Red Flags Posted

[power58]

Saw Square metal Red Flags Posted on the West Bound Carbon Hill Road. Crossing on the Chillicothe Sub. Coal City Il. Today. I have heard Flags posted by dispatchers on the scanner but they never explained what the flags are for. Are they for Mint. Of Way work ? 

[jeffhergert]

MOW Form B (GCOR, which BNSF uses) protection. 

Approaching trains and engines must stop at the red flag unless authorized to proceed by the employee in charge.  Usually the EIC is the foreman holding the Form B, but could be someone else in his/her place. 

Jeff

[NP Eddie]

The flags (usually metal) are physically placed by maintenance of way foremen, usually section foremen or flagmen to mark the location of speed restrictions or impassable track. The foreman will contact the train dispatcher to place a "form B" (old slow order) on a specific piece of track, listing mile posts to and from and the speed restriction involved. A red flag placed between the rails indicate that the track is out of service beyond that point. 

Another example is the red/yellow flag for work locations.

Please "google" the "General Code of Operating Rules", Chapter 5 for more specific examples

Ed Burns

Happily retired NP-BN-BNSF from Minneapolis.

[CSX7527]

The first answer is correct, the second by Ed confuses me.

 

Basically, the easy way to remember, is this:

 

Form B, as in Boy, is men or equipment on the track and a red flag marks the limits of maintenance of way's territory.  A yellow/red flag appears 2 miles before a red flag.  No speed restrictions are part of a Form B.  However, the foreman in charge of a Form B can give you speed restrictions when he gives you permission to pass thru the limits of his Form B.

 

Form D is slow orders.  A yellow flag appears 2 miles prior to the slow order and a green flag marks the end of it.

[power58]

Thanks for all replies, clears up a lot for a new RailFan

[jeffhergert]

CSX7527

The first answer is correct, the second by Ed confuses me.

 

Basically, the easy way to remember, is this:

 

Form B, as in Boy, is men or equipment on the track and a red flag marks the limits of maintenance of way's territory.  A yellow/red flag appears 2 miles before a red flag.  No speed restrictions are part of a Form B.  However, the foreman in charge of a Form B can give you speed restrictions when he gives you permission to pass thru the limits of his Form B.

 

Form D is slow orders.  A yellow flag appears 2 miles prior to the slow order and a green flag marks the end of it.

 

In GCOR, a Form A is a structured form (has columns for line number, beginning/ending mile posts, if flags are not displayed or are displayed less than 2 miles) for temporary speed restrictions.  Has already discussed, Form B protects men and equipment.  Form C is for temporary conditions, like tracks out of service, signal suspensions, etc.

Some GCOR railroads do use a Form D for their temporary speed restrictions.  It doesn't have the columns and look a lot more like the old train order form X speed restriction orders.

Jeff

[CSX7527]

On my property, CP here in the States, as of 10 years ago at least, we never used or saw Form A's or Form C's. At least not that I ever remember. You may be correct about current usage. If the dispatcher needed to inform a train en route about a highway crossing malfunction or a speed restriction, there were specialized pre-formed blank pages within your train orders to copy them over the radio.

[BaltACD]

MofW 'boards' waiting for use

[tree68]

We get everything either on a Bulletin Order (longer term stuff), or on the NORAC Form D (short notice or short term).

Line 1 has temporary speed restrictions.  Line 4 is for track out of service.  Line 13 will have any specific instructions.

[jeffhergert]

Here's a link to GCOR Form A and B track bulletins.  As it says, they are the suggested format.  (We never used the between stations column on either form.)  The computer generated bulletins we get, actually we now just get a summary of the bulletins, have the headings and columns, but not the dividing lines/boxes.  It's also a link to an older edition of GCOR, on the Form B there is no longer a stop column.  Stop was written into the column when red boards were displayed.  It used to be that a red board wasn't required to be displayed for the B restriction.  Now they are always required.

         http://www.trainweb.com/gcor/bulletin.html#15.0

The Form C and Form D (This GCOR Form D shouldn't be confused with the NORAC Form D.  They aren't the same thing.) are blank, no structured format.  Information is written in as the dispatcher wishes.  The IAIS uses Form D instead of Form A for their slow orders.  The way they write them, looks almost exactly like the old train order (Form X from time table and train order days) slows the Rock Island used. 

Jeff