A few years ago I inquired about a branch line that ran from Flora Il. north towards Iola etc. I received a reply but have misplaced it somewhere, could anyone tell me where the line terminated? Thanks
According to SPV's Great Lakes West Atlas, this line ran from Flora through Iola and on to Tower Hill, which is just east of Pana, then through Pana to Taylorville, and on to Springfield. This was a former B&O line, which was then operated by Prairie Trunk Railway, and has been abandoned. The B&O also operated from Springfield to Beardstown, and this has been abandoned, just as the B&O's line to Springfield from Boody (junction with the Wabash, which the B&O used to get from Decatur on its route to Springfield) was abandoned by the B&O. The line from Flora may have originally been to Beardstown. Balt, do you have any information on this?
Johnny
The branch ran from Shawneetown, IL to Beardstown, IL intersecting with the Cincinnati-St.Louis Main at Flora. The primary business on the branch was each small towns grain elevators. When I hired out on the B&O in 1965 the Agents along this route were still transmitting their car orders and grain door situations to the division headquarters via telegraph, even though Bell Telephone service was available.
I recall that 'extra' train & enginemen for the assignments out of Springfield would deadhead on a passenger train from Washington, IN to St. Louis and then catch at GM&O passenger train to Sprinfield to be in place for the assignment for the full week and then return home via the reverse route. They got paid a DH day for each leg of the trip.
Springfield was also served by the B&O line that ran West from Indianpolis. That line was not part of the B&O's St.Louis Division, which the Shawneetown/Beardstown line was. There was a very small interchange volume with the CB&Q at Beardstown.
I left the division in 1967 and did not follow it's decline into abandonment. The reality was that it was only truly active during the harvest season and as such, without unit train sized shippers, was a very high cost operation with minimal economic return.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
Thanks, Balt. I looked in the atlas again, and the line from Shawneetown was operated by Prairie Trunk until it was abandoned. So, nothing is left of that line which did serve grain growers.
Pana Springfield & Northwestern RR (1865-1870)
Springfield & Illinois Southeastern RR (1870-1899)
B&O after 1899 under multiple sub-corporations.
(It would take some serious digging to find when the line was actually built between 1869 and 1871 by the Illinois & SouthEastern forces also in the same family tree.)
-from the ICC Valuation Dockets (GO-20 and GO-26) and http://cs.trains.com/trn/f/111/t/178033.aspx
Thanks to all for info.
Thanks for the info. My Grandfather worked out of Flora in train service and retired in the early 60,s. I remember he worked what they called the puddle jumper which ran on the branch and when I was little I got to ride the engine which was still steam from the Flora depot to the roundhouse west of town. I retired in 2007 from the BNSF as conductor working both freight and dinkies. Thanks again for info, only have an aunt and cousin still living in Flora and they couldn't recall the tracks either.
I grew up 25 miles east of Flora and a few miles north on the IC branchline running between Mattoon and Evansville. Olney was the closest town of size. Balt ... thanks for the info on that line. Amazing about the telegraph communication in the 60's. Also that was quite a trip for the crews deadheading to Springfield. My family took the B&O 3 times from Olney to St. Louis during the mid 60s twice we connected for a trip on to Colorado (Missouri Pacific once and NW/UP in 1966).
The B&O line to St. Louis seems to have barely hung on during the past 3 decades and my guess is it will survive as anything with rails will remain in service for a long time.
ed
MP173 I grew up 25 miles east of Flora and a few miles north on the IC branchline running between Mattoon and Evansville. Olney was the closest town of size. Balt ... thanks for the info on that line. Amazing about the telegraph communication in the 60's. Also that was quite a trip for the crews deadheading to Springfield. My family took the B&O 3 times from Olney to St. Louis during the mid 60s twice we connected for a trip on to Colorado (Missouri Pacific once and NW/UP in 1966). The B&O line to St. Louis seems to have barely hung on during the past 3 decades and my guess is it will survive as anything with rails will remain in service for a long time. ed
In the days of railroad owned and operated passenger service, nearly all deadheading of crews was done on passenger trains.
Worked Olney Agent/Operator position off the Extra Board for a week one time.
Here are two of your previous Flora IL threads from 2010:
http://cs.trains.com/trn/f/111/t/170862.aspx
http://cs.trains.com/trn/f/111/t/170199.aspx
The Springfield & Illinois Southeastern Railroad was finished through southeastern Illinois in by September 30, 1871. I've found a freight receipt from the Norris City depot signed by the first station master.
It was built when Thomas Ridgway was the Director, later owned by Ohio & Mississippi, then B & O, CSX, Prairie Trunk.
The last 5.3 miles from Junction to Shawneetown were shared with the L & N. B & O did the maintenance and L & N paid half the cost. The tracks diverged for the last 7/10s of a mile into Old Shawneetown where each railroad had a depot.
The 1937 flood motivated the L & N to move their building to New Shawneetown. It is a residence today.
No date has been found for when the B & O depot was removed by flood or human intervention. A maintenance building was constructed at New Shawneetown after 1938. It is still standing.
L & N
The grade from Equality to Shawneetown had been finished back in 1840.
The Louisville and Nashville line from East St. Louis to Shawneetown was constructed by the St. Louis and Southeastern Railroad. Various mergers occurred with the Louisville and Nashville railroad being the final owner of that line. American Coal Company owns the right of way in Hamilton County for the right of way.
Remembering southern Illinois Railroads
I remember as a youngster looking at a B&O map in the Official Guide and being intrigued by Flora, IL. It seemed to be a major place on the then exotic B&O. It was on the main line to St. Louis and everything, with lots of branches. Heck, the National Limited even went through Flora.
I grew up in a small central Illinois town and have been to Flora only once in my life. I remember a small downtown with a corner store that had a prominent clock on the corner. The clock had permanent advertising that the store "Inspected and Repaired B&O Watches." I was quite taken by that.
Branches to Shawneetown and Beardstown! The first (any maybe only) B&O train I ever saw was arriving Springfield behind a GP-30.
It's all gone or going now. Including Flora.
greyhoundsI remember as a youngster looking at a B&O map in the Official Guide and being intrigued by Flora, IL. It seemed to be a major place on the then exotic B&O. It was on the main line to St. Louis and everything, with lots of branches. Heck, the National Limited even went through Flora. I grew up in a small central Illinois town and have been to Flora only once in my life. I remember a small downtown with a corner store that had a prominent clock on the corner. The clock had permanent advertising that the store "Inspected and Repaired B&O Watches." I was quite taken by that. Branches to Shawneetown and Beardstown! The first (any maybe only) B&O train I ever saw was arriving Springfield behind a GP-30. It's all gone or going now. Including Flora.
The Shawaneetown - Beardstown branch is gone, but Flora continues to exist, however the Main Line between Noble and Caseyville has been deactivated; if a signifigant business opportunity would get created between these points it could be reactivated at any time. RIP The National Limited.
greyhoundsIt's all gone or going now. Including Flora.
Found Flora on a satellite image. Still very much there and appears to be doing reasonably well. The station at the diamond (now gone) is still there. Cargill and Silgan Plastics appear to be railroad customers.
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
tree68 greyhounds It's all gone or going now. Including Flora. Found Flora on a satellite image. Still very much there and appears to be doing reasonably well. The station at the diamond (now gone) is still there. Cargill and Silgan Plastics appear to be railroad customers.
greyhounds It's all gone or going now. Including Flora.
Flora has picked up a US-50 bypass routing since I used to have to stop at Flora on my way to work the night agent/operators at Salem, IL. The Salem position existed to check the M&I interchange at Midnight to verify if a delivery was made or not (the days of daily per diem, instead of hourly that we have today), and to handle US Mail to the Metropolitan Special (Trains 11 & 12). #12 arrived shortly after Midnight and #11 arrived about 0600 - the job worked 2230-0630.
The two most unusual lines into far southern Illinois, were the B&O line to Shawneetown, and the NYC line to Cairo. I suppose in the 19th century it was the feeling that both towns would become decent sized cities.
Having railfanned the region from 1960 onward, I can say I never saw a train on either of these lines. There were always cars sitting in sidings, but never an actual moving train. I think they must have had a train a week or something. My father always told me there was more action further north on both of these lines, but he was never inclined to drive far enough to seek it out.
BLS53 The two most unusual lines into far southern Illinois, were the B&O line to Shawneetown, and the NYC line to Cairo. I suppose in the 19th century it was the feeling that both towns would become decent sized cities. Having railfanned the region from 1960 onward, I can say I never saw a train on either of these lines. There were always cars sitting in sidings, but never an actual moving train. I think they must have had a train a week or something. My father always told me there was more action further north on both of these lines, but he was never inclined to drive far enough to seek it out.
I remember touring a great B&O museum in Flora with local railfan group. I think I went thru there years ago with parents on way to Wash DC, but know nothing else about it.
JEFFREY PLETCHER BLS53 The two most unusual lines into far southern Illinois, were the B&O line to Shawneetown, and the NYC line to Cairo. I suppose in the 19th century it was the feeling that both towns would become decent sized cities. Having railfanned the region from 1960 onward, I can say I never saw a train on either of these lines. There were always cars sitting in sidings, but never an actual moving train. I think they must have had a train a week or something. My father always told me there was more action further north on both of these lines, but he was never inclined to drive far enough to seek it out. BLS53 The two most unusual lines into far southern Illinois, were the B&O line to Shawneetown, and the NYC line to Cairo. I suppose in the 19th century it was the feeling that both towns would become decent sized cities. Having railfanned the region from 1960 onward, I can say I never saw a train on either of these lines. There were always cars sitting in sidings, but never an actual moving train. I think they must have had a train a week or something. My father always told me there was more action further north on both of these lines, but he was never inclined to drive far enough to seek it out. BLS53 The two most unusual lines into far southern Illinois, were the B&O line to Shawneetown, and the NYC line to Cairo. I suppose in the 19th century it was the feeling that both towns would become decent sized cities. Having railfanned the region from 1960 onward, I can say I never saw a train on either of these lines. There were always cars sitting in sidings, but never an actual moving train. I think they must have had a train a week or something. My father always told me there was more action further north on both of these lines, but he was never inclined to drive far enough to seek it out. I lived in southeastern Illinois from 1969-1972 and can verify activity on the NYC line to Cairo, at least as far south as Lawrenceville and Mount Carmel. I assumed that the rationale for the line was Southern IL coal. I will have to go back and look at my photos to see if coal traffic was indeed present at that date.
I lived in southeastern Illinois from 1969-1972 and can verify activity on the NYC line to Cairo, at least as far south as Lawrenceville and Mount Carmel. I assumed that the rationale for the line was Southern IL coal. I will have to go back and look at my photos to see if coal traffic was indeed present at that date.
Lawrenceville and Mt. Carmel are considered further north from my perspective. Harrisburg seemed to be the southern limit of any reasonable amount of action on the NYC. A Chicago-Harrisburg passenger train, "The Egyptian", ran until the late 1950's.
The coal mines existed 30-60 miles north of Cairo and Shawneetown, so there had to be other reasons to extend these lines to these towns. My guess is perceived growth of business activity. An interesting point is that no railroad bridge across the Ohio was constructed at Shawneetown. It leads me to believe that the B&O had already conceded the uselessness of the line in the late 19th-early 20th century, when the bridge building frenzy took place in the region.
I know trains ran to the southern terminus of these lines, because there was always rolling stock sitting around at various points along the lines. I just never saw a train. My guess is an elusive weekly local, with a schedule unbekownst to me.
BLS53 The two most unusual lines into far southern Illinois, were the B&O line to Shawneetown, and the NYC line to Cairo. I suppose in the 19th century it was the feeling that both towns would become decent sized cities. Having railfanned the region from 1960 onward, I can say I never saw a train on either of these lines. There were always cars sitting in sidings, but never an actual moving train. I think they must have had a train a week or something. My father always told me there was more action further north on both of these lines, but he was never inclined to drive far enough to seek it out. I lived in southeastern Illinois from 1969-1972 and can verify activity on the NYC line to Cairo, at least as far south as Lawrenceville and Mount Carmel. I assumed that the rationale for the line was Southern IL coal. I will have to go back and look at my photos to see if coal traffic was indeed present at that date. Lawrenceville and Mt. Carmel are considered further north from my perspective. Harrisburg seemed to be the southern limit of any reasonable amount of action on the NYC. A Chicago-Harrisburg passenger train, "The Egyptian", ran until the late 1950's. The coal mines existed 30-60 miles north of Cairo and Shawneetown, so there had to be other reasons to extend these lines to these towns. My guess is perceived growth of business activity. An interesting point is that no railroad bridge across the Ohio was constructed at Shawneetown. It leads me to believe that the B&O had already conceded the uselessness of the line in the late 19th-early 20th century, when the bridge building frenzy took place in the region. I know trains ran to the southern terminus of these lines, because there was always rolling stock sitting around at various points along the lines. I just never saw a train. My guess is an elusive weekly local, with a schedule unbekownst to me.
The two most unusual lines into far southern Illinois, were the B&O line to Shawneetown, and the NYC line to Cairo. I suppose in the 19th century it was the feeling that both towns would become decent sized cities. Having railfanned the region from 1960 onward, I can say I never saw a train on either of these lines. There were always cars sitting in sidings, but never an actual moving train. I think they must have had a train a week or something. My father always told me there was more action further north on both of these lines, but he was never inclined to drive far enough to seek it out. I lived in southeastern Illinois from 1969-1972 and can verify activity on the NYC line to Cairo, at least as far south as Lawrenceville and Mount Carmel. I assumed that the rationale for the line was Southern IL coal. I will have to go back and look at my photos to see if coal traffic was indeed present at that date.
The two most unusual lines into far southern Illinois, were the B&O line to Shawneetown, and the NYC line to Cairo. I suppose in the 19th century it was the feeling that both towns would become decent sized cities. Having railfanned the region from 1960 onward, I can say I never saw a train on either of these lines. There were always cars sitting in sidings, but never an actual moving train. I think they must have had a train a week or something. My father always told me there was more action further north on both of these lines, but he was never inclined to drive far enough to seek it out.
Worked the B&O operator position at Lawrenceville a number of times off the extra board in 1966-67, the NYC traffic across the diamond was normally empties South and Egypt Valley coal North. Generally a couple of trains a day.
This is really bringing back memories of growing up in Southeastern Illinois. We lived in a small town north of Olney on the IC branch running from Mattoon to Evansville. IC during the late 1960s ran pretty healthy (70-100) car trains between the two terminals, including piggyback on the rear of the trains. These trains were 295/296 and would handle local freight between the points.
Our little town (Dundas) had a team siding and the local would switch cars of limestone (used as fertilizer) quite often. I would ride my bike over and watch the switching. That led to my interest in railroads and ultimately becoming a railfan.
Only made it once to Lawrenceville and Mt. Carmel to take photos, although both along with Flora and Salem were in our high school conference (North Egyptian Conference). Pretty good basketball as Lawrenceville won 2 state titles (but we won conference one year). I have a photo of a southbound PC hopper train in Mt. Carmel. Also a photo of an EB Southern grain train.
Never made it to Flora or Salem for photos, but did venture to Mt. Vernon and Centralia and often to Effingham and Mattoon.
Getting back to my IC line...the L&N purchase of the C&EI put a big dent into the large trains between Mattoon and Evansville and slowly the traffic dwindled as did the conditions of the track. Track speed dropped from 35 to 25 to walking speed. I last saw an IC train in 1988 and it was later purchased by Indiana High Rail, who ran HUGE coke trains up the line and over to Robinson...at 5mph, rocking and rolling with Alcos. Wish I could go back to see one more of those trains! The line was abandoned around 1995, about the time my parents died. My dad used to take the morning passenger train to Olney to go to High School in the late 1920s. Often he would walk 8 miles home.
B&O mainline to St. Louis saw about 9 trains daily (4 each way) with a local between Washington and Flora. The line was in great shape (60mph) with welded rail and those iconic B&O CPL signals. One would often see Cotton Belt / SP power on the run thru trains.
The B&O is out of service, as mentioned above, west of Noble. CSX does run a grain train from Olney. The elevator is on the old IC track just south of the old crossing. Two years ago I returned home and walked the area around the crossing. The B&O depot is gone, of course as are the CPL signals. The connection track to the old IC is still there, or at least it was in 2015.
I would go to Effingham or Mattoon for "big action" the IC and PC put on quite a show. Wish I would have followed the IC local all the way north of south just once.
Ed
My grandfather worked on the B&O line from Flora to Shawneetown from 1941 to 1977. There was a small office at Mill Shoals that he and his coworkers assembled. He went to work early and came home late every night to keep the railroad safe for the trains to travel between Flora and Shawneetown. Near the end of his work, they had to travel to Flora each day to pickup the trucks that were used to maintain the line. As far as the frequency of the trips, I don't remember that information. I recall touring one of the diesel engines with him at Norris City. There is a maintenance building still standing for the B & O at New Shawneetown. Grain elevators were located at New Shawneetown, Ridgway, Omaha, Enfield, and Springerton. From Mill Shoals to Flora, I'm not as familiar with the businesses that may have used the railway. The New York Central crossed the B&O at Norris City. Some freight was exchanged between the two lines at the NYC depot there. Peabody Coal had a mine just north of Junction. They built their own tracks to Shawneetown. The track arrangement at old Shawneetown included wyes for the L & N and the B & O. Coal could be transferred to railroads cars and pulled north by either the L & N and B & O.
Photos by Richard Kundert show Prairie Trunk transporting coal from Shawneetown north. Since Prairie Trunk assumed the B&O/CSX business, believe that they had been transporting coal on the line as well.
1984 at Old Shawneetown:
It seems the majority of business along this line was small grain elevators servicing local farmers. I wonder if the farming went away, or the railroad caused it to go away. Surely it didn't switch over to trucks.
The ex-C&O GP9 looks right at home switching the grain elevator but the ex-BRC GP7 definitely looks out of place in a rural setting.
There were conveyor belt systems to load grain and coal into barges at Shawneetown. I also read that Fluorspar was transported by rail cars from the area.
Farming in southeast Illinois back in the mid 70s consisted of small farms that had land that had been in the family for years. I remember pulling the grain wagon behind the pickup truck to the elevator at Dale, IL on the L & N line that terminated at Shawneetown with the B & O. There were 7 small farmers within a mile of our house when I was in high school.
Today the closet one is about 4 miles away. He spends $80K per year on diesel fuel. They farm in Hamilton County and haul the equipment to Gallatin County. There are a million dollars of tractors (3) in one barn. In their other buildings are a couple of $400K combines, another larger $500K Case IH Steiger Series tractor, and 4 semis with grain trailers worth around $500k. That doesn't count the discs, plows, cultivators, bush hogs, and other equipment that is used. Most of the equipment is leased or mortgaged. Loans are used to purchase the seed to plant each year. He needs some medical attention but can't afford the health insurance or hospital bills so keeps working. That scenario is repeated throughout the region. It looks like more land is used to farm than before. Trees have been cleared and drainage pipes installed to make it easier to cultivate the land near the creeks that drain to the Ohio.
To answer your question about trucks, yes, some haul to the elevator operated by Bunge at the old coal mine near McLeansboro. There is a spur connected to the Evansville Western Railway that is used to transport to Consolidated Grain and Barge Enterprises on the Ohio River at Mt. Vernon, Indiana. Consolidated also has the grain elevator at Enfield that connects via same railway to Mt. Vernon, IN.
Others haul directly to Mt. Vernon, IN if they can get a better price than the elevator by McLeansboro. Most watch the prices daily and take it to the place that pays the best.
The Evansville Western Railway also transports coal from Hamilton County Coal at Delafield and Sugar Camp mine near Macedonia to Mt. Vernon. Their tracks connect to the A. B. Brown Generating Station owned by Southern Indiana Gas & Electric east of Mt. Vernon.
http://www.cgb.com
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