How to extinguish a tunnel fire

[Anonymous]

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[dharmon]

Ahem...Mr Adair..you have a call waiting on line 2.

[Anonymous]

I thought this fire was attributed to vagrants. Wasn't this fire several months ago? Is it still burning? I have heard of underground fires in coal burning for years, can this happen in tunnels? Does this tunnel have ventilation shafts?

I don't know how good this idea is, but how about drilling a length of pipe full of holes and suspending it in front of a flat car and feed water to it through fire hoses to scour and cool the tunnel.

[Anonymous]

I should have read the other threads first, I think I have a better picture now.

[Anonymous]

Being from West Virginia and having worked in the coal mines I have a little knowledge about mine fires. Fires are rare. The usual result is explosions of the methane gas in the mines. The mines have large ventilation fans to remove the gas and to provide a safe working environment (in a coal mine? ha!). The miners have a 5 to 15 rule. Keep the methane content out of the 5 to 15% range and it will not explode, but only burn. (The correct range is 5.13 to 14.97%, but 5 to 15 is easier to remember). I was in a small mine explosion and that is one of the reasons why I am not a coal mole. The secret to extinguish a fire is to deprive it of oxygen. The ventilation fans are shut off and the portals are sealed. It usually will be a year before the mine is reentered. Temperature monitors tell you how things are going in the mine. The problems come from mines that are near other mines. The mining activity can cause fractures to connect the mines and permit oxygen to enter. Also using the long wall mining method, wherein all coal pillars are removed and the mine is allowed to collapse as you mine in a retreating fashion. The collapse of the mine naturally fractures the overburdon and air can enter to feed a fire. As a sideline the longwall mehod can cause your house to turn into a split lever over night if it is above the mining operation. Mines in Applachia have an underground water problem. Large pumps are required to remove the mine water. Shutting down the pumps will permit the mine to fill up with water and eventually drown the fire. Remember the dozen or so miners who were trapped in a mine in Pennsylvania where, due to a surveying error cut into an abandoned mine that was full of water. Fortunately they were all rescued. I digress. Bottom line: Mine (or tunnel) fires are hard to extinguish and will take a considerable time before it can be reentered. Everything possible is done in the mining industry to prevent underground fires, but as the saying goes, S - - - Happens.

[Modelcar]

....Yes, the 9 miners from Quecreek, Pa....all were rescued..! Just 4 miles from my home area.

[Anonymous]

For Modelcar. Thank you for your comments. Possibly you knew some of the miners since you lived in close proximity to the mine. It is a sobering thought when you put on your hard hat and light and enter the mine. The belt that holds the battery pack for the light has a numbered brass tag riveted to it. This is so the body of the miner can be identified after an accident and potential long sealing of the mine. The movie that was recently on tv, October Sky, pretty well depicts life of the miner.

[Modelcar]

...wrwatkins: I have lived away from my home area in Pennsylvania for over 40 years and reside in Indiana. Did not have any connection with the families effected with 9 miners trapped in that accident....so didn't know any of them. But knowing that area as I do...[we still visit several times a year], that tragedy felt like they were neighbors involved and what a blessing from the extreme hard work by so many skills that brought them all to the surface alive and safe. We were scheduled to make a visit at that time of the year and so we were at the rescue site one day after all 9 miners were pulled to safety. It was awesome to stand there and realize what had to happen to make that rescue possible...! There are 9 evergreens planted around in a circle at the site now to mark the rescue spot. The rescue shaft { 240 ft. deep], is left in place and sealed at the surface.

[Modelcar]

...Item: Anyone inerested in the above story of the 9 miners from Quecreek, Pa., can just enter that into Google and learn much more of story...
Sorry to get off message here.

[corwinda]

Back to the tunnel fire ... Couldn't a remote control crawler (Like a bomb squad robot only bigger) drag a hose in to put water on the fire?

[tree68]

QUOTE: Originally posted by corwinda

Back to the tunnel fire ... Couldn't a remote control crawler (Like a bomb squad robot only bigger) drag a hose in to put water on the fire?

Part of the problem is that you may not be able to see the fire. The idea does have merit in terms of getting foam apparatus (high-expansion foam) closer to the seat of things, which might help smother it. In the end, though, it might just be something to keep people occupied until the fire burns itself out.....

[corwinda]

QUOTE: Originally posted by tree68
[]
Part of the problem is that you may not be able to see the fire.

I was thinking an infrared camera to see through the smoke.

[locomutt]

QUOTE: Originally posted by tree68

QUOTE: Originally posted by corwinda

Back to the tunnel fire ... Couldn't a remote control crawler (Like a bomb squad robot only bigger) drag a hose in to put water on the fire?

Part of the problem is that you may not be able to see the fire. The idea does have merit in terms of getting foam apparatus (high-expansion foam) closer to the seat of things, which might help smother it. In the end, though, it might just be something to keep people occupied until the fire burns itself out.....

I was "thinking" that if you sealed off "all"enterances to the tunnel and pumped in CO2,
Maybe? I'm sure everything has been tried.[:)]

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by tree68

QUOTE: Originally posted by corwinda

Back to the tunnel fire ... Couldn't a remote control crawler (Like a bomb squad robot only bigger) drag a hose in to put water on the fire?

Part of the problem is that you may not be able to see the fire. The idea does have merit in terms of getting foam apparatus (high-expansion foam) closer to the seat of things, which might help smother it. In the end, though, it might just be something to keep people occupied until the fire burns itself out.....

Okay Larry, what do you think about a couple of fire cars with foam units being shoved thru by an RC loco. Maybe take a gon with a blade to push debris out of the way. Also have some spray bars in an arch to put on a goor layer of foam.

[corwinda]

According to today's (8-22) Register Guard the tunnel will reopen Monday 6PM. Unfortunately they don't have the article online.

[Anonymous]

Well I guess that I'm one of the crazy firefighters that would volunteer to go in as long as I had enough spare air bottles to be able to do my job

[locomutt]

QUOTE: Originally posted by drailed1999

Well I guess that I'm one of the crazy firefighters that would volunteer to go in as long as I had enough spare air bottles to be able to do my job

How many air bottles do you think you need?
Or do we have to have a truck standing by,with a "Cascade" system onboard?[:)]

[Modelcar]

...."Tunnel to open Monday 6Pm"......????? How can that happen....Thought the smoke was still rolling out both ends of it just a day or so ago....