I'm a newbie in terms of BNSF and its symbols. Unlike CSX which I see much more often, BNSF trains do not regularly announce their symbol on the radio. I get the general format of BNSF symbols, but I'm not quite sure how to obtain them. I see many railfanning videos that include each and every symbol of BNSF trains, and I wonder how they know the symbols without them calling it out via radio. I don't work for the railroad, and while I know some of those railfans do there are plenty of others who know the symbol anyway even without working for BNSF. Is there a good way to get ahold of the symbol of a BNSF train after it passes, since they don't call them on the radio? I'm going to railfan parts of the BNSF later next month, and I'm looking for a good way to find out the symbols of the trains I see. Any help is appreciated :)
About three, maybe four years ago "Trains" had an article that explained each of the Class 1 carriers train identifaction systems. Each carriers train ID system is ingrained in their "Car & Train Movement" computer systems. There is virtually no crossover between carriers ID systems.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
There are several "wikis" on train symbols.
I found one for BNSF at http://railroadfan.com/wiki/index.php/BNSF_Train_Symbols
Keep in mind that these wikis are "crowd sourced," so they're only as accurate as the people who are discerning the symbols by listening to traffic, etc.
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
Snowman:
I have and spreadsheet with 1621 BNSF train symbols. Each has the train type, orgination,destination and notes if applicable. For example the HSPOALT is a high priority merchanise train (H symbol) originating in Spokane, WA(SPO) to Alliance, TX(ALT). If you email me at igoldberg1@comcast.net I will attach it as a reply to you. I do update it as new train symbols are assigned to trains.
Caldreamer
Thanks for the info, I didn't know there was a list. Though I'm not really sure how I find out the symbol of a train in the first place, so the symbol list doesn't really help me too much (it's still good to know about:). I'm assuming it's very hard to know a train symbol without having access to BNSF's internal data.
No reason to announce symbol on the air. Trains are identified by eng #, such as BNSF 5343. When coming into town for the crew change and calling for the outbound crew, I (and everyone else) always use the eng number & direction--"BNSF 5343 east to the outbound' Sam Andrews
SFbrkmnNo reason to announce symbol on the air. Trains are identified by eng #, such as BNSF 5343. When coming into town for the crew change and calling for the outbound crew, I (and everyone else) always use the eng number & direction--"BNSF 5343 east to the outbound' Sam Andrews
Different carriers with different rule books and different train identification systems.
SFbrkmn - When crew calling reaches you on the telephone - how do they identify the train or assignment you are being called to work? From my personal experiences, engine numbers are not an element of the data that is given to crew management to initiate the calling action.
Within CSX, the Train ID is what follows the train from its Origin to its Destination - engine number(s) may change during the route of that train.
On CSX when 'calling signals on the road channel' the announcement would be as follows 'M216-24 Engine BNSF 3001 East Clear Signal Bayview Number 2 track'. Crew Management when calling crews would identify it as 'M216-24', crew management has no idea what engine(s) the train may have or will have as there is the potential for power to be changed at the crew change location.
BNSF trains approaching Yardley (Spokane), WA, or Hauser, ID, will usually identify themselves by symbol when calling out to either yard for instructions. After the yard tells them which track, trains will then indentify themselves by lead unit number when relaying their landing instructions to the dispatcher.
BaltACD When I receive the 90 min robot o/d call, it is for an o/d time in leiu of the actual train. You're given a train symbol but chances are you will not depart on that train. You won't know until showing up at the lobby and sorting across the board order and looking at train tracking and eng GPS speed updates. SF lines fall under first-in, first out, unlike some BN properities. This means you leave in the order you were called and not the arrival order of the trains themselves unless it is a yd originator--then you're stuck to it no matter what. When approaching the limits of an active form B, contact w/the gang formean is by identifying eng # & direction--not the symbol. He is not letting you through unless the #number & direction is announced. I have never heard of an event where a train attempted to access a form B using the symbol and not the lead eng number or what is on the GTB. Sam Andrews from the air capital of Wichita, KS SFbrkmn No reason to announce symbol on the air. Trains are identified by eng #, such as BNSF 5343. When coming into town for the crew change and calling for the outbound crew, I (and everyone else) always use the eng number & direction--"BNSF 5343 east to the outbound' Sam Andrews Different carriers with different rule books and different train identification systems. SFbrkmn - When crew calling reaches you on the telephone - how do they identify the train or assignment you are being called to work? From my personal experiences, engine numbers are not an element of the data that is given to crew management to initiate the calling action. Within CSX, the Train ID is what follows the train from its Origin to its Destination - engine number(s) may change during the route of that train. On CSX when 'calling signals on the road channel' the announcement would be as follows 'M216-24 Engine BNSF 3001 East Clear Signal Bayview Number 2 track'. Crew Management when calling crews would identify it as 'M216-24', crew management has no idea what engine(s) the train may have or will have as there is the potential for power to be changed at the crew change location.
When I receive the 90 min robot o/d call, it is for an o/d time in leiu of the actual train. You're given a train symbol but chances are you will not depart on that train. You won't know until showing up at the lobby and sorting across the board order and looking at train tracking and eng GPS speed updates. SF lines fall under first-in, first out, unlike some BN properities. This means you leave in the order you were called and not the arrival order of the trains themselves unless it is a yd originator--then you're stuck to it no matter what. When approaching the limits of an active form B, contact w/the gang formean is by identifying eng # & direction--not the symbol. He is not letting you through unless the #number & direction is announced. I have never heard of an event where a train attempted to access a form B using the symbol and not the lead eng number or what is on the GTB.
Sam Andrews from the air capital of Wichita, KS
SFbrkmn No reason to announce symbol on the air. Trains are identified by eng #, such as BNSF 5343. When coming into town for the crew change and calling for the outbound crew, I (and everyone else) always use the eng number & direction--"BNSF 5343 east to the outbound' Sam Andrews
SFbrkmn When I receive the 90 min robot o/d call, it is for an o/d time in leiu of the actual train. You're given a train symbol but chances are you will not depart on that train. You won't know until showing up at the lobby and sorting across the board order and looking at train tracking and eng GPS speed updates. SF lines fall under first-in, first out, unlike some BN properities. This means you leave in the order you were called and not the arrival order of the trains themselves unless it is a yd originator--then you're stuck to it no matter what. When approaching the limits of an active form B, contact w/the gang formean is by identifying eng # & direction--not the symbol. He is not letting you through unless the #number & direction is announced. I have never heard of an event where a train attempted to access a form B using the symbol and not the lead eng number or what is on the GTB. Sam Andrews from the air capital of Wichita, KS
Do BNSF Rules require the names of the crew to be printed on the Train Messages of the train you are actually going to operate and thus your names will appear on the computer 'Train Sheet' that the Train Dispatcher uses to 'track' the train you are actually operating across the Train Dispatcher's territory and that your route may require to be handed off to another Dispatcher for operation on adjoining territory?
CSX Rules require correct crew names to be on the Train Sheet and Train Messages. In some cases, the Train Crew will have to contact the Train Dispatcher to insure that they have the correct train bulletin (each Train Bulletin is given a specific number in CADS) .
CSX has multiple crew agreements among the prior carriers that went into form CSX. B&O, C&O, ACL, SAL, L&N, CCR, GARR, A&WP, C&EI and a few more that I have forgotten. Among all those different agreements there are differences in how FIFO is applied. Throw in crews on 'assigned' runs on specific train identities and runs that go to designated Pools and other runs that go to Extra Board crews, not Pool Crews.
There is no one size fits all in the Railroad Industry. Contracts get 'localized' to cover specific characteristics on individual territories to the mutual 'satisfaction' of both the employees and the carrier.
We're called first in/first out at our home terminal. At the away from home terminal we are "blueprinted." It means on the way out you can be run around, sometimes multiple times, but fall back into line upon tie-up at the AFHT. Depending on rest times, those that ran around you will get called ahead of you. If things are slow, those that went around you get tied up ahead, sometimes a few hours, and will stay behind you. Then you go out on your rest while those behind are able to be in the hotel long enough to go on held-away (some call it hostage pay). Right now you go on held away after 16 hours off at the AFHT.
We get called for a train and a time. In unusual circumstances, one train has problems for example, the dispatcher can swap crews around. Sometimes one is lucky and gets a better train, other times you get the worse train.
Most of the time we'll use our engine number and direction over the radio. Sometimes when calling the yard for instructions or the outbound when the engines have been changed we'll use the symbol. We have an "On Duty Train Sheet" that shows train, crew members, call time, remaining HOS time and other info. I print one off for each pool on my run to have an idea of who's where, especially the higher priority trains.
Jeff
I was in Victorville, CA on Monday and while I didn't see any mainline freights, I did see a local doing some switching around the sidings. When it passed the Amtrak station it had 6 covered hoppers behind 2 gevos (engines were 8002 and 3993); five of the covered hoppers were BN/BNSF but one was "DJTX". The train then tied up adjacent to the Amtrak station in the farthest siding. Anyone have an idea of what the symbol was on this somewhat unusual local?
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