https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yja2VmZOfdA
Part of this video (beginning about 37 secs. and ending at 1 min.) was just aired on the Weather Channel.
Jeff
Jeff: Approx how fast would they have been going? Does the engine rock just a little? If they have that much snow in front of them, is there any way to see anything in front of them or are they just flying blind until they get out of the snow?
She who has no signature! cinscocom-tmw
No conductor standing on the nose of that train. Must have liked the photographer.
It's been fun. But it isn't much fun anymore. Signing off for now.
The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.t fun any
New Brunswick has really been hit hard this winter... storm after storm. Cool video..
And not a wave from anyone....
23 17 46 11
Maybe this warrants another letter..very rude to go by without so much as a wave.
Great video, I'd love to experience that!
Jay
Ulrich Maybe this warrants another letter..very rude to go by without so much as a wave.
They were probably both waving - you just couldn't see them....
I've never plowed that much snow with a locomotive, but I've run through some pretty intense snow bands that limited visibility to near zero. One of many reasons to know your territory...
Slowing down is never a bad idea in such conditions, unless you're really confident. I'd be more afraid of frozen flangeways at crossings than anything else.
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
At what point does an engineer have to worry about hydroplaning(?) at a snow and ice covered crossing in conditions like in this video? I've seen crossings where everything is frozen solid. Does the weight of a train negate that?
Thanks to Chris / CopCarSS for my avatar.
If it's tangent track, just water on it - esp. snow, and not too much ice, run fairly often (say, 8 to 10 times a day) so it flexes and moves even just a little bit to keep it from freezing too tightly together, and the highway dept. is doing its share to keep the crossing free of the big windrows of snow from itself and the railroad - and esp. salting the crossing area so that motorists can stop when they need to, and the brine weakens the ice in the flangeway area - - then no, not a big deal. Start taking away those factors, and the anxiety level increases.
Every derailment I've seen has been on curved track that was filled with some solid (mud, coal dust or dirt, quarry screenings, etc.), and fortunately at low speeds. About 30 years back in Trains there was a frontispiece photo of a CN SW-something that derailed on a crossing, wandered down the street, and came to a stop in front of somebody's house - all around Christmastime !
EDIT TO ADD:
- Paul North.
The engineer of that train in the video seemed pretty confident... he/she is probably a native maritimer... waist deep snow and sub zero temperatures are all in a day's work. Nothing to get too excited about.
On a related note, a few years ago I was driving down south when it started to pour. The rain was coming down in sheets, and I soon noticed that I was the only car on the road. Others to the left and right were pulled off to the side. It just depends on what one is comfortable with and used to.
Ulrich On a related note, a few years ago I was driving down south when it started to pour. The rain was coming down in sheets, and I soon noticed that I was the only car on the road. Others to the left and right were pulled off to the side. It just depends on what one is comfortable with and used to.
Drive I95 from the North to S.Florida frequently. When a 'Florida Frog Drowner' happens - If you pay attention the Northbound lanes will keep moving right along at a reduced speed. The Southbound lanes will have vehicles pulled over to the shoulder by the dozens.
Northbounders have been in Florida for some time and become accustomed to handling such weather, the Southbounders haven't.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
You didn't mention motorcycles taking cover under the overpasses.
Dave
Lackawanna Route of the Phoebe Snow
Planes have instruments for night, inclement weather and fog. Since both the windshields were covered in snow and sticking your head out the window to see probably isn't the best idea, when do you stop to clear heavy, wet snow off the windshields - since the wipers may not be able to move a lot of weight.
Murphy Siding At what point does an engineer have to worry about hydroplaning(?) at a snow and ice covered crossing in conditions like in this video? I've seen crossings where everything is frozen solid. Does the weight of a train negate that?
Some snow plow video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTiIqUSCVKM
Please note the sequence close to the beginning.
We have instructions when spotting empty cars over snow/ice packed crossings to first run the power through the crossing to cut the flangeways. Some locations have instructions to call a manager first.
I've hit a few drifts like the one in the original video, although most weren't as long. For a while though, visibility was zero.
Mookie Planes have instruments for night, inclement weather and fog. Since both the windshields were covered in snow and sticking your head out the window to see probably isn't the best idea, when do you stop to clear heavy, wet snow off the windshields - since the wipers may not be able to move a lot of weight.
Several years ago, I was talking with the enginer of VIA's Canadian as we traveled west from Toronto during the winter about just this sort of running. He was a third generation railroader with lots of northern experience and told me that he found himself (and his train!) going across a field after hitting a compacted road crossing some years prior...flanges lifted by sand and ice on a slight curve. It wasn't the Canadian he was running at that time.
But so far, no one has answered questions by both Murphy and myself - how do you deal with this and what is proper procedure.
Anyone want to give us a little more information?
Mookie But so far, no one has answered questions by both Murphy and myself - how do you deal with this and what is proper procedure. Anyone want to give us a little more information?
Just like running in heavy fog. All about knowing the territory.
First of all, I'd say that this is a very experienced, confident engineer, who's getting a thrill out of this, and knows what can be done (none of them would throw caution to the wind exactly). He also has a very good sense of situational awareness.You'll notice that even with the snow piling up and blowing back the way it is, that he has, for the most part, some unobstructed portions of the front windows. You may take it from me that you make do with what you have when there's no way to clear away the part of the windows you don't have. He has enough of a feel for his territory to know roughly where he is in relation to the crossing, and--just possibly--the ablity to see his "landmarks" along the route that tell him what he needs to know about sounding for the crossing (if you listen closely, you'll note that he started sounding the horn some distance ahead of it, probably farther in advance than usual, then paused, and finished the signal as he got closer, after the flashers had activated). But I'm sure Jeff will agree: a good engineer knows his line well enough that he could (not that he would) run it without all of it being visible to him--he could literally be feeling his way! An engneer with less experience would probably take this part of the trip more slowly--and he just might get himself stuck as a result.
Carl
Railroader Emeritus (practiced railroading for 46 years--and in 2010 I finally got it right!)
CAACSCOCOM--I don't want to behave improperly, so I just won't behave at all. (SM)
CShaveRRAn engneer with less experience would probably take this part of the trip more slowly--and he just might get himself stuck as a result.
Call MOW. Tell them to bring shovels.
It is all about knowing one's territory. If you listen to the audio with the video, you'll hear the horn start well back from the crossing - further, probably, than you might on a sunny summer day with clear skies and unlimited visibility.
In fog, you reduce your speed accordingly, just as you would if you were driving a car. You do the same thing in this circumstance, save the need to have your speed up to bust the drifts.
Knowledge of the territory is why you'll find the most senior folks running snowplows and flangers. They need to know the territory like the back of their hand. Hitting one crossing with the blade lowered will ruin your whole day...
and, it may make the highway department a bit unhappy, too.
Johnny
Trains do not operate on immediate line of sight. The operate on signal indication or track authorities (most use track warrents) that give them operational authority on the section of track they are opeating on. Track speed for the territory sets the operational speed limit. The engineer then relies on his knowledge of the physical characteristics of his territory and the situational awareness of where he is in relation to road crossings and signal locations.
Experienced engineers will amaze you in their knowledge of where they are and what the train handling needs of their train are at that particular location and what they have to do to proceed further.
Thank you for the good explanations. Running almost blind, at a fair speed with that much power and weight just doesn't really appeal to me. Maybe that is why it is a little scary to me even in a video.
Rember riding in the cab (E8) of the PRR passenger train going from Richmond Indiana to Coumbus Ohio in a fog at over 80mph (we had cab signals) but all that could be seen from inside the cab was the headlight reflecting back from the fog. At least we knew there was no train on the track ahead of us but some idiot on the track would not have been seen. In discusions with engineers, they said the worst thing they had hit was a molasses truck. I thought about whether they meant survived. I had thoughts about a gas tanker but kept my mouth shut. We made the schedule and did not slow down.
Paul_D_North_Jr About 30 years back in Trains there was a frontispiece photo of a CN SW-something that derailed on a crossing, wandered down the street, and came to a stop in front of somebody's house - all around Christmastime !
Thank you dear for the trains, but it was N-scale that I wanted.
Wow, what a way to get trains for Christmas!
Ken G Price My N-Scale Layout
Digitrax Super Empire Builder Radio System. South Valley Texas Railroad. SVTRR
N-Scale out west. 1996-1998 or so! UP, SP, Missouri Pacific, C&NW.
BaltACD Trains do not operate on immediate line of sight.
Trains do not operate on immediate line of sight.
What about restricted speed?
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