Steam & Preservation

The IRM CNW SD40-2 got me thinking. What locomotive models in general use in the 1980 to date belong in some future museum collection. My criteria is that they have to be successful and/or significant. Here's my short list:

SD60 - EMD's first microprocessor based control system and 710 engine

SD70MAC - first successful AC production locomotive

C32-8 - first of the Dash8s. Not very successful, but ground breaking in a lot of ways. 

Dash8-40CW (or C40-8W) - the locomotive that allowed GE to pass EMD

AC4400 - GE's breakthrough AC locomotive

AEM7 - "GG1, the next generation"

F40PH - The successful,modern passenger locomotive of the 1980s (and most of the 1990s)

GP40 commuter locomotive conversion - an example of how the growth in commuter rail obtained motive power on a budget. 

on the bubble:

SD80MAC - only if 6000 HP ACs ever come to prominence.  This was the progenitor.  High HP, AC traction, radial trucks, DP equipped.

P42 - not as widespread as the F40PH, but pretty successful

ES44 AC and DC - GEVO engine is significant and DP, otherwise not much different from Dash8/AC4400

Acela - only if any of the current plans come to fruition

Cascade F59 and Talgo set - ditto

Other things worth saving:

an Amfleet coach

a Superliner sleeper

a PS/Bombardier coach (actually, an ex-EL/NJDOT would be the best, here)

an LIRR/MTA/CDOT MU married pair (M1, M2)

A spine intermodal car (ATSF "fuel foiler" would be good, plus a more recent 53' TTAX)

A stack/well car (how about the original Gundeson 40fters plus a current 3 well "universal" car)

A Bethgon

An aluminum rapid discharge unit train hopper

A RoadRailer (Mark V?)

 

Some additions to the list:

The first generation rapid transit cars from Washington DC, Baltimore, Atlanta, etc.

The "lozenge" commuter car, originally used in Toronto.

Modern tank cars of various sizes and shapes, to go along with the vintage tank cars at IRM.

CTA L cars of the 1970s and 1980s will end up in museum collections. 

Likewise Metra F40PH units.   Though the Metra F40PH may remain in service as long as the E and F units they replaced.

 Calif St RR museum already has an Amtrak F40PH.

Let's face it - everything has the potential to become museum fodder.  Nobody was thinking of the FT or the RS-1 in terms of museum fodder when those locomotives first hit the road. 

Odds are that locomotives with a notable history will have higher value - witness GN400 - significant because it was the first production SD-45.  Long after most other SD-45s have been retired and scrapped, it's probably assured a comfy home somewhere.

SD70's and ES44's may be legion today, but some years from now folks will be visiting examples of them in  museums...

tree68:

Let's face it - everything has the potential to become museum fodder.  Nobody was thinking of the FT or the RS-1 in terms of museum fodder when those locomotives first hit the road. 

 

Nor when they were being retired or scrapped.  Thank goodness a handful of some do exist...but there are no Trainmasters, for instance.  One of a kind or sparsley available units have to be considered all the time.  It is up to the railfan community, the railroads, and the manufacturers to work together to spot and make avaiable the units and the rescources to make it happen.

The PRR did a reasonable job of saving samples of the best of their successful steam locomotives. They let the odd-balls and one-offs go to scrap. But, I think that sometimes demos should be saved. You could make a good case for Timken 1111, I think. Too bad it got away. Or, Lima A1, the first of the famous Berkshires. But, exactly how important is the Baldwin monster in the Franklin Institute? They got it 'cause the price was right! But is it just taking up space that could have gone to a PRR T1 or P5 box cab? I think we can see the current fleet well enough to know some of what's really working and what's not, what's a significant advance in technology and what's not. That's why I thought it would be interesting to speculate.

cbq9911a:

The "lozenge" commuter car, originally used in Toronto.

Modern tank cars of various sizes and shapes, to go along with the vintage tank cars at IRM.

Good ones!

henry6: Canadian Pacific H24-66 Train Master #8905 is preserved at the Canadian Railway Museum in Quebec. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FM_H-24-66 .

Ed

henry6:

tree68:

Let's face it - everything has the potential to become museum fodder.  Nobody was thinking of the FT or the RS-1 in terms of museum fodder when those locomotives first hit the road. 

 

Nor when they were being retired or scrapped.  Thank goodness a handful of some do exist...but there are no Trainmasters, for instance.  One of a kind or sparsley available units have to be considered all the time.  It is up to the railfan community, the railroads, and the manufacturers to work together to spot and make avaiable the units and the rescources to make it happen.

The preservation foresight that IRM has (that our forebears also had)  is exceptional and will pay dividends that future generations will appreciate..I still can't believe that a PRR Baldwin Centipede or Jawn Henry wasn't preserved..whatever happened to the coal powered diesel the  Department of Energy funded? I suppose my point is that I cant help but notice as a comment that how many "prosaic" examples of steam power like lowly switchers got preserved and the modern marvels , or "one -offs" like the ill fated SP hydraulics were consigned to the torch..I was really impressed by the UP turbines at IRM..so many examples and so little time...at least that's the way it is in hindsight..the commonplace becomes a rarity and the rarities become extinct.

What seems ironic is the exceptions to the commonplace become disproportionally the object of more attention than the "every day" examples..is it simply because there are no examples preserved?

 

Conspicuous by their absence in the suggestions so far are covered hoppers (several kinds) and bulkhead flatcars and centerbeams.  Remember when there were open autoracks, before the sides and then the roofs were added? Coil cars are another distinctive type.

In the distant past, a diesel that got away was the Alco DL109. I understand a long-retired example survived on the New Haven until about 1970.  If the hulk had lasted a few more years I am sure it would have survived.  But at the time a much smaller preservation movement was still very much focused on the steam era, with diesels viewed as a very unwelcome villain.

This thread helps to remind us that history continues to evolve, with preservation being a work in progress.  The challenge is that as more and more equipment passes from railroad service into preservation it becomes harder to find the funds, space and manpower to manage the growing collections.  Co-ordination between the many organizations is needed to ensure that representative examples of important types are preserved.  Otherwise the risk is that every collection has an example of car "A" while types "B" and "C", equally important, disappear.  Oddballs are in many ways a luxury, but can have real value as a visitor attraction.  And certain ones do indeed have very valid justification for entering preservation.

John

There are F40's at the Tennessee Central Railroad Museum (AMTK 258) and the North Carolina Transportation Museum.  Many are still running on commuter lines so many will likely survive long enough like the E and F units before them to be preserved.  One would expect that the P42 would similarly survive - since they are getting up there in age, it may not even be that far off. 

 After the CR merger, NS gave some recent CR EMD unit (an SD70MAC or SD80MAC, I believe because it had the paint scheme used only on those locomotives) to the Virginia Museum of Transportation - it was off site at an NS yard last time I was out there.

 

A gutted and scrubbed SD-45 (nee Santa Fe?), painted in "Big Sky Blue" and numbered Great Northern 411, recently arrived at the Isaac Walton Inn in Essex, MT.  It was lifted onto a special track, by Hulcher, a couple of weeks ago and is being outfitted for guests at the inn.  It will rent for $299 / night, with all amenities, last I heard.  Skylights and a picture-window, looking out on the BNSF main, will be included.

cx500:

 

Conspicuous by their absence in the suggestions so far are covered hoppers (several kinds) and bulkhead flatcars and centerbeams.  Remember when there were open autoracks, before the sides and then the roofs were added? Coil cars are another distinctive type.

In the distant past, a diesel that got away was the Alco DL109. I understand a long-retired example survived on the New Haven until about 1970.  If the hulk had lasted a few more years I am sure it would have survived.  But at the time a much smaller preservation movement was still very much focused on the steam era, with diesels viewed as a very unwelcome villain.

This thread helps to remind us that history continues to evolve, with preservation being a work in progress.  The challenge is that as more and more equipment passes from railroad service into preservation it becomes harder to find the funds, space and manpower to manage the growing collections.  Co-ordination between the many organizations is needed to ensure that representative examples of important types are preserved.  Otherwise the risk is that every collection has an example of car "A" while types "B" and "C", equally important, disappear.  Oddballs are in many ways a luxury, but can have real value as a visitor attraction.  And certain ones do indeed have very valid justification for entering preservation.

John

I thought CRIP #621 (Christine) survived along with another E-6 and an E-8 (modified/mongrelized, but still a DL-109)

BNSFwatcher:

A gutted and scrubbed SD-45 (nee Santa Fe?), painted in "Big Sky Blue" and numbered Great Northern 411, recently arrived at the Isaac Walton Inn in Essex, MT.  It was lifted onto a special track, by Hulcher, a couple of weeks ago and is being outfitted for guests at the inn.  It will rent for $299 / night, with all amenities, last I heard.  Skylights and a picture-window, looking out on the BNSF main, will be included.

This unit is an F45.

How about one of the 3 remaining sd60mac's?