Read on another form that CSX is considering moving all dispatch back to Jacksonville by September ? So the next time there is another weather emergency will that shut down the whole CSX ?
Understand that VRE wanted the RF&P line dispatch moved to Baltimore ? Once that was done their OTP improved. ?
blue streak 1Read on another form that CSX is considering moving all dispatch back to Jacksonville by September ? So the next time there is another weather emergency will that shut down the whole CSX ? Understand that VRE wanted the RF&P line dispatch moved to Baltimore ? Once that was done their OTP improved. ?
Weather Emergencies have never shut down the Jacksonville Dispatch Center.
Weather Emergencies do shut down the A line, S line, PD&PA as will as the NO&M in the anticipated 'strike area' as the signal department employees have been instructed to remove crossing gates to prevent them from becoming part of the flying debris that happens in areas with hurricane force winds as well as other storm preparations.
The cause of VRE (and other passenger operations) poor performance was a prior Vice President of Operations who had the philosophy of CSX first, all others be damned. He retained this philosophy right up until he had a 'meeting with Jesus' in the form of all the political functionaries that support Amtrak, VRE, MARC, MBTA and Tri-Rail - once those positions were explained to him IN PERSON with no weasel room - all passenger performances improved drastically. Shortly after the 'come to Jesus' meeting, this individual was given his walking papers, primarily for putting CSX in the embarassing position of having to attend the 'come to Jesus' meeing in the first place.
Having worked at both Jacksonville and Baltimore there was effectively no difference in how the division's dispatchers were managed - Senior Division management rarely set foot in the Dispatch Center in either location.
It is not a matter of considering - Official Notices have been posted.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
It's a done deal from what I can see!
BaltACDWeather Emergencies have never shut down the Jacksonville Dispatch Center.
Have there been any interuptions to communications or are there back up (diverse routed) circuits for radio and CTC data that provide for circuit outages due to cable cuts or fiber cuts etc. The design I engineered for our data center provided two routes for the circuits and we survived the Hinsdale Central Office fire which interupted one of the two main paths between the data ctr and our HQ. I have experienced many Telephone Company CO outages that "Can't Happen" The Lombard CO had a flood and on another occasion lost all its power due to a battery bus fault. Many cable cuts. Diversity is as the Mastercard ad states "Priceless" I know they design the centers to be hardened facilities but sometimes it not wise to put all your eggs in one basket.
Electroliner 1935 BaltACD Have there been any interuptions to communications or are there back up (diverse routed) circuits for radio and CTC data that provide for circuit outages due to cable cuts or fiber cuts etc. The design I engineered for our data center provided two routes for the circuits and we survived the Hinsdale Central Office fire which interupted one of the two main paths between the data ctr and our HQ. I have experienced many Telephone Company CO outages that "Can't Happen" The Lombard CO had a flood and on another occasion lost all its power due to a battery bus fault. Many cable cuts. Diversity is as the Mastercard ad states "Priceless" I know they design the centers to be hardened facilities but sometimes it not wise to put all your eggs in one basket.
BaltACD
In the past - when weather threatened management solicited volunteers to go to Indianapolis where a 'on line' back up system was kept. When the Jacksonville Office was decentralized, it was my understanding that each of the decentralized offices had sufficient computer power and communications abilities to run the entire system if it became necessary.
The CSX business computer systems are in a hardened facility in Jacksonville that is separtate from the Dispatch Center. At one time these systems were backed up by additional hardware and communcations in Baltimore - I don't know if this is still the case.
No matter how much power and back up CSX has the weak links end up being the local power companies as well as communications companies for the territory the company operates through. When the code command that a dispatcher originates cannot make it to the switch or signal that the dispatcher wants operated - it is a failure. Repair of electrical and communications facilities that are owned by others is in the hands of the owners.
The last time Jacksonville got a direct hit from a Hurricane was with Dora in 1964.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hurricane_Dora
BaltACD ... Weather Emergencies do shut down the A line, S line, PD&PA as will as the NO&M in the anticipated 'strike area' as the signal department employees have been instructed to remove crossing gates to prevent them from becoming part of the flying debris that happens in areas with hurricane force winds as well as other storm preparations. ...
...
Do they shut down the RR before they remove the gates, and re-install them before re-start?
BALT======== realize Jacksonville is hardened to withstand almost anything. However the weak link is dispatcher personell. What happens when relief / next trick dispatchers are prevented from going to work ? HOS will soon cause dispatchers on duty to go dead on the law ? l
MidlandMike BaltACD ... Weather Emergencies do shut down the A line, S line, PD&PA as will as the NO&M in the anticipated 'strike area' as the signal department employees have been instructed to remove crossing gates to prevent them from becoming part of the flying debris that happens in areas with hurricane force winds as well as other storm preparations. ... Do they shut down the RR before they remove the gates, and re-install them before re-start?
Johnny
Deggesty MidlandMike BaltACD... Weather Emergencies do shut down the A line, S line, PD&PA as will as the NO&M in the anticipated 'strike area' as the signal department employees have been instructed to remove crossing gates to prevent them from becoming part of the flying debris that happens in areas with hurricane force winds as well as other storm preparations. ... Do they shut down the RR before they remove the gates, and re-install them before re-start? I know the A, S, and NO&M lines; what is the PD&PA line?
MidlandMike BaltACD... Weather Emergencies do shut down the A line, S line, PD&PA as will as the NO&M in the anticipated 'strike area' as the signal department employees have been instructed to remove crossing gates to prevent them from becoming part of the flying debris that happens in areas with hurricane force winds as well as other storm preparations. ... Do they shut down the RR before they remove the gates, and re-install them before re-start?
BaltACD... Weather Emergencies do shut down the A line, S line, PD&PA as will as the NO&M in the anticipated 'strike area' as the signal department employees have been instructed to remove crossing gates to prevent them from becoming part of the flying debris that happens in areas with hurricane force winds as well as other storm preparations. ...
I know the A, S, and NO&M lines; what is the PD&PA line?
PD & PA is the line from Jacksonville, through Pensacola to Flomaton, AL where it connects to the line from Montgomery to Mobile.
The shut down is coordinated so that the only trains running when crossing protection has been disabled are Work Trains that will have appropriate 'stop & flag' orders when operating to ready the lines for normal operations.
blue streak 1 BALT======== realize Jacksonville is hardened to withstand almost anything. However the weak link is dispatcher personell. What happens when relief / next trick dispatchers are prevented from going to work ? HOS will soon cause dispatchers on duty to go dead on the law ? l
They put up the dispatchers in hotels close to the center. Believe it or not, the railroads do pay attention to the weather and make plans accordingly.
An "expensive model collector"
BNSF and UP have pretty much proven for many, many years now that a centralized dispatching office does not pose any significant drawbacks as far as operations. Now Omaha and Fort Worth aren't in a low-lying area in a hurricane zone, but I'd figure CSX Jacksonville has planned for that.
Granted, one would also have assumed that the Fukushima Nuke plant was hardend against tsunamis, but they left the backup generators just above sea level, so...
Wonder how big of a severance check he got , as big as EHH??
Y6bs evergreen in my mind
BaltACDNo matter how much power and back up CSX has the weak links end up being the local power companies as well as communications companies for the territory the company operates through. When the code command that a dispatcher originates cannot make it to the switch or signal that the dispatcher wants operated - it is a failure. Repair of electrical and communications facilities that are owned by others is in the hands of the owners.
Perhaps @BaltACD or someone else has some insight into the comm backup. As I understand it CSX is converting most terrestrial radio comm to satellite, so presumably they have multiple satellite access paths in case one fails, gets hit by space junk, etc.
This former reliability engineer recognizes that 'TWO' of everything (if possible) is goodness; sometimes even more redundancy is required.
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MikeF90his former reliability engineer recognizes that 'TWO' of everything (if possible) is goodness; sometimes even more redundancy is required.
Unfortunately, redundancy costs money - adding a redundant T1 line is going to cost the same $1500 a month (or whatever they're going for these days) as the original.
I would suppose that any user that doesn't require a specific path will rely on the 'Net to provide their redundancy. A tracert from a given computer to a given distant computer may well show different paths on different day, or even on different attempts.
OTOH, a "hot standby" path (ie, another satellite that can be accessed on a moment's notice) might work - but all the remote sites would have to be re-tuned and re-aimed to the new satellite for that to work. Might better go to TT&TO in the interim....
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
tree68 MikeF90 Unfortunately, redundancy costs money - adding a redundant T1 line is going to cost the same $1500 a month (or whatever they're going for these days) as the original. I would suppose that any user that doesn't require a specific path will rely on the 'Net to provide their redundancy. A tracert from a given computer to a given distant computer may well show different paths on different day, or even on different attempts. OTOH, a "hot standby" path (ie, another satellite that can be accessed on a moment's notice) might work - but all the remote sites would have to be re-tuned and re-aimed to the new satellite for that to work. Might better go to TT&TO in the interim....
MikeF90
My understanding is that CSX has had multiple T1 lines linking all the nodes of their network together since Day 1 of CADS in its original iteration. $1500 a month is chump change in comparison with System down time.
In my 27 year association with CADS, the system has only been down one time. That was on account of a computer virus or some other type malady that busied up the communications lines between the CSX Main Frame and the linked CADS computers to the point that the CADS computers would crash. The CADS computers crashed repeatedly for about 12 hours until it was understood what the cause of the crashes were.
During this 12 hour period train traffic was shut down as the CADS system did not have sufficient stability to permit Dispatcher's to knowledgeably line signals or issue Direct Train Control authorities for trains in dark territory. In observing the Safe Course, the railroad was stopped until the CADS system could stay up reliabily. After 12 hours the Comm Lines to the CADS system were shut down and the CADS system restored the ability to line signals and issue authorities.
However, being cut off from the Main Frame Computers meant that information such as Crew Names, Train ID, Engine Numbers, train loading specifics and all the other data that normally passed between the CADS system and the Main Frame system was not being passed - in either direction. Train Messages created in CADS for each train had to be printed out on local CADS printers and then 'hand faxed' to the proper crew room. Upon receipt of the Train Messages crews were then required to call the Jax Dispatch Center and read back the Train Messages to verify their complete receipt - this action is required by CSX Rules for all 'hand faxed' Train Messages. (Messages sent via the Main Frame Computer's 'CSX Technofax" with tha printed on the orders do not need to be repeated.) Extra Dispatching personnel was brought into the Center to facilitate the confirming of Train Messages.
Once the Main Frame guru's identified their problems and devised a solution, which took about 36 hours things began to return to normal.
My understanding, which may be faulty, was that some employee in CSX Technology introduced the bug in the system - it is unknown to me if this was done on purpose or by accident.
A TT &TO form of operation is not authorized by current operating rules. Very few current Dispatchers have any working knowledge of a TT & TO operation and next to no T&E personnel have ever operated under TT & TO operation. The one reality of computerized operations, once they are in place and working, there is not sufficient manpower available to operate a former method of operations if the computer fails. See how well the Airlines do when they have computer failures.
The Jacksonville Dispatching Center has not been shut down by weather in my 27 year association with it. My first day at the Center was June 12, 1990. The first day of moving the Baltimore Division Dispatchers to Baltimore was June 15, 2008.
chicagorailssecure from EMP attack? prob not!
Is anything?
Vacuum Tubes...virtually impervious.
MiningmanVacuum Tubes...virtually impervious.
Virtually nonexistant.
BaltACDA TT &TO form of operation is not authorized by current operating rules. Very few current Dispatchers have any working knowledge of a TT & TO operation and next to no T&E personnel have ever operated under TT & TO operation. The one reality of computerized operations, once they are in place and working, there is not sufficient manpower available to operate a former method of operations if the computer fails. See how well the Airlines do when they have computer failures.
I was mostly being facetious - in reality, it would be reams of EC-1's...
tree68 BaltACD I was mostly being facetious - in reality, it would be reams of EC-1's...
EC-1's require the computer for protection, otherwise your safety is entrusted to the Train Dispatcher's memory..
BaltACDEC-1's require the computer for protection, otherwise your safety is entrusted to the Train Dispatcher's memory..
And a roll of butcher's paper for a makeshift trainsheet...
tree68 BaltACD And a roll of butcher's paper for a makeshift trainsheet...
Tough to find a butcher, even harder to find one that uses paper and not plastic film.
blue streak 1But the one to worry about is the ones mother nature can send from the sun. (CME)
Bingo! Many communication satellites could be put out of action.
tree68And a roll of butcher's paper for a makeshift trainsheet...
If the outage was bad enough, I was thinking that a lot more of a different paper roll would be required.
We're fortunate that SpaceX and others may be reasonably priced enough to make a 'hot standby' launcher and satellite constellation possible.
I know that some vacuum tubes are still made in Germany and Russia. Anyone know if nuvistors are still available?
BaltACDTough to find a butcher, even harder to find one that uses paper and not plastic film.
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