Oscar" for rail videos he'd get it!

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Posted by Paul_D_North_Jr on Sunday, February 22, 2015 11:08 AM

Firelock76
Superb video!  Someone's got a great eye for the camera, and that's no lie.  A cut above the somewhat typical railfan video where the angles are poor, the camera's being held as if by a drunk in an earthquake zone, and no sense of time or place.

And I am amazed at how rock-solid the images from the drone are.

And LensCaps' right, it DOES kind of remind me of a Christmas layout.

What I don't get is "...watch while still legal."  As far as I know there's no up-coming prohibitions on private drone use.  The rules in effect are common sense:

Keep the altitude at 500 feet or less.

Keep the drone within eyesight.

Don't fly the drone near an airport, or near government installations.

Don't overfly private property.

DON'T invade anyones privacy, EVER!

Follow these rules and you won't get in trouble.

"Don't overfly private property." - Good principle, but practically and technically almost all of the aerial segments of this video were taken from over someone's private property - i.e., the businesses and houses on either side of the railroad, [EDITED TO ADD:] and the railroad's right-of-way itself - with the exception of when it crossed over some public streets along the way.

I wasn't all that impressed with the editing, esp. of the on-the-ground portion - a "mindless run-by" kind of thing. 

The drone footage was spectacular, but too much time is spent circling that clock tower with the bell chiming - 1:44 to 2:16 = 32 secs., about 1/7 of the video's length, while just barely showing the tracks below and off to one side - without any trains - or connecting to the railroad in some way.  It doesn't say if that tower is part of a former railroad station (doesn't look to be close enough to the tracks, either).  However, the other more ornate brick building next to it and a little closer to the tracks does look more like a railroad station - or maybe it's the low frame building on the other side of the tracks ?    

I'd like to see a video with some 'pacing' the train from above or to one side, possibly zooming in on the cab from time to time (compare with some segments of BN's 1970's "Portrait of a Railroad" documentary), and/ or tracing forward over the top of the train. 

Videos in more scenic environments - mountains, crossing large rivers, etc. - could be show-stoppers.   

Anybody else notice that the videographer credited the ads on Google for funding his trips ?

"Note:

Please excuse the advertisements. Through the Google Adsense program, the advertisements help me pay for the trips I take to capture the trains."

- Paul North.

"This Fascinating Railroad Business" (title of 1943 book by Robert Selph Henry of the AAR)
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Posted by dknelson on Sunday, February 22, 2015 11:09 AM

Drayton Blackgrove does great work with his videos and has quickly mastered the use of drones.

Dave Nelson

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Posted by Firelock76 on Sunday, February 22, 2015 11:15 AM

Pardon, I should have said "Don't overfly private property within reason", what the videographer did didn't seem to me to be unreasonable.  If he was hovering over someone's backyard looking down for "something" or hovering outside someone's window looking for "something else" that'd be another story.

As I said, common-sense should apply.

One more thing:  If the blind heavy hand of government regulation ever comes down hard on drones and their users it'll be because of irresponsible use.  I don't own a drone and don't have any plans on getting one but I hope it doesn't come down to that.

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Posted by Convicted One on Monday, February 23, 2015 12:55 PM

Firelock76
Pardon, I should have said "Don't overfly private property within reason",

 

And there you have it in a nutshell, the justification for the qualifier "watch while still legal"

 Eventually the concept of what is considered "reasonable" will be drawn into somone's crosshairs.

 How high must one build a fence to have a 'reasonable' expectation of privacy?

 My guess is that the backlash will come from an unexpected source. The Government will become leery of tattletales 'snooping' on what uncle sam considers to be it's "private" business.  Or businesses practicing business models where ethics come into question, choosing to dodge scrutiny. (captive feeding, for example)

 Let one well funded "victim" fall prey to observation by others, and the entire landscape could change quickly

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Posted by tree68 on Monday, February 23, 2015 1:51 PM

Given the altitude many of these devices are capable of, it's very easy to have a lot of private property in view in a very short time.

I saw drone footage of a fire not long ago in which the field of view easily covered a city block.  The focus of the video was obviously the fire, but inadvertantly catching that teenage girl sunbathing nude in a back yard would not have been out of the question.

And given enough altitude, and ambient noise (wind, traffic) a high-flying quadcopter would probably not even be noticed.

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Posted by Firelock76 on Monday, February 23, 2015 2:27 PM

"Inadvertantly catching...", and therin lies the rub.

It's what the drone owner does with that inadvertantly caught footage.  If he's a dummy, he'll put it on the 'net with a "ha-ha" attitude. If he's smart, he won't.

We can go round and round with this but what it amounts to for drone sales and use in the future depends on what's done with them right now.  The irresponsible actions of very, very few probably won't make much of a difference.  People can be irresponsible with anything.  If it gets epidemic, well then...

Only time will tell. 

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Posted by Murphy Siding on Monday, February 23, 2015 4:02 PM

     Out in my neck of the woods, it's proabbly going to come to the forefront of the news in realtionship to a charge of discharging a firearm inside the city limits. Cowboy  A lot of folks are pretty protective of their privacy.

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Posted by tree68 on Monday, February 23, 2015 5:00 PM

Murphy Siding

     Out in my neck of the woods, it's proabbly going to come to the forefront of the news in realtionship to a charge of discharging a firearm inside the city limits. Cowboy  A lot of folks are pretty protective of their privacy.

I suspect it won't be long before we hear of one taken out of the air by a hose stream at a fire...

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Posted by Convicted One on Monday, February 23, 2015 5:38 PM

Murphy Siding
it's proabbly going to come to the forefront of the news in realtionship to a charge of discharging a firearm inside the city limits.

 

Funny you would mention that aspect. I've contemplated what I might do in a situatuion  where i felt Imposed upon by one. I wonder if there are any protective property rights provisions for such devices?

 

eg; Gee i'm sorry officer, if I had known that the drone belonged to the police dept i would have used my crossbow" etc...

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Posted by Murphy Siding on Monday, February 23, 2015 6:14 PM

     How in tarntaion was I supposed to know that durnded thing was a drone?  It looked just like one of those UFO's you see in the National Enquirer Alien

     Would I be within my rights, if I have a battle drone attack an unwanted intruder drone in the airspace above my property? Mischief

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Posted by BaltACD on Monday, February 23, 2015 7:22 PM

Murphy Siding

     Hown in tarntaion was I supposed to know that durnded thing was a drone?  It looked just like one of those UFO's you see in the National Enquirer Alien

     Would I be within my rights, if I have a battle drone attack an unwanted intruder drone in the airspace above my property? Mischief

 

There use to be a TV show about Battle Bot's - guess we need one about Battle Drones.

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Posted by Firelock76 on Tuesday, February 24, 2015 10:02 AM

Battle drones?  Nah, it'd be more fun if someone with an R/C P-51 shot it down!

Or an R/C Messerschmitt, depending on your interests!

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