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Last post 02-05-2008 8:54 AM by ChrisNH. 178 replies.
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07-07-2006 4:22 PM In reply to
Offline jbinkley
Not Ranked
Joined on 01-08-2001
US
Posts 3

Angry [:(!] RE: New River Minning Co

After giving this much thought I have decided to move my "prairie skyscrapers" (the ADM grain elevators) to the other side of my layout so as not to detract from the coal mining operations. I bought the New River Mining kit and will add it to the existing mining operation to have two separate sidings for coal mining. The space is perfect for it. I have a question on what structures are folks using to be consumers of the coal, if any ? The Cornerstone Series has a rotary dumper and a power plant. I am not sure about either of these. Also the coal doesn't have to stay on the layout, it can be destined for other parts. What are folks doing? Also does anyone know of good metal die cast coal trucks ? I've seen some half metal and half plastic ones that didn't look too bad.
07-07-2006 8:54 PM In reply to
Offline Budliner
Top 150 Contributor
Joined on 02-15-2004
Boston
Posts 2,240

RE: New River Minning Co

checkout this Blast Furnace w/Stoves


07-07-2006 11:59 PM In reply to
Offline accord1959
Not Ranked
Joined on 07-25-2005
Ottawa, Ontario
Posts 365

RE: New River Minning Co

I got one and am soon going to buy a Glacier Gravel kit to combine with it.
07-08-2006 2:46 AM In reply to
Offline jbinkley
Not Ranked
Joined on 01-08-2001
US
Posts 3

Angry [:(!] RE: New River Minning Co

The blast furnace is an interesting thought but probably too large for the space I have and it looks like Walthers is retiring it.

07-30-2006 9:00 AM In reply to
Offline jbinkley60
Top 200 Contributor
Joined on 02-20-2006
Gahanna, Ohio
Posts 1,813

Re: RE: New River Minning Co

I finally finished putting together my New River Mining kit but have a question which has plagued me on other kits.  How do you get the decals onto the kit ?  I've has similar problems with Atlas kits.  I've determined that you don't scrape them off the paper. Do you use water or something else to float them off the paper ?  I noticed only 1 or 2 of you that posted pictues had any types of labeling or markings on your finished kits.

 

07-30-2006 11:27 AM In reply to
Offline CSXFan
Not Ranked
Joined on 03-20-2006
Holland MI
Posts 624

Re: RE: New River Minning Co

It should say right in the directions, most likely on the bottom of the back page. I have the Cornerstone ADM grain elevator and this is what it says about decaling.

"1. After cutting out the decal, dip in water for 10 seconds, remove and let stand for 1 minute. Slide decal onto surface, position and then blot off any excess water."

 "2. Lightly brush on Micro Sol on top. This will soften the decal allowing it to conform to irregular surfaces. DO NOT TOUCH DECAL while wet!"

 "3. When the decal is thoroughly dry, check for any trapped air bubbles. Poke them with the point of a small pin or hobby knife blade and apply more Micro Sol."

Good luck.


07-30-2006 1:51 PM In reply to
Offline jbinkley60
Top 200 Contributor
Joined on 02-20-2006
Gahanna, Ohio
Posts 1,813

Re: RE: New River Minning Co

Thanks, I'll pickup some Micro Sol.  Ironically I have the Cornerstone Grain Elevator kit too (still in the box) and I checked, it doesn't have instructions either. 

 

07-30-2006 2:19 PM In reply to
Offline MIKE0659
Not Ranked
Joined on 06-01-2006
New Jersey
Posts 87

New River Mining Co and coal operations.

This is a great thread, as is Ryan's sub-topic. Many of us model coal mining and coal hauling, but there isn't much discussion of how we do so.

First, the New River Mining kit is one of the most kit-bashable structures out there as proven by this thread. We bought several of these kits, Glacier Gravel, and the Walthers flood loader kit (Can't remember the name), as well as a few other kits from other manufacturers to get the pieces and parts to kitbash coal loaders on our railroad.

The first picture is of a loader that Ray built, it still needs an extension to the conveyor, some additional weathering, a few more details, as well as ground stuff (Weeds, loaders, trucks, junk, coal piles, etc.), but you can see it is a part of the New River Mining kit.

The second picture is a loader that is still in the construction phase, but again, you can see the New River Mining kit is the source of the major pieces.

Sorry if the pictures aren't of the best quality, I was walking around, hand-holding the camera - some with flash, some just with the layout lighting.

These are two of the largest loaders on our railroad, there will be one larger that will be almost the foot print of the complete New River Mining kit. There are also several smaller loaders of varying sizes located around the railroad. In total there are 8 coal loaders on line.

As for our coal operations, we have followed the patterns we see in the areas we are modeling. We model a freelance prototype called the Roanoke & Western Railway which is patterned after NS/CSXT and their predecessors. The R&W is envisioned to be roughly the same size as the Clinchfield was, in mileage, equipment and traffic volumes.

Since we don't have a warehouse in which to build our railroad (Just half of a basement.), we decided to model a heavy branch with several smaller sub-divisions and extensions that feed coal to the mainline which is represented by hidden storage. We have chosen to model non-unit train style flood loaders since we don't have the length for unit train flood loaders and it is tough, but not impossible, to model both sides of the loads/empties movement on flood loaders.

What we have done is start our operating session with all of the cars at the mines loaded and shoved through or pulled ahead of the loader. When we swap the loads for the empties, we put the empties on the opposite end of the loaders. Since we run live loads of real coal, it's easy to tell the loads and empties when drilling a loader. It also makes the return trip a little more difficult due to the weight of the loads.

Some of our loaders are served by a single train which comes out to swap 15 empties for 15 loads, one example is the Ranger Turn which serves the Ranger Fuels loadout. With some of the smaller loaders we gather up the empties from several loaders and bring them back to the small, 3-track Clay Yard at Black Creek Junction to be combined with other loads from small area loaders  to be picked up by a  turn from the larger Linwood Yard before heading off the railroad to hidden storage bound for Roanoke.

We always leave enough track on each end of a loader for a loads in/empties out type of operation since this is how the real coal loaders work. We wanted our operators to have the feeling of accomplishing something by spotting those empties at a location on the siding different than where they pulled the loads. The live loads add to this as the train becomes heavier as they make these loads/empties drills, finally needing a pusher to get back up the grade.

We didn't want to force any paired industries just to get that loads/empties cycle, so we didn't model a power plant or other coal consuming operation. We preferred to instead have the loads/empties flow on and off the modeled portion of the railroad. If given enough space, it would have been nice to model either a large coal preparation plant or a coal-fired power plant.

The coal prep plant would have been a big operations booster. The loads from many smaller loaders could have gone there to be cleaned and sized, then shipped back out. This would require yards on both ends for the raw inbound coal and the outbound processed coal on the other end. All this movement of raw and processed coal would require trains to move them around.

To get some feel for coal industry operations you can read two excellent books on the Clinchfield Railroad, the first is Clinchfield Country, by Steve King (Out of print, but you can find copies) and the newer, The Clinchfield Railroad in the Coal Fields, by Robert A. Helm. There are sections in these books that talk about the operations on the Clinchfield and many great pictures of the loaders along the line. Every type of loader you can imagine, from the smallest 1 to 2 car a day, mom and pop loaders to the 100+ a day loaders and the big Moss coal preparation plant.

The other thing you might notice in these books is how much like a model railroad much of the Clinchfield appears. It is often a heavily tree-covered mountainside as a back drop with the tracks right against it, a road, possibly a few houses, and then the othe maountainside on the other side of the narrow valley. Very easily modeled in a narrow space. It was also a very curvy railroad with numerous bridges and tunnels.

Sorry to get off on a tangent about the CRR, but it is a good example of what many of us are trying to model and the books are good references for ides on kitbashing and scratch building loaders.

And finally, a few pictures of our railroad, we only have a small portion scenicked and that isn't finished yet, many details are needed.

 

Above is a set of R&W units backing down the lead to the Potter Coal Company loader to pull their daily production of 3 loads.

 

Above is a set of Clinchfield F-Units with loads on the Martins Creek Extension, coming down grade back to Black Creek Junction and Clay Yard.

 

And this is the same set of R&W power idling away while the Conductor strolls over to the tower to talk to the powers that be.

07-30-2006 3:40 PM In reply to
Offline CSXFan
Not Ranked
Joined on 03-20-2006
Holland MI
Posts 624

Re: RE: New River Minning Co

 jbinkley60 wrote:

Thanks, I'll pickup some Micro Sol.  Ironically I have the Cornerstone Grain Elevator kit too (still in the box) and I checked, it doesn't have instructions either. 

 



Oh, sorry about that, the instructions came from a Walthers plastic pellet transfer kit. For some reason  they were sitting in the ADM grain elevator box. I decaled all my Cornerstone kits this way so it should work.

MIKE0659, Thanks for the great pics! The first shows exactly what I want my coaling operations to look like.
07-30-2006 5:18 PM In reply to
Offline skiloff
Not Ranked
Joined on 07-28-2005
Saskatchewan
Posts 332

Re: RE: New River Minning Co

I made the mistake of looking at this thread.  Now I'll have to find a place to put a coal mine.  I'll be headed to the LHS next week to see if they have it the New River Mining Co. in N scale.  I know they had it in HO last time I was there.
07-30-2006 7:49 PM In reply to
Offline NS2591
Not Ranked
Joined on 06-25-2006
CN Flint Sub(Eastern Michigan)
Posts 511

Re: RE: New River Minning Co

Yeah Thanks alot guys, I wasn't planning on having a coal mine on my layout, but i am now. I'm going to have a big bridge, and a coal mine, a yard, street running, and a fair amount of operations. At the rate i'm going, I'm gonna need a big space!
07-30-2006 8:08 PM In reply to
Offline jbinkley60
Top 200 Contributor
Joined on 02-20-2006
Gahanna, Ohio
Posts 1,813

Re: RE: New River Minning Co

I can think of far worse things to put on a layout.  I have two coal flooders and mines.

 

 

07-31-2006 12:48 AM In reply to
Offline tomikawaTT
Top 25 Contributor
Joined on 02-13-2005
Southwest US
Posts 7,174

Re: RE: New River Minning Co

 jbinkley wrote:
After giving this much thought I have decided to move my "prairie skyscrapers" (the ADM grain elevators) to the other side of my layout so as not to detract from the coal mining operations. I bought the New River Mining kit and will add it to the existing mining operation to have two separate sidings for coal mining. The space is perfect for it. I have a question on what structures are folks using to be consumers of the coal, if any ? The Cornerstone Series has a rotary dumper and a power plant. I am not sure about either of these. Also the coal doesn't have to stay on the layout, it can be destined for other parts. What are folks doing? Also does anyone know of good metal die cast coal trucks ? I've seen some half metal and half plastic ones that didn't look too bad.

Can't speak for the coal trucks, since all the coal at my colliery moves on conveyor belts.  As for where the outbound coal goes, on my layout I load out unit trains (run to down staging after interchanging with the local Class I and a motive power change from tank steam to catenary motors) and loose cars, both hoppers and drop-side gons.  Loose cars are distributed by waybill, but all of them run to the interchange point at Tomikawa.  There they may leave with originating local freights, either up or down, be cut into through freights (ditto) or delivered locally (JNR coal dock, KMT coal dock, local coal dealer's yard.)  Except for those which never leave Tomikawa, all loaded cars eventually end up in down staging, where they are emptied before being returned to the mine.

I've been operating this scheme bare rail on plywood for, literally, decades.  Now I've acquired the New River kit to kitbash into something resembling the prototype crusher-sorter that I photographed near Fukuoka almost half a century ago (time flies when you're having fun!)  After carefully examining my photos, I may need to get the Glacier Gravel kit as well - some of those conveyors ran a looong way, and there are a lot of other structures to model.

Proposed modifications to the kit as designed include an automated loader for loose cars and lots of lights for night operations.  I've designed an "elegant solution" to the empties in-loads out idea for the unit trains.  Now all I have to do is build it and see if it really works!

Chuck  (modeling Japan in 1964, where trains run up and down, even on the level)

07-31-2006 8:15 PM In reply to
Offline jbinkley60
Top 200 Contributor
Joined on 02-20-2006
Gahanna, Ohio
Posts 1,813

Re: RE: New River Minning Co

Ok, at long last I finished the kit.  Here are some pictures with both coal loaders.


No weathering yet.  I am still contemplating it.

 

08-01-2006 1:02 AM In reply to
Offline Safety Valve
Top 75 Contributor
Joined on 01-14-2006
Posts 3,717

Re: RE: New River Minning Co

Very nice mine.

I am working on the ADM Elevator.

I used pernament marker on the window panes. One or two are blocked out.

I took a box with a cover, dumped the windows into it; added Braxton Mills powder to simulate grain dust. Shook the box with the lid on until the windows were done.

I also have the mine, at this time I cannot decide what to paint it.

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