Hiawatha's Finally Back Home!

[Anonymous]

Ok some of you seen the picture of the Hiawatha - Cedar Rapids Observation car. Now we all have a chance to see it! I hopped in my car after work to see if I could find it. Being that it is midnight now I was kinda worried about being harassed. On the other side there was a feeling of rail road destany....I had to go! The most recent pic I've seen of any of the 6 made was 3 years ago. What a sad looking thing rotting in N. Michigan.

And then I saw what I have been looking for the last few years for! She seemed larger then life....I NEVER thought I would see one (let alone touch one!) In my lifetime (yea Im only 24).
If you want to see her at the moment she is sitting in front of the Milwaukee Art Museuem, outside. Just to the left is the Oscar Meyer Wienermobile! I have to get a pic of my car with this...I'll die a happy kiddy!

If you live anywhere near Milwaukee...get off your buns and see this exibit!
Im sure they would prefer during daylight hours though!
Icemanmike - STILL The home of the Hiawatha!

[dknelson]

What my pal the IceMan is referring to is an exhibit at the Milwaukee Art Center, on the lakefront, of the works of industrial designer Brooks Stevens. that included the 1948 Hiawatha trainset -- they have the Skyview Lounge on a length of track out front -- as well as the Avanti and Studebaker Lark automobiles, the Oscar Meyer Weinermobile, and various household products.
The art center itself is worth seeing -- it is designed by Spanish architect Santiago Calatrava and features a movable set of wings the size of a 747s. It makes for a dramatic photo against the deep blue of Lake Michigan. From the Lincoln memorial statue above you could get a shot of the passenger car. the buildings wings outstretched, and the lake.
Dave Nelson

[Anonymous]

I think we ar getting spoiled this year Dave!
:) Icemanmike-Milwaukee

[Anonymous]

Thanks for the info. The boy's and I are looking for an excuse to go up to Milwaukee. To bad the weather will not cooperate.
TIM A

[bigboy4024]

isnt the cider rapids owend buy the frends of 261?
big boy

[Anonymous]

Thats a good question! The Cedar Rapids car (Let alone any glass dome Hiawatha car) was a real shock. Like I noted earler I thought they all died..or where in the process of rotting away.
Icemanmike-Milwaukee
Still home of the Hiawatha!

[Anonymous]

You say that there is another old "Skytop" in bad shape in Michigan? I wasn't aware that any others even existed. Being from Michigan myself, I'd like to know where it is. Also, do you have any photos of the car?
In the mid-1970's, I was helping the "Little River R.R." put into service 2 ex- MILW coaches that were in terrible shape. Shame it was, these beautilully designed cars were constructed of common steel. When we got the coaches for the LRRRR, the vestibules were totally rusted out, and there were roof leaks as well. It's been about 15 years since I have been involved in the LRRR, but last time I saw those coaches, they were looking pretty good. I always thought that a "Skytop" obs. would have really been the "cream on the pie" for the LRRR train.
Please give me some details on where this "lost" skytop is.........
Todd C.

[Anonymous]

Sorry man..I saw the pics on a webpage 2 years ago! I used an search engine typed in Hiawatha...then Volia! There (where ever there is) I saw this sad looking pic. I only wi***he entire train was saved. Oh well; whoulda, coulda, shoulda wont help now!

The longer I play in this hobby the more crazy stuff I find. Never give up, It seems if you ask for it it will come. I agree, it sucks to see a piece of history get scraped or rot away. I found a few odds and ends around SE Wisconsin & N. Illinois. I only wonder what I can find IF I was to be looking seriously for these hidden tresures.

Icemanmike-Milwaukee

[Anonymous]

Well, I can certainly relate to that "shoulda, coulda, regret". I was a "fixture" in the GTW shops in Battle Creek when I was a young teenager, and I had access to just about every corner of the complex. My biggest regret is that I only shot a few rolls of film there back then. Today everything has changed. I'll never see the old Alco's, Geeps, and NW's of those days.
Back in those days, I figured that the shops would be around forever, after all, they had stood firm since about 1904.
Alas, the big CN takeover came about, and everything changed overnight.
I'll still remember those hot summer days though, sitting around the big wooden table in the crew breakroom, playing cards, and listening to stories of "the good old days".
Todd C.

[Modelcar]

....There is a pic of the Skyview Lounge OBS car on one of the pages of trains.com and it shows the unloading from a lo-boy trailer of that car and being placed back on it's trucks on the short piece of track at the Milwaukee Art Center. You can put it in motion and see how the two cranes did the job of unloading, etc. Pretty neat.

Some years ago I remember seeing a pic of one of those cars being burned...Not sure where but it was an operation of junking it out probably, etc.

On the Weinermobile...I have a model of it about 3" long and it even plays the theme music of that Company's operation.

Wasn't the Avanti the creation of Industrial Designer Raymond Lowey.

QM

[Anonymous]

Yea, its funny how we are so sure that tomorow will be like today, only to relize that you guessed wrong and lost that slight chance of colecting fond memories! I relise that now more then ever.

I fell asleep listining to my favorite dance station from Chicago. When I relised my computer was on for 5 hours I got up and I was going to shut it off. Then I heard a crying fan saying "Its too bad you have to go". Then I relised....That I had 16 hours left till the station was signing of for good...no more!

Enjoy life as much as you can...Ya dont know when the ride will end!
Icemanmike-Milwaukee

[Anonymous]

ToodC-
I believe that last Sky-Top is in Ontanagon, Mich, on the E&LS.
And I agree-for about two years, I spent some wonderful times with Fran Weiner, the unofficial Wisconsin Central photog, in and around the WC yards in North Fond du Lac, WI. I was allowed into more secure areas because of Fran and his wife Dorothy, and I have the photos to show for it. Fran's passing in April '90 and the takeover by CN was a blow to my railfanning here. The NFDL Pride Days would offer tours of the shop every year from '87 until about '95, but they were generic at best, catering to the non-railfans.
Oh, for the good old days!!

[dknelson]

3:56 am? 4:44 am? Get some sleep boys! Take it from a geezer -- get the sleep now while you can!
PS note the nice shots of the skytop on the Trains.com website.

Dave Nelson

[Anonymous]

Dave, don't be too concerned about my lack of sleep. I work nights, so 3 in the morning to you, is like 3 in the afternoon to me. About the only time I can assume a "normal" schedule, is on weekends, although it is still hard to get up really early.
By the way, what ever became of the sleeper skytops that went to the CN?
Todd C.

[Anonymous]

I guess your right Dave! Im so used to getting off work at midnight & staying up till 4am. It does suck to wake up at noon just to start it all over. You also get odd looks trainspotting at those hours :)

Icemanmike-Milwaukee

[dknelson]

Well you'll get odd looks trainspotting at ANY hour these days .... :(

I recall the former Milw Rd full length domes after their CN careers were purchased or leased by the CNW as track inspection cars and therefore maybe the UP still has one?
Those were really heavy cars (I mean weight but heavy in other ways too)! I never rode one but sure saw them on the Hiawatha in the 1960s.
Dave Nelson

[Anonymous]

Skytop Obs Cedar Rapids is now owned by the 261 folks. Understand they rented it to the Milw Art Center for 3 months for the Brook Stevens's show. Do not believe 261 will be running any fan trips until at least September. Heard a rumor that the rental money will help fix the car's b/o air conditioning system.
The rotting Obs is on E&LS, possibly near Wells, Michigan. Was told it has been totally neglected, & badly shot up by so called hunters.
2 more ex Milw Road Obs are supposed to be on a barge in Erie, Pa. harbor, for a resturant deal that fell apart. May have been moved by now, not sure what shape they are in.

[Anonymous]

Sir, sorry it took me so long to reply. I just want to say that I beg to differ on Hiawatha's true home. It should be Chicago!! All the pictures I have seen published show the Hiawatha leaveing Chicago. I do not have the knowledge that you have, I only have Library knowledge. I have been through very many books, I do not recall seeing a picture of Hiawatha in Milwaukee. I probably sound like a young fool but can you explain why Hiawatha's home is Milwaukee??
TIM A

[JoeKoh]

tim
the chicago st.paul&pacifics nickname was The Milwaukee Road.Milwaukee was also home to engine and car shops.Am I correct mike?
thanks
stay safe
joe

[Anonymous]

The Milwaukee Roads "Main" location was Milwaukee. That is where most of the shops that kept the road alive where (So I thought). I have many pics of the workers down "In The Valley".

Ironicly most of the pics Ive seen have been, The "OLD" Milwaukee Road Depot in Milwaukee, Rondout Ill, Elm Grove Wi, Wauatosa Wi, and a few others that dont really ring a bell. Odd enough Ive never seen a pic of the OLD Hiawathas In Chicago. But Ive seen the CNW 400's EVERYWHERE!

I guess it depends on what your looking for!
Icemanmike-Milwaukee

[Anonymous]

Hey guys, for what it's worth, here in southern Michigan, we have a couple of old original Milwaukee Road coaches in service on the "Little River RR". I think these were from the "post-war" Hiawatha, In the 1980's, only one side of the cars was repainted. The other side was still in the 1950's "UP Yellow".
Last time I saw them, they were both repainted into the "Orange-Red-Black" Original scheme.
The other car that usually is in the consist is an old "Gulf, Mobile & Ohio" combination baggage/coach.
Todd C.

[dknelson]

One good reason to say the Hiawatha is "home" in Milwaukee is that few railroads built as much of their own freight and passenger cars as did the Milwaukee Road, and at one time the shops here in Milwaukee were the city's largest single employer. I seem to recall up to 10,000 workers.
Curiously I cannot recall a photo of the Hiawatha in Chicago. There are many photos taken at the downtown Milwaukee Depot, and classic photos by Russ Porter, Jim Scribbins, A.C. Kalmbach, Linn Westcott, and others all focus on Milwaukee.
Dave Nelson

[Anonymous]

I have seen a few photos published of the HI in Chicago, but all were outside Union Station. The dark caverns of the trainsheds really weren't all that "photo-friendly".
Todd C.

[Anonymous]

How long is this going to be on display? How much of it do you get to see and how close?

[sooblue]

I toured the Cedar rapids sky top obsv. car.
when it was sitting in duluth mn.
Did they pretty it up or something?
I thought is looked extreamly shabby.
And I think it's about as plain-jane as you can get.
I will say though, it has a lot of potential if it was restored.
maybe it has been by now.
Sooblue