General Discussion (Model Railroader)

This is not going to be very welcome news for many of you, but BLI has the Q2 listed for delivery late this year!  That was the 4-4-6-4 Duplex which was the most powerful non-articulated steamer ever produced.  First they announce that they will make the UP 9000 series 4-12-2 engines, and now this!?

I guess I'll have to start flippin' burgers.

-Crandell

But where are the switchers?

How come we never hear of such engines in N scale?Sure would save to get one....well...I'll keep on dreaming....for a long long time I guess.

blownout cylinder:

But where are the switchers?

Probably where the clowns are.

Substitute "switcher" for "clowns" in http://www.stlyrics.com/lyrics/alittlenightmusic/sendintheclowns.htm and you'll see what I mean.

Or Moguls, Harriman Mikes and Pacifics, or maybe NC&StL J-3's ("Yellowjackets" or "Stripes") or what have you.

Andre

Barry,
How many switchers do you want?  Proto 2000 already has made several runs of 0-8-0's & 0-6-0's.  Spectrum has decent 0-6-0T's, and Mantua has 0-6-0T's and 0-6-0 Camelbacks.  What's the problem?

Paul A. Cutler III
*******************
Weather Or No Go New Haven
*******************

As long as we keep buying them, they will keep making them. Who can't resist the look of a large steam loco? I suspect most of them will end up on a shelf unused.

Would I buy one? I doubt it. No room to run it (unless I put that 2 track "display loop" around the outside walls of my layout room).

Paul3:

Barry,
How many switchers do you want?  Proto 2000 already has made several runs of 0-8-0's & 0-6-0's.  Spectrum has decent 0-6-0T's, and Mantua has 0-6-0T's and 0-6-0 Camelbacks.  What's the problem?

Paul A. Cutler III
*******************
Weather Or No Go New Haven
*******************

All kinds----look. If large loco collectors can have their fun---eccentrics like moi should be allowed ours!!

So there-----HHAAAARRRUUUMPH

selector:

This is not going to be very welcome news for many of you, but BLI has the Q2 listed for delivery late this year!  That was the 4-4-6-4 Duplex which was the most powerful non-articulated steamer every produced.  First they announce that they will make the UP 9000 series 4-12-2 engines, and now this!?

Yet another example that, as I've pointed out before, the collector faction in model railroading and not the actual modelers, is what today is driving the manufacturers. If built to true scale and as a non-articulated just as the real Q2 was, the model will likely require track radii well in excess of 48" to operate (maybe 60"!). How many HO layouts have you every seen, or even heard of, with such specs? Don't expect to see many small, quality steamers in the future, that's clearly not where the market is going. The future is in making shelf queens. How's about a Pennsy S-1 next?

CNJ831

That'll look fantastic -- I can hardly wait to see the overhang on the 22" sectional track now!!

Yet another example that, as I've pointed out before, the collector faction in model railroading and not the actual modelers, is what today is driving the manufacturers.

balearic:

If built to true scale and as a non-articulated just as the real Q2 was, the model will likely require track radii well in excess of 48" to operate. How many HO layouts have you every seen, or even heard of, with such specs?

 

Looks like that's not exactly what they have in mind (see below).

 

 

Super-Heavy Weighted Brass Construction and Detail

Features the ALL-NEW Paragon2 SOUND & Control System

Integral DCC Decoder with Back EMF for Industry Best Slow Speed Operation in DC and DCC
    (1 smph @ 128 Speed Steps)

Precision Drive Mechanism with sprung drivers engineered for continuous heavy load towing
    and ultra-smooth slow speed operation

Fly-Wheel Synchronized Puffing Smoke and Chuff

Grade & Load-sensing variable Smoke & Chuff Intensity (Less smoke and lighter chuff sounds
    when on a decline/less load; more smoke and belabored chuff when on inclines/more load.)

5-Pole Can Motor with Skew Wound Armature

Premium Caliber Painting with Authentic Paint Schemes

Operating Cab Roof Vents

Operating Metal Knuckle Couplers (2)

Factory Installed Engineer and Firemen Figures

Minimum radius: 22 radius (!!!) or greater recommended.

That'll look fantastic -- I can hardly wait to see the overhang on the 22" sectional track now!!

Yes, it probably will look very much like that 4-12-2 articulated abomination MTH recently put out. That was a classic example of turning a scale model into a toy train.

CNJ831

CNJ831:

Yes, it probably will look very much like that 4-12-2 articulated abomination MTH recently put out. That was a classic example of turning a scale model into a toy train.

CNJ831

MTH-----I thought it is/was a toy train manufacturer.

And because of the scale model thing being thrown into the toy train category as well----

We get this------overhanging thing that we see the collector going after

OY.

The description suggests that this isn't going to be your typical $399 BLI Paragon 2 engine.  I'd be surprised if its MSRP is less than $599. 

I would go for the S1, John, if it were to be live steam.  My wife would holler that the kettle is boiling.

-Crandell

 From a modeler´s point of view, there is no sense in releasing locos like that, but they are sellers! With the vast number of roads in the US, it is some job to find out which loco will sell, as the "standard" USRA types are pretty much covered by the industry already. I don´t think, that the typical XY RR  2-8-0 workhorse will sell well in the market. Market potential for those UP or PRR monsters seems to be bigger...

That´s why Marklin re-releases the Big Boy again - it will also sell in Germany, because it epitomizes US steam!

... and we will run it on our standard 14" radius!

That's because the masses have turned away from trains as a hobby, and manufacturers have decided to chase the money of collectors in order to survive.  Since collectors usually want either oddball items or else big, impressive items (either of which set them apart from the "less-important" masses), it only stands to reason that manufacturers would build less-common engines for a relatively limited number of people as opposed to a more-common engine that would appeal to a broader cross-section of the hobby.

So tell me why would a collector want a factory (i.e. "mass") produced model that smokes and makes the appropriate sounds and maybe a few questionable ones coupled with the compromises required to make it go around 22" radius curves only to have it sit in a display case? Seems to me that this anonymous evil collector would rather have the hyper-detailed models produced by the likes of PSC, Glacier Park, OMI, etc., which don't make the compromises, which are built in very limited quantities and which go for 3+ times more, thus ensuring this "spawn of Satan collector" the satisfaction of knowing he has something the great unwashed masses can't afford.

As for "common" engines, every single USRA engine has been done already, albeit in as delivered condition and not reflecting years of shoppings and resultant modifications by the railroads that had the originals, not to mention copies.

What's your definiton of a common engine? For an SP/UP fan, those would be the Harriman 4-6-0, 2-8-0, 2-8-2, 4-6-2 (Light and Heavy). Bachmann chose to base their Harriman 2-8-0 on the IC engines with Baker valve gear rather than the more numerous SP and UP versions with valves slightly inboard of the cylinders actuated by Stephenson Valve gear. At least the Spectrums are versatile conversion fodder, having been cobbled into engines as diverse as a CV M-5 and an SP C-11 (ex Cotton Belt K-1) and redetailed for Illinois Central #908. Probably more, but those come to mind readily.

Suppose BLI had chosen to produce Pennsy engines of classes H8, H9 and H10. Would that be OK? After all, these were common engines, but only on the Pennsy. Unless you're a Pennsy fan or willing to have your free-lance line have a Pennsy look, they wouldn't do you a fat lot of good. BLI's already done the Pennsy I1s, which, given its numbers (close to 600, IIRC) would qualify it as a common engine, but again, only on the Pennsy. BLI even had the courtesy to do versions with the short 90F82 tender and the 210F82A "Coast to Coast" tender.

I wonder who would be howling if some manufacturer decided to reproduce Alaska Railroad's #'s 801 and 802, the lightest 4-8-2's in North America. http://www.alaskarails.org/pix/former-loco/JK-801a.html Not a common engine, but certainly one that could take 22" curves in HO without a lot of special engineering. Interestingly enough, someone kitbashed one out of a Spectrum USRA light. http://alaskamodelrrnews.homestead.com/Steam.html#anchor_1029

Andre

Yes, it probably will look very much like that 4-12-2 articulated abomination MTH recently put out. That was a classic example of turning a scale model into a toy train.

CNJ831

And why, pray tell, would this (the Q2) be a case of pandering to a collector of scale locomotives as you stated earlier?

You're right, the MTH UP 9000 is an abomination. No collector in his right mind would want one of those, so how do collectors end up being targets of misplaced outrage?

Andre