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[quote user="Poppa_Zit"][quote user="Bucyrus"][quote user="Poppa_Zit"][quote user="Bucyrus"][quote user="Poppa_Zit"][ The No. 1 definition of allege is "to assert without proof." That was the word I chose carefully. No one claimed his "jumping the crossing" was anything but pure speculation.[/quote]I understand.  I just wanted to know who asserted without proof that the victim attempted to jump the crossing.  From your third person allegation, I could not tell if it was only your personal opinion, or if it was made by others who actually had some evidence.[/quote]If there is any other evidence, the police have not been forthcoming. BTW, what is a "third person allegation"? I believe it would be a second-hand allegation, based on first person [police] observations.[/quote]I am not referring to first, second, or third-hand, which indicates the number of parties in the chain of information transfer. You said:"He illegally ran a stop sign at night at a very high speed, allegedly attempting to go airborne at a crossing for a thrill." By third-person, I mean your structure indicating that there is an allegation that the victim was attempting to go airborne at a crossing for a thrill without revealing that the only allegation is your personal allegation.  You make it seem as if the allegation stands separate from your own opinion, and thus lends credence to it.  This would be in contrast to what I would call a first-person allegation such as, "I allege that the victim was attempting to go airborne at a crossing for a thrill."With regard to the handedness of your allegation, I would call it first-hand.  The police never said anything about the victim trying to go airborne.[/quote]This argument is ludicrous as well as pointless. This is how news stories are written. I have NEVER seen one instance where the author of a well-written news story says something like "this writer alleges ..." In fact, the majority of stories never identify who the "alleger" is, do they? As in a story about an "alleged rape". Or "alleged fraud". Or my personal local favorite, "alleged mob connections".Attribution is done to give credibility to a thought, idea or quotation in a story. The concept that one allegation could have more or less credence than another is ridiculous, as long as both accurately employ known facts in a case.   When we're dealing in "assertations without proof" the "alleger" need not be identified because the statement is not a fact -- it is someone's speculation. Therefore, it needs no attribution.There is no such thing as "chain of information transfer" when dealing with speculation. There are no such things as "first-hand allegations", "second-hand allegations" or "third person allegations", either. In my attempt to form a speculative theory, I used first-hand news reports and the photo of the crossing. That's how it is done.The news reports I read did their job properly -- presenting the facts without editorializing. So did the police. They did  not offer theories or make any announcements until all of the evidence has been examined and considered. I was one of several here who speculated on what might have happened. OK, that's it. I'm not getting paid here to teach Journalism 101. [(-D]     [/quote]You say this:I have NEVER seen one instance where the author of a well-written news story says something like "this writer alleges ..."You are correct that the news reporter does not say, "This reporter alleges..." The reason for that is that they, as reporters, don't allege anything.  When they refer to something being alleged, it is being alleged by someone else, such as the police, witnesses, the victim or a combination of them, and the allegation usually flows from some kind of evidence even though there is no proof.   Here you say this:There is no such thing as "chain of information transfer" when dealing with speculation. There are no such things as "first-hand allegations", "second-hand allegations" or "third person allegations", either.You established the existence of first and second hand allegations earlier when you said this:BTW, what is a "third person allegation"? I believe it would be a second-hand allegation, based on first person [police] observations.Here you said this:The news reports I read did their job properly -- presenting the facts without editorializing. So did the police. They did not offer theories or make any announcements until all of the evidence has been examined and considered. I agree, but I have not accused the police or the news reports of editorializing.  All they said is that the guy ran a stop sign, collided with a tank car and under-ran it, and that there were no skid marks.
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