This is the only conclusion I can arrive at.
When Life Like was in Baltimore, they had a large lineup of C&O stuff. (Like the USRA 0-8-0). Now that Walthers has taken over, it seems just about all the C&O motive power is gone.
Walthers only did one limited run of the F-7A's in DCC. Good luck finding the B's.
Walthers is now completely skipping the E-8's. I would love one in a low wave pattern (Yellow stripe up top) to match the heavyweights Walthers sells.
And 0-8-0's are certainly no where to be found after many years on hiatus.
And the Berkshires are now gone with no reissue listed.
I don't get it. Isn't tranisition era modeling the largest modeling segment? Wasn't the C&O one of largest of the roads back then?
I can only hope BLI/PCM will step up to the plate and fill the void. I'll even take Bachmann if the quality and detail is there.
Don - Specializing in layout DC->DCC conversions
Modeling C&O transition era and steel industries There's Nothing Like Big Steam!
I don't think Walthers "hates" the C&O... I don't know why they aren't producing almost any C&O equipment right now, but I don't think it's because Walthers hates the C&O! Maybe because Life-Like's license to use to C&O paint and name expired and Walthers doesn't want to renew it? Maybe it's a coincidence?
Also, the transition era used to be the most popular era, because that's what everyone remembered from their childhood. With the older modelers dying off and younger modelers being added to the hobby (myself included) the most common era is slowly moving forward in time. The transition era is still very popular, no doubt, but it doesn't have the same prominence in the hobby that it used to.
One AB set left. Better hurry!http://www.modeltrainstuff.com/product_p/920-47621.htm
Your correct though, there WAS a lot more available a couple years ago.
Why does Walthers hate the C&O so much?
I always say the same thing....except insert NKP...
You must have a vivid imagination. I have never seen any indication that Walther's HATES C & O. Walther's is only a distributor.
Rich
If you ever fall over in public, pick yourself up and say “sorry it’s been a while since I inhabited a body.” And just walk away.
richg1998You must have a vivid imagination. I have never seen any indication that Walther's HATES C & O. Walther's is only a distributor.
Walthers produces the Proto 2000 lineup, and they killed just about all C&O motive output. C&O was in abundance when Life Like produced Proto 2000.
Possible explanations:1. In 1948, to help promote it's new proposed train "The Chessie" the C&O used a real cat to represent Chessie the Railroad Kitten in public relations events, like a national tour of the new equipment. Grandpa Bill brought little Phil Walthers to see the train when it was in Chicago on display, and Chessie went berserk and mauled Phil, leading to a lifetime hatred of cats and the Chessie.
2. 2008 was the year of the rat in the Chinese calendar, and superstitious Chinese workers refused to make C&O products when they heard the railroad's mascot was a cat, since honoring a cat might offend the rat. Now that we're in the year of the ox, production should resume per usual.
Personally I want to know why Walthers hates the Minneapolis Northfield and Southern, they owned an FM H-10-44 and Walthers hasn't issued their new FM model in MNS colors yet !!
wjstixPossible explanations:1. In 1948, to help promote it's new proposed train "The Chessie" the C&O used a real cat to represent Chessie the Railroad Kitten in public relations events, like a national tour of the new equipment. Grandpa Bill brought little Phil Walthers to see the train when it was in Chicago on display, and Chessie went berserk and mauled Phil, leading to a lifetime hatred of cats and the Chessie. 2. 2008 was the year of the rat in the Chinese calendar, and superstitious Chinese workers refused to make C&O products when they heard the railroad's mascot was a cat, since honoring a cat might offend the rat. Now that we're in the year of the ox, production should resume per usual. Personally I want to know why Walthers hates the Minneapolis Northfield and Southern, they owned an FM H-10-44 and Walthers hasn't issued their new FM model in MNS colors yet !!
Not to sound like a wiseguy, but has anybody bothered to contact Walthers about producing (or re-issuing) C&O product?
We can sit out here and trade opinions and uninformed guesses forever, and still be no closer to the truth than phlogiston chemists.
As for me, when Walthers makes 1960s Japanese prototype models available in 1:80 scale, I'll cheer - if my heart survives the shock.
Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964)
Oh, please. Gimme a break. Like Walthers "hates" any railroad.
I could opine that Walthers hates the New Haven, too. When Proto was LL, they made all kinds of NH items: 3 runs of PA's, 2 runs of RS-2's, 2 runs of DL109's, 1 run of GP9's, 1 run of FA's, 1 run of S-1's, 2 runs of 0-8-0's, and 3 runs of RDC's. Since Walthers took over, I don't think there's been any NH models made in the Proto line.
Walthers has avoided making NH stainless steel passenger cars, even the sleepers that other railroads had (corrigated P-S 14-4's and 6-4-6's). Now they have all but confirmed that they aren't going to make individual cars anymore, just cars for train sets like the 20th Century Limited, etc.
Walthers also makes all kinds of Troop Sleeper conversions. The NH had them, too. Does Walthers make them in NH? Noooo.
How about the Walthers doodlebugs? Why did they choose the relatively rare EMC doodlebug instead of the far more popular Brill 250 (of which the NH had some)?
Of the Walthers heavyweight passenger cars, only the 28-1 Parlor is correct for the NH (and the roof is on backwards). Naturally, the NH only used them for about 5 years as Parlors as they got them secondhand to convert them to coaches.
Think about it. The NH was the No. 3 railroad in the USA in passengers carried, yet the only passenger cars made by Walthers for the NH that are accurate are ones that can only be used for very limited time period.
Obviously, Walthers hates the New Haven even more than they hate the C&O...
Or not.
Paul A. Cutler III*******************Weather Or No Go New Haven*******************
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Any argument carried far enough will end up in Semantics--Hartz's law of rhetoric Emerald. Leemer and Southern The route of the Sceptre Express Barry
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Tjsingle Phaha, thats great number 2. Well I've noticed not a large quanity of conrail items, new gp15-1's are nice but why cant they be proto 2000 with sound and extra details?!
Because people would probably complain about the price and want a different sound system.
I like the theory of Chessie going ballistic!!
just looked at the walthers site on locos C&O, sold out sold out sold out, no orders to select...
but the NKP stuff was sold out too. Maybe its a delivery thing, waiting for another run to come in from China....
Paul3Obviously, Walthers hates the New Haven even more than they hate the C&O...
Maybe tomiakawa (Chuck) is right. Maybe we should ask Walthers what's up and beg for a rerun.
It just doesn't make any sense though for Walthers to discontinue a very popular road name (including the New Haven)
dinwittywaiting for another run to come in from China....
I have been waiting for reruns on the C&O 0-8-0 for several years now. :-(
It may be just a coincidence, but Walthers (and Kalmbach) is located in Milwaukee, WI. This might explain the preponderance of local area products (and editorial matter). It has to be a lot less expensive and less time consuming to research prototypes in their own back yard than to travel all the way to New England to research the New Haven RR. Where is that, anyway?
In order to make a profit, all businesses must offer goods and services that can be sold to a broad enough customer base to offset preproduction expense. If there is little demand, there will be no product availability. It just may be that there are a lot more UP,SP, ATSF, PRR and NYC modelers than those following the C&O.
I could say they hate the BN:
1. They missed a chance doing BN F-units (take the GNs and paint them in BN, don't know if I could do that with the undec version)
2. GP20 wasn't painted right (green walkways)
3. U28B didn't have a mars light like the prototype (same for the CB&Qs)
4. They never made BN E-units, in either version (Stainless or Green). (Rivarossi or Model power make them, but they aren't good models) but they made BN green passenger cars, but not the stainless ones. (the stainless was ex-CB&Q, GNs ended up being Green)
5. They haven't done any BN engines since the GP20s.
6. GP9 had black handrails
7. Didn't do a GP30 with sound in BN (I gutted an SPSF unit for the sound guts)
I really don't know, I just came up with those off the top of my head.
Vincent
Wants: 1. high-quality, sound equipped, SD40-2s, C636s, C30-7s, and F-units in BN. As for ones that don't cost an arm and a leg, that's out of the question....
2. An end to the limited-production and other crap that makes models harder to get and more expensive.
BigRusty,Well, the New Haven is short for The New York, New Haven & Hartford Railroad Co., and connected one of the largest cities in the world with three state capitals (Hartford, Providence and Boston) through some of the most densly populated areas in the USA. The New Haven was based out of the City of New Haven, CT, and the NH's mainline route (the Shoreline) followed the Connecticut coast from NYC into Rhode Island, then cut across to Providence before going straight to Boston.
Fortunately for Walthers, the New Haven Railroad Historical & Technical Association is more than willing to provide them with any prototype information they want. They don't have to drive to New England from Milwaukee to get information.I agree with the thought that manufacturers have to chase the dollar, and really the NH was actually a small road (30th in size amongst US RR's) with about 2000 route miles at it's peak, and the longest freight run was less than 250 miles (Boston to Maybrook, NY). That being said, that really doesn't matter. What matters is how many people model it. Because the NH went through so many population centers, there are probably more people in the NH's area of influence than many larger roads.
But really, I don't think Walthers "hates" any road. They know their business a lot better than I do.
TrainManTyMaybe because Life-Like's license to use to C&O paint and name expired and Walthers doesn't want to renew it?
If that were the case, then they wouldn't be making B&O paint schemes. These fall under the CSX license tradmark (CSX, Chessie, C&O, B&O, and WM)
I believe I have two possible explanations for the series of non-productions:(This is tonuge in cheek guys so ne emails ok!)
1) The factories that produced all these mentioned models were in the area affected by the Olympic Games and had to be demolished in order to construct the buildings to house the venues. Now that the olympic games are finished they can begin to rebuild their plants and start production of the models again.
Or,
2) The children that work in the sweatshops organized and went on strike, thus preventing anyhting from being produced in those factories that were making your wanted models/decals, etc!!!
Take your pick... I still think the cat got Walthers way back when!!! LOL
Just my $.02
Sam
May He bless you, guide you, and keep you safe on your journey through life!
I Model the New Hope & Ivyland RR (Bucks County, PA)
Maybe because CSX is charging for the rights to use any of their logos, past, present, or future.
THINK FLOQUIL!; THINK PAASCHE!; THINK MICROSCALE!
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cacoleMaybe because CSX is charging for the rights to use any of their logos, past, present, or future.
Doubt that as well, as there is a plethora of B&O stuff which would fall under the same license.
I'd like to see more Pennsylvania equipment and Nickel Plate equipment, not just C&O.
TheK4Kid
If you think that Walther hates the NH, C&O,etc. let me add N&W to the list.
My son and I are modeling N&W from the mid 40's to about the early 70's with a twist on history and we can't find much of anything (passenger cars, freight cars, engines in steam or diesel). If we want NS there seems to be a small supply.
In case you're wondering about the twist on history N&W "never" merged with other roads and the "Western" means they went west (LA, etc.) not just to Ohio or IL.
Its our road and we can do it!!
MacdonaldRB (Mac)
MacdonaldRBIf you think that Walther hates the NH, C&O,etc. let me add N&W to the list.
Was N&W originally produced by Lifelike, then dropped when Walthers took over? The NKP, and C&O were.
BTW: I'm not trying to beat up Walthers. I love most of their stuff. I must have put down a rather obscene amount of money on engines, kits, rolling stock, and supplies in the last 5 years. But I'm truely baffled why there is a lack of C&O stuff.
Paul3Oh, please. Gimme a break. Like Walthers "hates" any railroad. I could opine that Walthers hates the New Haven, too.
I could opine that Walthers hates the New Haven, too.
I'm convinced that they hate my freelanced railroad as well as the C&O. Just because it's freelanced and I'm the only person in the world modeling it doesn't mean they should discriminate against me!!
TrainManTyI'm convinced that they hate my freelanced railroad as well as the C&O. Just because it's freelanced and I'm the only person in the world modeling it doesn't mean they should discriminate against me!!
Always better to be a smart <donkey> than a dumb bunny.
(Replace donkey with a syn. for donkey..begins with an "a" and has 3 letters.)
I have another plausible explanation:
I have noticed quite a lot of "Painted & Un-lettered" equipment on the market... Could it be that Walthers is now making a lot of this and leaving it up to us, the modellers, to add our own decals and such information as we deem necessary? This way we don't have to waste time removing unwanted decals, and they save money not having to buy and install said decals?
What with the plethora of decal makers and such advertising in the magazines, we have such possibilities at our fingertips... Just means that you have to do a little bit of work, and most likely a better representation of what you had intended to get to boot!!!