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zugmann,  <o:p></o:p> Yes, I see what you mean.  I am trying to unravel the logic of all these lights.  If it were up to me, I would start out with a concept that used green, yellow, and red because it is standard and completely understood.  Although railroads could have used that three color system too, and yet they ended up with quite a different concept.  But aside from that, why not set up the crosswalk just like the pedestrian button works the regular traffic lights at an intersection?  <o:p></o:p> I see in Minnesota, the DOT has a prototype in use.  Initially, they were worried that drivers would stop for the HAWK when not in use because it is an “out” traffic light.  I presume that they must intend to make a legal exception to that rule for the HAWK.  But they are relieved to find that drivers are not stopping for the “out” HAWK.  But it is hard to say what might develop as HAWKS show up all over the place.   <o:p></o:p> A red light means stop and wait.  A flashing red means stop and yield, the same as a “stop” sign.  As you say, the alternate flashing red lights are only used for grade crossings and school buses.  And in those applications, the alternate pair of flashing lights means the same as a constant red light; i.e. stop and wait.  So even though the red lights are flashing, the fact that they are alternating in a pair changes their meaning from the meaning of a single red flashing light.   <o:p></o:p> I would think that the rationale behind the alternating red flashing lights is to be more attention-getting because they are associated with events that are not routine (in the case of grade crossings), or not fixed (in the case of school buses).  The not-routine aspect would apply to a pedestrian crossing, so the alternating flashing pair of red lights might make sense for pedestrian crossings.  But they are not applying it as the main stop-and-wait message.  Instead, they are applying it as though it were a single red flashing light.  They are using it to tell drivers to stop and yield just like a single red flashing light or a “stop” sign.   <o:p></o:p> Apparently the pedestrian crossing is set up to hold traffic for a certain amount of time after being activated.  So there is a risk that the pedestrian will still be in the crosswalk after the time runs out.  So when the time runs out, the light changes from solid red to alternating flashing red.  This then places the onus on the driver to yield to anyone in the crosswalk just like a non-signalized crosswalk.  BUT the timing on the alternating flashing red runs out eventually too.  So what if a pedestrian is still in the crosswalk when that happens?   <o:p></o:p> Since the time for crossing runs out eventually, why not just use solid red until the timing runs out?  Okay, I see what they are doing.  They don’t want to absolutely hold traffic for a timed interval if the pedestrian has already cleared the crosswalk.  They have a provision in the current crosswalk law that allows stopped drivers to proceed once a pedestrian passes the lane of the driver.   <o:p></o:p> If you come up to a crosswalk containing a pedestrian that has already passed your lane, there is great deal of official misunderstanding about what a driver is supposed to do.  The language of the law says one thing, but it can easily be misinterpreted.  It is no wonder that this same particular issue poses a confusing problem to the signal control of the crosswalk.  <o:p></o:p> But, offhand, I would get rid of the double red light.  Use a single red to mean stop and wait, and a flashing red to mean stop and yield.  Otherwise it would indeed tend to water down the meaning of alternating flashing red lights for grade crossings and school buses.    <o:p></o:p> You have to remember that the people who bring you HAWK also bring you traffic circles, and community painted art in the streets for traffic calming.  There is so much more to this movement than just traffic control.
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