Amtrak Conductor Suspended for Kerry comment

[Anonymous]

From UTU Site

Amtrak conductor suspended for Kerry comments
JEFFERSON CITY, Mo. - An Amtrak conductor who is a Republican congressional candidate has been suspended without pay for suggesting his train passengers should vote against Democratic presidential candidate John Kerry, according to the Associated Press.
Conductor Leslie Farr (a member of UTU Local 1525 at Carbondale, Ill.) was on a Kansas City-to-St. Louis train that was delayed last Thursday while waiting for Kerry's locomotive to leave St. Louis and head to a Jefferson City rally.

In an interview Tuesday with The Associated Press, Farr said he used the train's public address system to inform passengers they would be delayed because of Kerry's train and quipped that they should vote accordingly in November.

"These people's lives were seriously affected by this, so I tried to diffuse the situation," said Farr, 26, of St. Louis. But in retrospect, "I was wrong for making a political comment."

Amtrak has opened an informal investigation into Farr's actions, accusing him in a letter of violating company policies by making "inappropriate and denigrating announcements" to customers that "caused embarrassment to the corporation and the loss of good will of our passengers." A formal investigation meeting with Farr is scheduled for Thursday.

Farr is the Republican challenger to Rep. William Lacy Clay, D-Mo., in the 1st Congressional District and also is a delegate to the Republican National Convention, which will be held later this month.

Amtrak spokesman Marc Magliari confirmed Farr's employment but said he could not comment about personnel issues.

According to Amtrak records, the eastbound Ann Rutledge train left Kansas City about 25 minutes late and was running more than an hour-and-a-half behind - due largely to freight train traffic - when it left Washington, Mo., headed toward St. Louis. The train, carrying 135 passengers, was delayed an additional 84 minutes just outside the St. Louis suburb of Kirkwood to allow Kerry's special westbound train to pass.

Farr is not a regular conductor on Amtrak's twice-daily trains between Missouri's two largest cities. Rather, Farr said he was filling in because one of the regular conductors was assigned to Kerry's train.

Farr said that if his political statements were distasteful to some passengers, others likely were offended that Kerry campaign banners were draped over Amtrak property.

While expressing regret about his comments, Farr added: "It's gotten me very, very upset. I feel like I'm being unjustly picked on" by being suspended without pay.

The company complaint also accuses Farr of not wearing his name tag and refusing to identify himself to passengers.

(This item was distributed by the Associated Press Aug. 11, 2004)

[Anonymous]

What ever happened to freedom of speech????????????

[espeefoamer]

[#ditto][#ditto][#ditto][#ditto][#ditto][#ditto][#ditto]
I would have said the same thing if he had been on the other side .It doesn't matter what side a person is on,he still has a right to free speech.

[dharmon]

Freedom of speech doesn't really apply in the course of your duties. If he were out of uniform standing on the platform saying that, it would be one thing. But since he made (allegedy) the comments while in the course of his duties as an Amtrak employee, and a representative of the company, it reflects on the company and falls under their company policies regarding conduct. If the Amtrak has no policy regarding statements of a political or other topics and it was an arbitrary suspension, then it maybe out of line.

But really, the point is that when acting in an official capacity, an employee should keep comments like that to himself. I mean he could have said it in a joking manner, but so many folks are thin skinned that you have to watch what you say on the clock.

[tree68]

Hence the cardinal rule: Never discuss religion or politics with friends. Or in this case, customers.

I'll support his right to free speech, but that right ended when he keyed the PA microphone as a representative of Amtrak. His task was to merely inform the passengers of what was holding them up. He'd probably be in just as much hot water if the cause of the delay was, say, a UPS pig train and he made a negative comment about UPS.

As innocuous as the comment was (and it was humorous and could easily have been made about Dubya's train, if in the same situation), I'm sure he could have offended just about anyone with the appropriate "incorrect" comment (you can choose your hot-button issue.)

Had he made the comment as an aside, "off the air," I'd be behind him all the way. As it was, he made a bad judgement on the spur of the moment. Sounded funny at the time, but we've all done the same thing, and, as he did, regretted the decision.

Of course, the fact that he is a political candidate isn't helping the situation, either. I can't speak to the other "charges." I wasn't there.

[UPTRAIN]

I still don't like the idea of draping all these signs and decals over property of a federally funded system. Sounds to me like they are playing favorites, however they would do the same with bush. I still think Union Pacific should have run the revenue train first. But then if Kerry would have been put in the hole, he would have sued the company so it sounds like UP just was wanting to save it's own self.

[dharmon]

QUOTE: Originally posted by UPTRAIN

I still don't like the idea of draping all these signs and decals over property of a federally funded system. Sounds to me like they are playing favorites, however they would do the same with bush. I still think Union Pacific should have run the revenue train first. But then if Kerry would have been put in the hole, he would have sued the company so it sounds like UP just was wanting to save it's own self.

I understand the dislike of the signs. But in a "fair and balanced' view, when GW goes on campaign trips he uses Air Force One. Now technically his campaign has to reimburse the USG for the cost of the aircraft and crew. But his official staff, Secret Service, Navy guy carrying the "football" etc that travel with him on the campaign are not part of the cost.

I'm not trying to pick a fight or play sides, just provide a comparative view.

[Mookie]

Just another case of getting your tongue over your eye teeth and not seeing what you are saying!

Goin' home - had enuff!

Mookie

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by dharmon

Freedom of speech doesn't really apply in the course of your duties. If he were out of uniform standing on the platform saying that, it would be one thing. But since he made (allegedy) the comments while in the course of his duties as an Amtrak employee, and a representative of the company, it reflects on the company and falls under their company policies regarding conduct. If the Amtrak has no policy regarding statements of a political or other topics and it was an arbitrary suspension, then it maybe out of line.

But really, the point is that when acting in an official capacity, an employee should keep comments like that to himself. I mean he could have said it in a joking manner, but so many folks are thin skinned that you have to watch what you say on the clock.

Well said!!

[dharmon]

QUOTE: Originally posted by UPTRAIN

I still don't like the idea of draping all these signs and decals over property of a federally funded system. Sounds to me like they are playing favorites, however they would do the same with bush. I still think Union Pacific should have run the revenue train first. But then if Kerry would have been put in the hole, he would have sued the company so it sounds like UP just was wanting to save it's own self.

I understand the dislike of the signs. But in a "fair and balanced' view, when GW goes on campaign trips he uses Air Force One. Now technically his campaign has to reimburse the USG for the cost of the aircraft and crew. But his official staff, Secret Service, Navy guy carrying the "football" etc that travel with him on the campaign are not part of the cost.

I'm not trying to pick a fight or play sides, just provide a comparative view.

[MP57313]

I've heard inappropriate (non-political) comments over the PA system now and then, but nothing to get someone suspended. Still, it must be strange being a Republican working in a union shop...

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by UPTRAIN

I still don't like the idea of draping all these signs and decals over property of a federally funded system. Sounds to me like they are playing favorites, however they would do the same with bush. I still think Union Pacific should have run the revenue train first. But then if Kerry would have been put in the hole, he would have sued the company so it sounds like UP just was wanting to save it's own self.

My friend, although I do agree with you in an understandable way, an old saying may be what UP is showing in this case, "Don't invite trouble to the party." For what its worth[;)]

[garr]

dharmon,

Well said in both posts. In this case, the conductor will probably be keeping his job and getting backpay as well. If what is reported is true, no specific vote against Kerry was stated. A joking comment about the train's delay and "vote accordingly" was made--maybe he was telling the voters on board to vote late.

As Zach stated above, the Amtrak loco with the full side bumper sticker could imply, to the unknowing citizen, Amtrak support for Kerry. We all know its a chartered train but average John Q Public does not. But hopefully the average voter doesn't vote based on some company's endorsement.

As far as Air Force One's use in campaigning--I believe reimbursement has always been the avg. price of first class travel on the common carrier airlines. Not for sure who the campaign has to pay the fare for, but I imagine it would be the candidate(s) and campaign staff. The gov't pays for all the presidential aides who are preforming their day-to-day gov't jobs.

Jay

[RudyRockvilleMD]

There is another point some of you may have missed. Amtrak is a federally funded organization so while neither its management nor its employees are federal employees whose political activities on the job are controlled by the "Hatch Act," they still have to be careful not to seem partisan while on the job. What they say off-the-job is their own business.

[Anonymous]

Better rename the train for a Democrat. Ann Rutledge was a friend of Abe Lincoln.

[AntonioFP45]

What the conductor said jokingly, was "spur of the moment bad judgement", however it shouldn't have necessitated a suspension, but a written reprimand.

Amazingly, for those of you that remember, two years ago a college professor in California told his students to write an article about "killing Bush". Now IMHO, this professor is a low-life moron! [V]Of course his bosses were o.k with this! Now that was an atrocity, whether it would have been about Clinton or Bush! Amazing how where you work at makes a difference in whether you'll be punished for expressing your views in an inappropriate setting.[V]

[vsmith]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Limitedclear

From UTU Site

Amtrak conductor suspended for Kerry comments


Farr is the Republican challenger to Rep. William Lacy Clay, D-Mo., in the 1st Congressional District and also is a delegate to the Republican National Convention, which will be held later this month.

I think the fact that this guy is also a Repub candidate for Congress had a lot to do why he got repremanded so hard.

If he was just a regular employee he would have probably gotten off with a verbal repremand. But now add in that he's a political candidate for the opposition party and then the whole issue of using his work position to make a personal political statement, even an offhand one, becomes a more serious offense.


LimitedClear I added a note to my posting requesting viewers to post comments to this thread and to Bergie to delete my extranious subject thread, just so we dont have two conversations going on about the same thing, later Vic[;)]

[Anonymous]

If the conductor can't speak his mind , then there shouldn't be any banners hanging anywhere on the property. Sounds a little hipocritical to me

[Anonymous]

It may be a chartered train, but .....

They use a chartered plane that is painted ..... Kerry Edwards 2004 (or something to that effect). But they are flying around in the big blue yonder.

They probably charter buses at times....with them all painted up, too. But the bus cruises along public highway/road system. I can do the same with a bus I painted up.

But on the rails, that screams Amtrak. Unless I'm allowed to cruise down those same rails with some locomotive contraption that I built.

Jim

btw.....Isn't Senator Kerry's wife just the sweetest little flower. Gee, I wonder why he married her. Just joking.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by ironmine

It may be a chartered train, but .....

They use a chartered plane that is painted ..... Kerry Edwards 2004 (or something to that effect). But they are flying around in the big blue yonder.

They probably charter buses at times....with them all painted up, too. But the bus cruises along public highway/road system. I can do the same with a bus I painted up.

But on the rails, that screams Amtrak. Unless I'm allowed to cruise down those same rails with some locomotive contraption that I built.

Jim

btw.....Isn't Senator Kerry's wife just the sweetest little flower. Gee, I wonder why he married her. Just joking.

All this hullaballoo over Kerry riding a train, I sincerely doubt this will be the deciding factor in this campaign. What mode of transportation do you think turns peoples heads more Amtrak or Airforce One or Marine One. See the forest for the trees people and pay attention to the issues.

[tree68]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Big_Girl_4005

All this hullaballoo over Kerry riding a train, I sincerely doubt this will be the deciding factor in this campaign. What mode of transportation do you think turns peoples heads more Amtrak or Airforce One or Marine One. See the forest for the trees people and pay attention to the issues.

At least this is a railroad "issue." If we start debating the real issues here, things usually get nasty in a hurry. We'll tire of this soon and move on.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by tree68

QUOTE: Originally posted by Big_Girl_4005

All this hullaballoo over Kerry riding a train, I sincerely doubt this will be the deciding factor in this campaign. What mode of transportation do you think turns peoples heads more Amtrak or Airforce One or Marine One. See the forest for the trees people and pay attention to the issues.

At least this is a railroad "issue." If we start debating the real issues here, things usually get nasty in a hurry. We'll tire of this soon and move on.

I never suggested that the issues be debated here. I have seen far less volatile subjects turn gutter nasty in the blink of an eye. I am sure I am not the only one biting my tongue with rebuttals for this topic-but that is exactly what I don't want to start here. I realize that by posting to this now I am bringing it back to the top when I wish it would fade but felt I had to make my position clear.

[AntonioFP45]

One thing no one has brought up here. Did anyone at the Campaign stops "challenge" Kery with the question about support for Amtrak????????

Should have been one of the first questions brought up by any railfan, Amtrak riders, supporters, etc, at all of these stops following issues of terrorism and the economy.

[Anonymous]

Although this is a minor incident during an election year, I'm pretty sure if that same train was held up for Bush's train, he would have nothing to say. Respect for an elected official is one thing, but when that elected official doesn't support you in keeping the very thing that's putting money in your pocket (a railroad job), then 'no', I CANNOT show respect towards that person (public or private). Whenever these elected officials want a special train to take them around the country, they tout that THEY are our biggest ally. That's the biggest lie yet. Only a handful (and I do mean a handful) of local, state and federal legislators openly boast their support (in words and action) for all forms of rail transportation. They continually press for more funding of rail projects that will give the public an alternative to being stuck in traffic on the already overcrowded roads. THESE are the legislators I'll glady respect. As for that conductor who made that comment...HE'S A DUMB*#@!!! Much love and respect to all the current and retired railroaders out there, in the US and the world!!


PEACE
Glenn
A R E A L RAILROADER...A TRUE AMERICAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! =?)

[jwinter]

I noticed a few days a go a very large polical "vote for" sign nailed to a UP owned railroad sign. I contacted UP and told them about it. Still waiting to see if they remove it. Or perhaps they endorse this candidate.

[jabrown1971]

Sounds like this is a hot topic alright-In 1984? President Reagan took to the rails in Ohio, and although I only saw the train in pictures and don't have any handy now, I can only say that there were minor signs and flags applied to the train, but the lead locomotive on the train that ran ahead had a big sign draped over the handrails. So was Seaboard System/CSX/Chessie System makin a polictical statement. There are a few people who were on the Ann Rutledge that day who were greatly inconvenienced by the trains being late-however as everyone knows, when the President, Vice-President or the candidates are in the motorcades on the interstate, we all have to stop and let them by. I try to avoid those areas on days when that is going on. The train was delayed an additional 84 minutes on top of the 90 it was already running. 84 minutes does seem a bit much too me, possibly they could have been allowed to make the Kirkwood stop, while Kerry's train ran at reduced speed without having to stop. Maybe Mr. Farr could have chosen his words a little better. This publicity could have a negative impact on his campaign and the Republicans in general. We will see.