Jock Ellis Cumming, GA US of A Georgia Association of Railroad Passengers
-Don (Random stuff, mostly about trains - what else? http://blerfblog.blogspot.com/)
QUOTE: Originally posted by DaveBr About 1 month ago the Mayor of Glendale,California came back with a 14 million dollar grant for the Transportation here in Glendale.<snip> He wants to put the so-called street cars back here between Glendale and Burbank. He doesn't want anything to do with putting an Amtrak ticket agency back at the million dollar refurbished station. A lot of customers and no where to find information or tickets
QUOTE: Originally posted by jockellis In a post about a spur being kept on the Seminole Gulf RR, someone mentioned stupid politicians. What a wonderful idea for a post. What idiotic things have the movers and shakers in your community done? Here in Atlanta, Ga, the Atlanta Regional Commission just passed the 25-year transportation plan which included almost nothing but concrete and asphalt. What public transportation was included seems to be buses. Even while the Georgia DOT is planning a, I think, 29-mile commuter rail line going from south of Atlanta and hooking up with MARTA on the south side, the M&Ss could not even come up with money to extend our 30-year old rail system because the two counties which voted to finance it are tired of pulling the entire load and have voted to half their present axation rate of one percent. So Atlanta can look forward to years and years of traffic jams because of this short sightedness. People take the trains here and they are packed during drive times. But politicians can only seem to listen to complaints from loudmouths rather than realize that most people have been satisfied by MARTA's performance. I must admit that I believe service is falling because of deferred maintenance which the system cannot afford. Jock Ellis
QUOTE: Originally posted by oltmannd Jock- Did you see the plan for 26 miles of HOV lanes on I-75 that includes "bus rapid transit"? The price tag on that is $1B+ and it will take nearly a decade of very disruptive construction to complete. For $360M you can get the Atlanta to Athens commuter rail line in two years time that will produce the equivalent of $750M of highway construction. The whole network of commuter rail in ATL would only cost $2B and only take a few years to build out. "Bus rapid transit" for the unitiated is the current darling of rubber tire/concrete crowd. At its best, its a bus pulling bus trailer(s) on a dedicated ROW with high level platforms. But, in this configuration, is costs as much as light rail but is noisier and less comfortable. At it's worst, it's just a bus in an HOV lane. There is an attitude in Georgia that somehow Atlanta is different from other large American cities. I don't know if it's left over stubborn rebel pride or what, but while smaller cities such as Denver and Dallas are making strides in the right direction, Atlanta fiddles while traffic congeals. I agree that MARTA rail is actually pretty decent - although MARTA administration is a bit of a mess.....
QUOTE: Originally posted by JOdom Ahh, Atlanta, that festering sore on the face of Georgia. Too bad it's not between the seacoast and a major fault line, so there would at least be hope that it would slide off the continent. They should rename the place "Road Contractor Heaven". I avoid the place like the plague, but when I went there regularly years ago I believe every single trip involved crawling past road construction somewhere on the Interstate. There must be retired construction employees who spent their whole working lives working on road projects in the area.
QUOTE: Originally posted by espeefoamer Shortly after the recent UP derailment in Pico Rivera,CA, a local councilwoman was pushing to have all freight traffic banned on that line[:(!]!
QUOTE: Originally posted by piouslion QUOTE: Originally posted by jockellis In a post about a spur being kept on the Seminole Gulf RR, someone mentioned stupid politicians. What a wonderful idea for a post. What idiotic things have the movers and shakers in your community done? Here in Atlanta, Ga, the Atlanta Regional Commission just passed the 25-year transportation plan which included almost nothing but concrete and asphalt. What public transportation was included seems to be buses. Even while the Georgia DOT is planning a, I think, 29-mile commuter rail line going from south of Atlanta and hooking up with MARTA on the south side, the M&Ss could not even come up with money to extend our 30-year old rail system because the two counties which voted to finance it are tired of pulling the entire load and have voted to half their present axation rate of one percent. So Atlanta can look forward to years and years of traffic jams because of this short sightedness. People take the trains here and they are packed during drive times. But politicians can only seem to listen to complaints from loudmouths rather than realize that most people have been satisfied by MARTA's performance. I must admit that I believe service is falling because of deferred maintenance which the system cannot afford. Jock Ellis It is a very sad day when there is no vision in the city. I married an Atlanta girl (Va Highlands) and lived there prior to my job assignment here in the piedmont of NC. There has never been a city that had such opportunity to do the right thing in transportation only to loose sight of its uses and purposes in the name of political expediency as has Atlanta. There are many theories about this, but often even that gets lost in the isolation and proventialism of to many cooks in the kitchen
QUOTE: Originally posted by espeefoamer Shortly after the recent UP derailment in Pico Rivera,CA, a local councilwoman was pushing to have all freight traffic banned on that line!
QUOTE: Originally posted by oltmannd Hey! It's not THAT bad...and the rest of GA ain't that great. I can say, that inside the perimeter, where there are HOV lanes and parallel MARTA service, traffic is not bad. On the perimeter itself and outside on the radial spokes is where the real traffic troubles are, particularly on I-85 and I-75 north of the city. (and these roads are already 6 lanes in each direction!)
QUOTE: Originally posted by oltmannd QUOTE: Originally posted by piouslion Originally posted by jockellis It doesn't help when the cooks are blind and none appear to have any leadership potential - or even view leadership and vision as desirable. It starts with the governor and flows downhill from there - very sad. Over the past 10 years, they have studied commuter rail to death - literally. Despite fairly good economics, they have not pulled the trigger on even a single route. Now, it appears that it has exceeded their span of attention and we're on to "bus rapid transit" as the savior de jour. It doesn't matter that it's never been tried on the scale being planned for Atlanta anywhere else in the world. It's NEW, and that's all that matters, apparently. I suspect they will study this to death as well, and when it seems "old" or the economics turn up worse than commuter rail, or it totally fails elsewhere, they'll find a new savior (how about monorail or people movers? They should seem like "new ideas" again in about 10 years). Meanwhile, Rome continues to burn. When Charlotte eclipses Atlanta as the center of the "new south" in about 10 years, they'll all wonder what happened. For us here that live not to far from Charlotte, this will be no surprise, NC has what are called Urban Friendly laws for development purposes along with the idea that when money talks and can be made it is worth it to go forward for the betterment of the community as a whole. As I said earlier, Atlanta had great opportunity for transportation infrastructure expansion only to blow it with competing counties and cities that could not get their minds outside of their own fiefs, JOdom voices much of how the city of Atlanta is viewed the citizens of the peach state outside the Metro Atlanta area. Many that were a part of the late great city are moving to North Carolina cities like Charlotte, The Reserch Triangle, The Triad, and other up and comming cities in Georgia (Macon) Tenn.(Chattanoga) and Alabama (Birmingham). they bring with them thier positive attitudes, can do spirit and their money. In short, never have so many places benefited from the stupidity of so few that are less than adiquate excuses for persons of leadership[2c] In short to be a little Upton Sinclarish "Cry the beloved city. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, December 3, 2004 4:55 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by futuremodal Out here in North Central Idaho, the state's politicians allowed BN to abandon a key rail link between the wheat growing lands of the Palouse and the barge ports on the Snake River. The State of Idaho did a study and found out it would cost $2.5 million to fix the line for renewed use, and they decided that $2.5 million was just too expensive. Now five years later the State has spent over $5 million on that same right of way to turn portions of it into a paved rail trail, used mostly by the local coyotes but occasionally by a human being now and then. If they decide to pave the entire right of way, it will end up costing over $25 million, ten times the cost of rehabbing the line for renewed rail service back in 1998! Stupid, stupid, stupid! Futuremodal: Why is it that I'm not surprised by this? The current powers-that-be here seem congenitally incapable of any sort of foresight on any issue. These are the people who manage to come up with plenty of money to renovate the Statehouse, while the school houses in North Central Idaho (and elswhere in the state) are falling down on our kids' heads. But at least from the rest of the replies I can see that Idaho doesn't have a monopoly on imbeciles in positions of power. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, December 3, 2004 4:58 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by futuremodal Out here in North Central Idaho, the state's politicians allowed BN to abandon a key rail link between the wheat growing lands of the Palouse and the barge ports on the Snake River. The State of Idaho did a study and found out it would cost $2.5 million to fix the line for renewed use, and they decided that $2.5 million was just too expensive. Now five years later the State has spent over $5 million on that same right of way to turn portions of it into a paved rail trail, used mostly by the local coyotes but occasionally by a human being now and then. If they decide to pave the entire right of way, it will end up costing over $25 million, ten times the cost of rehabbing the line for renewed rail service back in 1998! Stupid, stupid, stupid! Futuremodal: Why is it that I'm not surprised by this? The current powers-that-be here seem congenitally incapable of any sort of foresight on any issue. These are the people who manage to come up with plenty of money to renovate the Statehouse, while the school houses in North Central Idaho (and elswhere in the state) are falling down on our kids' heads. But at least from the rest of the replies I can see that Idaho doesn't have a monopoly on imbeciles in positions of power. Whoops, I must have hit it twice -- I'm not really in love with my own words.[:I] Reply Edit jockellis Member sinceMay 2002 From: Just outside Atlanta 422 posts Posted by jockellis on Monday, December 6, 2004 12:15 PM Thanks for all the great replies. But Atlanta has never had long-sightedness in its planning. William Hartsfield, Atlanta's mayor for 24 yers, was my grandmother's first cousin, but it is embarrassing to know that a family member ran the trolleys and interurbans out of Atlanta. He thought airplanes and cars were newer inventions . Unfortunately, sometimes the best idea is the first one. Jock Ellis Jock Ellis Cumming, GA US of A Georgia Association of Railroad Passengers Reply Join our Community! Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account. Login » Register » Search the Community Newsletter Sign-Up By signing up you may also receive occasional reader surveys and special offers from Trains magazine.Please view our privacy policy More great sites from Kalmbach Media Terms Of Use | Privacy Policy | Copyright Policy
QUOTE: Originally posted by piouslion Originally posted by jockellis It doesn't help when the cooks are blind and none appear to have any leadership potential - or even view leadership and vision as desirable. It starts with the governor and flows downhill from there - very sad. Over the past 10 years, they have studied commuter rail to death - literally. Despite fairly good economics, they have not pulled the trigger on even a single route. Now, it appears that it has exceeded their span of attention and we're on to "bus rapid transit" as the savior de jour. It doesn't matter that it's never been tried on the scale being planned for Atlanta anywhere else in the world. It's NEW, and that's all that matters, apparently. I suspect they will study this to death as well, and when it seems "old" or the economics turn up worse than commuter rail, or it totally fails elsewhere, they'll find a new savior (how about monorail or people movers? They should seem like "new ideas" again in about 10 years). Meanwhile, Rome continues to burn. When Charlotte eclipses Atlanta as the center of the "new south" in about 10 years, they'll all wonder what happened.
Originally posted by jockellis
QUOTE: Originally posted by futuremodal Out here in North Central Idaho, the state's politicians allowed BN to abandon a key rail link between the wheat growing lands of the Palouse and the barge ports on the Snake River. The State of Idaho did a study and found out it would cost $2.5 million to fix the line for renewed use, and they decided that $2.5 million was just too expensive. Now five years later the State has spent over $5 million on that same right of way to turn portions of it into a paved rail trail, used mostly by the local coyotes but occasionally by a human being now and then. If they decide to pave the entire right of way, it will end up costing over $25 million, ten times the cost of rehabbing the line for renewed rail service back in 1998! Stupid, stupid, stupid!
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