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Rotary grain hoppers?

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Saturday, October 9, 2021 10:07 AM

I have the issue with that story.  The cover was by Gil Reid and showed the modified T&P 2-10-2 in service.

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Posted by Gramp on Saturday, October 9, 2021 12:14 PM

jeffhergert

 

 
timz

 

 
mudchicken
Older grain elevators still have a device that could tilt over to 45 degrees (but not rotate) old grain loading boxcars

 

Trains had an article (1950s?) on car tilters. As I recall they didn't just rotate the car around its longitudinal axis -- the front end of the car tilted up/down as the car was rotating left/right, the way you would do if you were emptying the car by hand.

 

 

 

 

Unloading a box car.  About 19 mins 15 secs in.

https://www.nfb.ca/film/grain_handling_in_canada/ 

Jeff

 

Gee, what a laborious process (Grain handling).

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Posted by BaltACD on Saturday, October 9, 2021 1:51 PM

Gramp
 
jeffhergert 
timz 
mudchicken
Older grain elevators still have a device that could tilt over to 45 degrees (but not rotate) old grain loading boxcars 

Trains had an article (1950s?) on car tilters. As I recall they didn't just rotate the car around its longitudinal axis -- the front end of the car tilted up/down as the car was rotating left/right, the way you would do if you were emptying the car by hand. 

Unloading a box car.  About 19 mins 15 secs in.

https://www.nfb.ca/film/grain_handling_in_canada/ 

Jeff 

Gee, what a laborious process (Grain handling).

Suspect procedures have been streamlined in the march from the 1940's to the 21st Century.  Can't imagine any FARMER bringing his crop to the elevator in the back of a pick up truck.  Note that the film brags that a box car load of grain can be unloaded in 7 minutes - from the 21st Century viewpoint, unloaing 40 to 70 tons of grain from a box car in 7 minutes is not 'earth shattering' speed.

The thing that blows my mind is just how many acres of grain are farmed between the US and Canada on a yearly basis.  I make a yearly jaunt between Topeka, KS and the East Coast - driving through Indiana and Illinois where there are grain fields as far as the eye can see through 360 degrees of vision - that level of grain farming basically exists on every acre of prairie from the Arctic Circle to the Rio Grande River and everywhere in between.

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Posted by Overmod on Sunday, October 10, 2021 8:55 PM

CSSHEGEWISCH
I have the issue with that story.  The cover was by Gil Reid and showed the modified T&P 2-10-2 in service.

The Snuff Dioper and the Yellow Dog Blues.

Many years later with the joys of the Internet available I went back and looked over some of the Fuller-Lehigh development in the 1920s.  It was not quite as devoid of common sense as the Trains article made it seem... but it was one of those great drag-era optimizations like the D&H high-pressure compounds.

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Posted by Murphy Siding on Monday, October 11, 2021 7:57 AM

SD60MAC9500
 

Murphy is it possible to post a pic of these covered hoppers?

 
 
 
 

No, I was on vacation a couple hundred miles from home.

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Posted by Murphy Siding on Monday, October 11, 2021 8:00 AM

jeffhergert

When he said cheap coal that was more like a pile of coal dust, I thought of lignite.  The Milwaukee Road had a unit train with special cars with covers that ran up in the Dakotas/Montana between a mine and power plant.  There was also an article in Trains many years ago about a steam locomotive modified to use lignite as a test.  IIRC, it was a Texas and Pacific engine, called the "snuff dipper" because of the texture of the coal.

Jeff

 

I remember that. I believe it went from a mine in Montana, accross a little corner of ND, then accoss the top of SD on the Milwaukee Road to Big Stone power plant on the SD/MN border. I think it's the reason that portion of the Milwaukee Road didn't disappear into the dustbin of history.

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Posted by cv_acr on Wednesday, October 13, 2021 9:40 AM

BaltACD
Suspect procedures have been streamlined in the march from the 1940's to the 21st Century.  Can't imagine any FARMER bringing his crop to the elevator in the back of a pick up truck.  Note that the film brags that a box car load of grain can be unloaded in 7 minutes - from the 21st Century viewpoint, unloaing 40 to 70 tons of grain from a box car in 7 minutes is not 'earth shattering' speed.

Well definitely they have.

No longer bulk loads in 50-70 ton boxcars, but exclusively high-capacity 100-120 ton covered hoppers.

Grains from the fields are handled with large tractors and grain wagons to the local elevators (which are much larger, consolidated complexes compared to the old "prairie skyscraper" wood structures. Where it will be transloaded to transport trucks and/or rail cars.

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Posted by BaltACD on Wednesday, October 13, 2021 10:34 AM

cv_acr
 
BaltACD
Suspect procedures have been streamlined in the march from the 1940's to the 21st Century.  Can't imagine any FARMER bringing his crop to the elevator in the back of a pick up truck.  Note that the film brags that a box car load of grain can be unloaded in 7 minutes - from the 21st Century viewpoint, unloaing 40 to 70 tons of grain from a box car in 7 minutes is not 'earth shattering' speed. 

Well definitely they have.

No longer bulk loads in 50-70 ton boxcars, but exclusively high-capacity 100-120 ton covered hoppers.

Grains from the fields are handled with large tractors and grain wagons to the local elevators (which are much larger, consolidated complexes compared to the old "prairie skyscraper" wood structures. Where it will be transloaded to transport trucks and/or rail cars.

There are several YouTube channels that illustrate 21st Century farming

Laura Farms is one from Nebraska

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XaeGRmbs6bk

Welker Farms is another one from Montana

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JokzSFQFZdY

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Posted by wjstix on Wednesday, October 13, 2021 3:32 PM

Murphy Siding

Maybe I'm out of touch. East of Kimball S.D. on the Dakota Southern RR is a ginormous grain elevator. It has a 12 or 13 track storage area that butts up to I-90. I noticed that the covered hoppers there were all red at one end, the way coal cars are painted. Do these run through a rotary dumper to empty the cars?

 
Well, logic would say that wouldn't work. Hopper and Bathtub Gons used to haul coal are open on top, so turning them over to dump makes sense. Covered hopper cars are, well, covered, so trying to dump the grain out the trough hatches on top would be more difficult than dumping out the bottom per usual.
 
As has been noted, some railroads did as a decoration color one end of the car differently than the rest, it could well just be that the cars you saw were painted that way by the company that owned/leased the cars as a decoration.
 
 
 
 
Iron ore cars used in taconite unit trains quite often have one end of the car painted yellow, to help line up the cars under the loader. I don't know that something like that would help loading a unit train of grain cars however.
Stix
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Posted by Murphy Siding on Wednesday, October 13, 2021 4:50 PM

jeffhergert

When he said cheap coal that was more like a pile of coal dust, I thought of lignite.  The Milwaukee Road had a unit train with special cars with covers that ran up in the Dakotas/Montana between a mine and power plant.  There was also an article in Trains many years ago about a steam locomotive modified to use lignite as a test.  IIRC, it was a Texas and Pacific engine, called the "snuff dipper" because of the texture of the coal.

Jeff

 

For what it's worth, that rang a bell with me. Our old lumberyard was where the Rock Island and The Milwaukee Road crossed each other. It's quite possible the cheap coal came on the Milwaukee.

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Posted by Overmod on Wednesday, October 13, 2021 8:25 PM

Murphy Siding
For what it's worth, that rang a bell with me.

Cheap coal in a pile at a coal yard would be lignite no more than 5nm nanoparticles would be used in sunscreen.  A considerable range of lignite turns to dust as its water evaporates, yes, but the result is pyrophoric, aning the least delightful things in a yard full of bituminous dust and CERTAINLY something you wouldn't slide 100' in a metal trough into a closed basement... Surprise

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