Electronics and DCC

TOPIC THIS POST: Introduction

Okay, time to get started on a new FORUM CLINIC on DCC!

Lest you think this is going to be like all the other discussions on DCC you've seen recently -- let's hope not.

First, I'm going to make some assumptions:

1. You already understand the basic theory of DCC, so we're not going to waste any time discussing that here.

2. You already have selected the system you want, and perhaps have already purchased it. There's been endless discussion on this and other online forums about which system is "best". We're not going to waste a lot of time discussing that here. I might mention some experiences I've had with various systems, but let's put it to rest here: there is no *best* system, only the one that's right for your needs. All the DCC systems I'm aware of on the market are well built and do the job.

So here's the approach I want to take:

1. I'm going to focus on discussing my experiences from using DCC for 12 years on my HO Siskiyou Line. If you would like to see this info (and more) presented in video form, check out this link.

2. This is to be a forum about the practical side of installing and using DCC on a larger layout (beyond the 4x8). I hope to share lots of hints and tips along the way that I've picked up from 12 years of using DCC.

3. DISCLAIMER: These are my opinions based on what I have done and what's worked for me. You may not always agree, and that's fine. Go ahead and share your opinion because maybe you can teach this old dog a new trick. Or we may just agree to disagree -- either way, I'm sure others will benefit from an alternative view.

So to start off, let's discuss next where to put your system in the layout room. On a larger layout, you need to think about where the system is located to minimize excess bus wire length, etc.

TOPIC NEXT POST: Where to put your system

Joe:

I'm really looking forward to everything you have to say about this, I'm sure it's going to help a lot of people. Like me that have never used DCC.

sounds Great Joe, I saw on your site that there are no opearting sessions in June,how long does your summer break last?

This could be the start of a great clinic.

I have been using an NCE Powerhouse Pro for about a year now (including the upgrade) .....

http://www.ncedcc.com/catalog2.html

.....and am now hooked on DCC for my American stuff - the handbuilt British locos will just have to put up with DC

Being someone who doesnt like to waste anything, I have mounted the transformer, booster and electrics in an old 1970's wooden speaker cabinet and the accessory power, cab bus and track bus are fed through an umbilical cable, with a 37-way connector at each end.

This means I can easily switch the system between my switching layout, test track and any future layouts, simply by wiring in a 37-way socket to each destination. It is also easy to transport.

The throttles are inserted into universal throttle panels (UTP's) around the layout and test track. I have also made room in the speaker box to transport the cable and throttles, just to keep things safe.


Jon

I have my knife and fork in hand, Joe, but the plate's lookin' kinda empty. Bring it on, Man!!! [^]

-Crandell

Joe, I have had DCC since 1994(Portland NMRA Convention). My system is near one end of the layout room, and consists of a 5 amp command station and a 5 amp booster. I thought of putting it 'centered' on the layout. Instead it is at one end of the layout room, and I have #14 wiring from the cmd/boosters to a Digitrax PM42 'power district' unit that is centered. It then is #18 wiring out to the track bus. I have a small desk/workbench/spray booth in this far end work area, and a computer that can be attached to the Digitrax Loconet. I have also ran Loconet wiring to the family room so a future 'dispatcher' can be 'remote' from the layout in the 'crew lounge'. The layout was built with 'cab control' wiring, and the #18 track feeders are run to a terminal strip. Each 'power district' was jumpered together and a run was made to the PM42. The old recessed panels have been around ever since, but will be replaced this year to make room for recessed station work areas(and places to set down your coffee). DCC has made everything 'simple' and only electrical work I have had to do is adjust/fix the old twin-coil switch machines(being replaced by Tortoise machines). The railroad DCC is protected by computer UPS's, and is powered up 24X7 from power outages.

Jim Bernier

I have a web article on wiring my 4x8 On30 layout for DCC.

http://www.pacificcoastairlinerr.com/4x8/wiring/

I have been using command control since MRC had the ProTrac system in the early '80's. I even tethered the throttles. Followed that up with OnBoard in the mid-80's for it's sound capabilities.

Command control is sure alot easier than wiring cab control for straight DC. Allows trains to be run instead of power being dispatched especially a small layout.

Just a thought
Harold

Joe,

You've got my appetite begging for more too! Can't wait to dig in!

I have been looking forward to this clinic since the end of the scenery clinic. While I still have not purchased a DCC system, I look to do so soon. This clinic should help me in deciding what my requirements will be and then go from there.

Thanks,

Ryan

Great timing Joe...I just sold my boat today and will wait a bit to see what I need. Hope you chat about amps, radio, simplex/duplex, and the saftey side of this too.

Heading up North this summer, will contact you later, would like to just observe one of your OP sessions...Have visited your site, very professional....Take Care...John

12 years with DCC...... It is amazing to me that DCC has been around as long as that. Only now does it seem to be becoming mainstream. I suppose it has taken this long for the products to reach a level of simplcity and reliability and for the costs to come down to a more widly accepted level. I am looking forward to the thread to see what I can add to my growing empire!

Joe, in your original post you used the term larger layout (larger than 4 x 8). It might be helpful to express layout size in terms of the number of locomotives on the rails at the same time.

So my question is, at what point do you think it become advantageous to consider switching to DCC? The way I see it, there are 3 factors to consider. Number of locomotives, number of operators, and total square footage and the wiring implications associated with size.

QUOTE: Originally posted by simon1966 12 years with DCC...... It is amazing to me that DCC has been around as long as that. Only now does it seem to be becoming mainstream. I suppose it has taken this long for the products to reach a level of simplcity and reliability and for the costs to come down to a more widly accepted level. I am looking forward to the thread to see what I can add to my growing empire!

Simon, command control moved off the drawing board and onto the layout almost 25 years ago, in the form of CTC-16. I was actually a member of an operating crew that went back and forth weekly to the basements of two CTC-16 pioneers. These guys went on to form an all command club in Denver, using PMP-112. It used to be that you had to be good with electronics to get into command control. Things have come a long way since then.

QUOTE: Originally posted by Big_Boy_4005 [br Simon, command control moved off the drawing board and onto the layout almost 25 years ago, in the form of CTC-16.

Actually, command control is at least 40 years old. The earliest one I know of is ASTRAC, built by GE in the 60s. It didn't last in the marketplace very long, though.

I remember ASTRAC, primarily because Allen McClelland used it on the V&O. He then went with a CTC-16 type of system which came prebuilt from John Mann in Cincinnatti. It was called "Mann-Made" (of course!). CVP's RailCommand is sort of CTC-16 on steroids as is CTC-80. NONE OF THESE SYSTEMS ARE DCC, however. DCC stands for DIGITAL Command Control. From Astract to RailCommand and in between, including On Board, Dynatrol, and some others that are long gone, those early systems were ANALOG Command Control. All of them served their purpose and all of the Digital systems out now are, as Joe says, "built to get the job done".

I will be working on a modularized shelf layout system, you just think modules and you know what I have to think about, each module has to be able to handle full layout systemizing, IE it will have independent lighting to have day/night operations, it has to transfer the DCC track signals, meaning it will have a bus wire following the tracks,
It has to have an independent power supply for basic lighting and signals then then power for slow speed turnout controls,
I know DCC would work just for powering the track, but you cannot rely on just the track to transfer power soely on the rails and rail joiners, you need solid wired connections.
I tend to feel the power supply connections could be connectable to any module and be able to power the whole system, I know of the DCCauxilliary power amplifiers for long lines of track to keep power distribution even, how I deal with this is still an open question.