Football Season is Upon Us

Yep - Ms Mook's UN-Lincoln was mentioned on Sirius-XM this morning.  When the stadium is full, it's like the fourth largest "city" in Nebraska...

Don't think they use any rail to get them there, though.

GO BLUE!  (I sure hope we win more than 3 games this year)

OK - how about a review of our favorite college football teams and the railroads that served them (when they travelled by train)?

Even though I never attended school there (not that I didn't want to), I've been a Wolverine my whole life.  I know Michigan had and still has the Ann Arbor Railroad going through their campus and they likely used it as a connection to start their road trips.

Anyone else? 

We are right up there with the "most rabid" fans in the nation. 

Since our stadium is just a smidge east of the BNSF and our depot, we still have some people come in on Amtrak.  And if you are very lucky and get to sit in a skybox (only once for me) you can watch the BNSF main line go in and out of Lincoln.  That is if you can take your eyes of the Huskers! 

It's not a perfect world, but darn close to it - even if only for a short time.

Mook

  The M.P had an industrial lead that ran by Memorial Stadium in Lincoln Nebr many years ago but it taken up in the late 80s I think GO BIG RED, HUSKERS, I am just a Nebraskan living in Iowa Larry 

WIAR

OK - how about a review of our favorite college football teams and the railroads that served them (when they travelled by train)?

I'm sure Syracuse travelled by train back in the day, and probably most often by NYC, although Lackawanna (now NYS&W) ran right by the campus.  May have depended on where they were going.

NYS&W ran shuttles for a number of years between the SU campus, downtown Syracuse, and Carousel Mall (plenty of parking - something in short supply on University Hill) using RDC's.  That service hasn't been run for several years now.

Even though I'm a U of Iowa alum my allegiance is with UCLA (GO BRUINS!!!).

The former Rock Island used to have special passenger excursions stop close to Kinnick Stadium as there still are (I think anyway) steps that lead down to the mainline tracks not far from Kinnick.  That would have been cool to have seen.

Los Angeles Rams Guy

Even though I'm a U of Iowa alum my allegiance is with UCLA (GO BRUINS!!!).

The former Rock Island used to have special passenger excursions stop close to Kinnick Stadium as there still are (I think anyway) steps that lead down to the mainline tracks not far from Kinnick.  That would have been cool to have seen.

At one time there was a track there for the football trains.  It was called, of course, the Stadium track.

Jeff 

jeffhergert

Los Angeles Rams Guy

Even though I'm a U of Iowa alum my allegiance is with UCLA (GO BRUINS!!!).

The former Rock Island used to have special passenger excursions stop close to Kinnick Stadium as there still are (I think anyway) steps that lead down to the mainline tracks not far from Kinnick.  That would have been cool to have seen.

At one time there was a track there for the football trains.  It was called, of course, the Stadium track.

Jeff 

Love this time of the year!  The wife and I may consider riding the Hawkeye Express for the Iowa/Michigan game in October.  Go Hawks!

Larry:  The MO-PAC is now the MO-PAC trail and the Rock Island that cut diagonally across the city is now a trail.  I liked them better when they were railroads! 

And just to keep you informed of home news - last nite, someone on his 3rd DWI, drove into the lagoon near the diesel shop in the BNSF yards.  Glub!

Go Buckeyes!!!

they are going to wish they had rail service with all the construction going on in Columbus right now.I do have a favorite story about football and trains.Its from Trains magazine awhile back about how the Notre Dame band traveled and how they stuck it to the NYC."how we brought the NYC to its knees" was the title.They ended up taking the Grand Trunk to new york.Its still a lesson that some should learn today.(don't mess with bandies!!!)

stay safe

joe

I was a graduate student in Columbia University's engineering school in the early 1950's. One of the things I used to enjoy when I went to Columbia University's home football games, aside from an occassonal Columbia TD and win, was the parade of New York Central's passenger trains across the Harlem River from Columbia's Baker Field. The south side stands were the home team' s seats which gave me the view (or distraction?) of the passing New York Central passenger trains, but unfortunately cameras were not allowed in the stadium. 

 Iowa Conference Winner - Cornell College, Mt. Vernon, IA

Union Pacific (C&NW) Chicago, Omaha main line is within visitors bleachers spitball distance of the twin tracks. In recent years, more trains sometimes pass during a game than home team points on the score board.

GO POKES!!!!!  They better be ready when Texas comes to town on the 12th of September, win or lose, it is probably the biggest game in UW History......  We prefer a win though...... Oh, and the Cowboys rode the UP line from Laramie.

Los Angeles Rams Guy

Even though I'm a U of Iowa alum my allegiance is with UCLA (GO BRUINS!!!).

Traitor. 

The former Rock Island used to have special passenger excursions stop close to Kinnick Stadium as there still are (I think anyway) steps that lead down to the mainline tracks not far from Kinnick.  That would have been cool to have seen.

Yep, they're still there- the Hawkeye Express uses 'em.

 Back in 1980, my freshman year at the University of Georgia, fans could still sit on the Southern Railway tracks, ex C of Ga, to watch the football games. The tracks were located on a fill just outside the east end of the stadium. The fans would bring sofas and chairs from their homes starting on Friday afternoon, then camp out on the tracks and fill so that they could view the home game on Saturday afternoon. Southern would usually cooperate by annulling any trains during this time on the branch.

Older college football fans will know why this tradition ended. 1980 was also the freshman year of Herschel Walker. By the start of the '81 season, the University of Georgia was well on the way to horseshoeing in the stadium by building seats in the east end of the stadium. Also, lights for night games were added. The network, I believe ABC, paid for most of the light installation so that Georgia games could be played and televised at night.

That stadium has changed more in the last 25 years than it did in the first 70 plus years.

Jay

Way back when in 1970-1974, when I attended Northern Illinois, you could see trains passing on the C&NW Omaha main from the higher seats in the Stadium.

garr

 Back in 1980, my freshman year at the University of Georgia, fans could still sit on the Southern Railway tracks, ex C of Ga, to watch the football games. The tracks were located on a fill just outside the east end of the stadium. The fans would bring sofas and chairs from their homes starting on Friday afternoon, then camp out on the tracks and fill so that they could view the home game on Saturday afternoon. Southern would usually cooperate by annulling any trains during this time on the branch.

From what I heard from 1950s to late 1970 Cof G, Sou, ACL (over Ga and  Cof G), SAL: would schedule charter trains to Athens and the fans who couldn't get a ticket would watch the game from one train parked on that track or on the hillside - quite a party.

blue streak 1

From what I heard from 1950s to late 1970 Cof G, Sou, ACL (over Ga and  Cof G), SAL: would schedule charter trains to Athens and the fans who couldn't get a ticket would watch the game from one train parked on that track or on the hillside - quite a party.

Blue Streak,

It wouldn't surprise me! I have only seen photos of the special trains to the University of Georgia games, can't remember where, but more than likely in Forest Beckums collection of photos. I guess the trains usually parked north of the stadium near the little depot between the stadium and town.

I started going to Georgia games around '72 when I was ten years old and went to one or two a year until starting school there in '80. I never saw a train during the game but I did see around 300-400 people crowded on the tracks. By the end of the game I don't believe the people on the tracks could see the stadium though!

Jay

garr

I started going to Georgia games around '72 when I was ten years old and went to one or two a year until starting school there in '80. I never saw a train during the game but I did see around 300-400 people crowded on the tracks. By the end of the game I don't believe the people on the tracks could see the stadium though!

Jay

Reason no trains ------ by that time AMTRAK so all the RRs except SOU had shut down any passenger charters. They continued charters after AMTRAK but don't know if they went to Athens ---  would have had to come by way of lula unless they could have used Cof G.

When I was in high school,one of our rival schools stadiums was located about a block from what was then Santa Fe's 3rd district.One could see trains from the stadium.During one game,whenever a train went by,the rival team scored a touchdown.  There were a lot of trains that night. I was torn between being glad to see so many trains,or hoping there would be no more trains so there would be no more TDs by the rival team.

espeefoamer

When I was in high school,one of our rival schools stadiums was located about a block from what was then Santa Fe's 3rd district.One could see trains from the stadium.During one game,whenever a train went by,the rival team scored a touchdown.  There were a lot of trains that night. I was torn between being glad to see so many trains,or hoping there would be no more trains so there would be no more TDs by the rival team.

Whenever we go to a restaurant by the tracks or city concert/festival at the Kennesaw depot, I always rate the trip based on the number of trains seen. 5+ train rating used to be common. Now I am lucky if it goes as high as 2.

Jay

JoeKoh

Go Buckeyes!!!

they are going to wish they had rail service with all the construction going on in Columbus right now.I do have a favorite story about football and trains.Its from Trains magazine awhile back about how the Notre Dame band traveled and how they stuck it to the NYC."how we brought the NYC to its knees" was the title.They ended up taking the Grand Trunk to new york.Its still a lesson that some should learn today.(don't mess with bandies!!!)

stay safe

joe

By Joseph MacDonald

During the years 1932-36, I played in the Notre Dame University band, using a trombone I had bought with my earnings as a messenger in the offices of the Central Vermont Railway. The band made two trips to away football games each year; these were medium-length trips, to Cleveland or Pittsburgh or Chicago. We wanted badly to go to New York for the Army game in Yankee Stadium, and in fall 1935 we finally accumulated enough money to go, provided we could get a low enough train fare. It was my senior year, and my last chance.

I was vice president of the band, and was delegated to negotiate for a reduced fare with the railroads serving South Bend, Ind. My first stop was the ticket window of the New York Central, where I asked to see a passenger agent. A haughty man came to the window: "What can I do for you, son?"

"I'd like to inquire about a special low fare for the Notre Dame band to go to New York City weekend after next."

"We have no special fares," he replied.

"But it's for the Notre Dame band," I said.

"I don't care who you are."

"But there are 100 of us."

"I don't care how many of you there are," he said. "We have no special fares. The fare is twice the one-way fare less 10 percent, $64 round trip, coach. And if you want to go, you'd better tell us which train you want to go on, so we can put a couple of extra coaches on for you."

"But why don't you have special fares?"

"Why should we?" he said. "We have the only railroad here."

"You do not have the only railroad here," I reminded him.

"Well, if you want to take the Pennsy's branch train down to Plymouth, and stand on the platform for a couple of hours, and crowd into their train, you're welcome to do so. And if you want to take the Grand Trunk Western here, and take a couple of days to get there, you're welcome to do that. But we have 17 trains a day to New York, and so far as we're concerned, we have the only service here."

I stepped next door to the GTW ticket window, and asked for a passenger agent. I told this man I wanted to inquire about a special low fare for the Notre Dame band to New York. He said, "Come on in."

Inside the office, he asked, "Now, what's this all about?" I told him, including what the New York Central had said about the GTW.

"Oh they did, did they?" he said. "We've always had trouble with the New York Central. We paid half the cost of the track elevation and of this station in South Bend. The name of the station is Union Station, but they persist in calling it New York Central Station. We've tried for years to offer group rates for students, but they've blocked us every time. Now you're looking for a special fare to New York; how would a cent a mile suit you, say, $18 round trip?"

We didn't have $6400 for the NYC, but we did have $1800. So I said, "That's just what we're looking for."

"Well," the GTW agent said, "that's what we would like to offer you. As far as the Grand Trunk Western is concerned, that's what we would be willing to take you to New York and back for. But I don't want to get your hopes up. In order to give an $18 fare, we would have to file a special tariff with the Interstate Commerce Commission. If nobody objects, it will go through. But, if anyone objects, like the New York Central, then the ICC will have a hearing sometime next spring. But to show you that we want to do it, we'll file and see what happens."

The next day, he called me and said that he had told the Pennsy and the NYC about the plan to file a special tariff. The Pennsy had said they didn't care one way or the other. The NYC said they would object. But the GTW went ahead and filed anyway, to show good intentions. But, he said, with the NYC objecting there was no hope of the rate going through.

Well, we in the band were mighty unhappy over the NYC's attitude. If they didn't want to carry us at a reduced rate, that was their business; but we resented having our New York trip prevented by the NYC interfering with the Grand Trunk's special rate.

So we went to the school's authorities, and obtained permission to put some pressure on the New York Central.

In those days, Notre Dame did not allow its students to go away on weekends without parental permission. But each year, one official trip was sponsored to an away football game, on which all students could go without needing special permission. This year, 1935, the trip was to Columbus, Ohio, for the Ohio State game.

For this official student trip to Columbus, a special train had been arranged with the NYC, to load at the campus's powerhouse siding, running past St. Mary's College down to South Bend, then on to Columbus. At Columbus, NYC had trackage rights over Chesapeake & Ohio past the Ohio State stadium, so the Central could deliver us right to the stadium. One thousand students had signed up for the trip; New York Central's regular fare of about $10 was being charged.

I went down to the Pennsylvania Railroad ticket office in South Bend (the railroad had branchline service from South Bend to Plymouth and Logansport, on the old Vandalia route). I asked the agent how he would like to have 1000 passengers for his Saturday morning train to Logansport, to change there to the Pennsy's Chicago-Columbus train.

"Well, we would sure like to have 1000 passengers," he said, "But we would also like to have some notice, since we have only two coaches on that branch train."

I told him to make the arrangements, and that we would confirm the matter to him officially. We then notified the NYC that we were canceling the special train.

Now, the PRR didn't have tracks up to the Notre Dame campus. So we arranged for 20 streetcars to be at the campus at 6 a.m. Saturday. We piled on, and the streetcars went elephant-parade-style down to a point about a block from the PRR station. There, the Pennsy had a special train waiting for us, which they ran straight through to Columbus. Since the PRR didn't have trackage rights past the stadium at Columbus, we paraded 2 miles to the stadium.

That was the year of the "Big Game." Our team was completely baffled by Ohio State's "razzle-dazzle" offense, which resembled a basketball game on the field; Notre Dame tackled everyone but the player with the ball, and Ohio State was ahead 13-0 in a few minutes.

In the second half, Notre Dame came back, scoring a touchdown in the last minutes of the third quarter, but missing the extra point to keep it at 13-6. We got another touchdown with three minutes to play in the fourth quarter, but again missed the extra point--13-12. Then, with 30 seconds left to play, Bill Shakespeare threw a 45-yard pass to Wayne Miller in the end zone to make it 18-13. Ohio State's fans were stunned; not a person moved in the stands for 20 minutes.

Meanwhile, we collected the iron-pipe goal posts and paraded victoriously the 2 miles back to the station. En route, we stopped at a service station and had the goal posts cut into smaller pieces, and we put the pieces on the tender of the Pennsy's engines to transport them back to South Bend.

Monday, I got a call from the Grand Trunk Western passenger agent. He had just had a visit from the New York Central passenger agent, who had wanted to know if the GTW was still interested in the $18 tariff to New York. The NYC was going to join the tariff. "Now," the GTW man said to me, "we realize that if the NYC also gives you an $18 rate, you will likely go New York Central. But the Grand Trunk wants you to know that we want to take you."

Monday afternoon, at band practice, the same high-and-mighty NYC passenger agent visited us. "Boys," he said, "we didn't realize that you took this so seriously. We're sorry, and we want to make amends. We're going to give you a special $18 round-trip rate to New York City for next weekend. If you tell us which train you want to go on, we'll have a couple of extra cars for you." We thanked him, and said we would let him know.

Then we had a meeting. We decided that since the Grand Trunk was good enough to give us the special rate in the first place, we'd go via the Grand Trunk.

I went to see the GTW agent, and told him of our decision.

"That's what we've been waiting for," he said. "We're going to show you boys that the New York Central isn't the only railroad in South Bend. We're not going to put two coaches on the Maple Leaf for you; we're going to run a special train, and limit you to 20 passengers per coach, so you'll all have a four-seater. And the train crews will show you how to take the backs and cushions off, so you can make bunks out of them. We'll put a Pullman on, at regular fares, for anyone who wants to travel Pullman. We'll have specially low-priced meals in the diner, so you can stay within your budget: 25 cents for breakfast, 35 cents for lunch, and 50 cents for dinner, with special printed commemorative menus. We'll have a passenger agent go all the way with you, and he will meet you after the game to decide what time you wish to return.

"And," he added, "to show you that we can do anything the New York Central can, we'll match the running time of any New York Central train you wish, from the 20th Century Limited on down, even though we'll have to go 50 miles farther to get there."

We selected a 1 p.m. departure on Friday; on the next track, the NYC's Fifth Avenue Special was loading for its 12:50 p.m. departure to New York City. Some students not in the band were taking the Fifth Avenue. They laughed at us. "You'll get lost in Canada somewhere. We'll tell you how the game came out."

We beat them to New York City by 2 hours.

We left South Bend behind a Pacific type locomotive with a sealed baggage car containing our instruments, five or six coaches for the 100-member band, a diner, and a Pullman. Aboard the train were a passenger agent and the district trainmaster. Helping the engineer (a favorite way of putting it among engineers in those days) were the traveling engineer and the traveling fireman. During one 5-mile stretch, we timed the train by the mileposts and the brakeman's watch: 200 seconds for the 5 miles, or 90 mph. We made the 234 miles from South Bend to Port Huron, Mich., in 233 minutes, despite changing engines at Battle Creek, Mich., and taking water twice. We passed the Maple Leaf in a siding somewhere in Michigan.

GTW parent Canadian National took us across Ontario to Suspension Bridge, N.Y. CN didn't set any speed records, apparently not having expected us so soon. But at Suspension Bridge, a real rhubarb arose. The GTW diner had been taken off, I suppose at Port Huron. Now a Lehigh Valley diner was to be put on the rear of our train; Lehigh Valley was CN's connection for New York-area through service. The LV diner was over in the United States, while the rear of our train was still on the Canadian side of the bridge. Railroads paid a fee each time they used this bridge. Whose switcher was going to incur the wheel charge in order to put the diner on our train? Not the Lehigh's; and, just as positively, not the CN's.

Men from the two roads stood there arguing, and perhaps would be still be holding the train, except that the GTW passenger agent announced, "It's our train. We'll do the switching, and I'll take the responsibility." So the CN switcher ran over to the New York side, got the diner, brought it back, and tacked it onto the rear, and away we went.

We made the run from Suspension Bridge to Penn Station (LV's New York terminal, shared with PRR) in 8 hours flat. When we stopped on a curve in Mauch Chunk (now Jim Thorpe), Pa., the track was so superelevated that the dishes started to slide off the tables in the diner. Some years later, I told a Lehigh Valley conductor that we had made the run in 8 hours, and he flatly refused to believe me. But I was there.

Unfortunately, the football game was a tie.

Saturday afternoon, as promised, the GTW man met with us, and we decided on a 3 p.m. Sunday departure from Penn Station. As our train started climbing the hills of New York State, it got very cold. The first three cars were warm, but the rest of the train had no heat. The conductor repeatedly signaled the engineer for more steam in the heating line. At every stop there were acrimonious exchanges between the conductor and the engineer. The engineer insisted that he was sending back so much steam that any more would burst the fittings. Yet the train, after the third car, was so cold that the water in the Pullman was beginning to freeze.

When we stopped at London, Ontario, the car-knockers found what was wrong. The GTW coaches had an unusual arrangement for the steam line shutoff valves: the handles were located in the vestibules of the cars. One of the band members had wondered what those handles were for, and he'd turned one of them, on the leading platform of the fourth car. The LV crew was not familiar with the GTW valve arrangement, and they never thought to check the position of the handles.

Some more excitement during the evening came with the emergency stop out in the middle of nowhere. The conductor went forward to ask the engineer the reason for the stop. The engineer asked why he had been flagged down with a red lantern from the rear end. Again, it was a band member, who had picked up the flagman's red lantern on the rear platform, and waved the lantern from the side door to see what would happen.

Finally, early in the morning, we stopped at either Sarnia or Port Huron, where a lady from the depot's restaurant came out onto the platform ringing a hand bell, calling all train passengers to breakfast inside.

One of the boys picked up the hand bell, put it under his coat, and took it back to South Bend. Two days later, a half-hour before the 6 a.m. gong that woke all of us in Sorin Hall each morning, this wretched band member ran through the corridors, ringing that hand bell. That afternoon, Father Farley, the rector, summoned all the residents of the dormitory to a meeting. Father Farley told us--in the straightforward manner for which he was noted--that he would leave his office for 15 minutes. If that bell was not on his desk when he returned, no resident of Sorin Hall would be allowed to leave the campus until he graduated--if he graduated.

The bell was there when he returned, and the school returned it to the restaurant, with apologies.

From 1935 until 1942, when World War II ended such trips, the Notre Dame band went each year to New York City for the Army game, via the Grand Trunk Western and Lehigh Valley, for $18 round trip, each.

In 1956, when I returned to Notre Dame for my 20th reunion, I was talking with GTW's passenger agent in South Bend. He asked, "Do you know what you boys did with that trip? You broke the monopoly of the New York Central here. Ever since that trip, we have been able to give group rates to students, and they've gone along with us."

And that's the story of how a few college boys brought the mighty New York Central to its knees.

A few years after graduation, I was in Chicago, and visited the GTW-CN office on Michigan Avenue. I asked how, since the regular fare was $64 round trip, could the GTW afford to give us the $18 fare. I was told that the $18 covered only the wages and fuel. "We didn't charge anything for maintenance or other charges; but we figured we neither made nor lost anything on the train. And we figured it was a good opportunity to show 100 Notre Dame boys that we had a first-class railroad. We figured that perhaps at some time in the future, one of you might have a car of freight to route, and you might send it our way."

As it happens, I was employed for several years at Continental Can Company's New York office, and I had to route many shipments of machinery from suppliers in the East to our plants in the Midwest and West. Whenever it was feasible, I short-hauled the poor Erie at Buffalo, and routed the shipment via CN-GTW to Chicago or (by GTW carferry) to Milwaukee. For a while, I kept a list of the cars that I sent via GTW, it was up to 85 cars when I stopped keeping track. I don't know whether any other Notre Dame band members were ever in a position to route a car, but I think I paid GTW back for the 1935 train!

http://memory.loc.gov/service/pnp/cph/3c10000/3c16000/3c16300/3c16349v.jpg 

My favorite time of yr, hands down. Sept-Jan is what I live for all yr long. The BNSF/Amtrak route across Oklahoma runs just to the east of Gaylord Memorial stadium in Norman which is the home of the OU Sooners. The talk in college football this wk is Sooner qb Sam Bradford going down w/ a throwing shoulder injury in their loss to BYU on Sat. Needless to say this is not good and runied my wknd and perhaps the whole season.

WIAR

GO BLUE!  (I sure hope we win more than 3 games this year)

OK - how about a review of our favorite college football teams and the railroads that served them (when they travelled by train)?

Even though I never attended school there (not that I didn't want to), I've been a Wolverine my whole life.  I know Michigan had and still has the Ann Arbor Railroad going through their campus and they likely used it as a connection to start their road trips.

Anyone else? 

Keep dreaming with your Blue team!!! I think Michigan is not going no where. We are ready for the Longhorn this year!!!!!!

   My Dad tells the story that while growing up in Eagle Grove Iowa in the late 30s. He and a buddy of his went from Eagle Grove to Ames on the Des Moines passenger trian, Took 14 from Ames to Cedar Rapids. and then took the Crandic from Cedar Rapids to Iowa City to see the Hawkeyes play. After the game on the Iowa City to Cedar Rapids the Crandic hit a cow at about 60mph in a interburan car. I asked what happened next , he said they just kept going , they had to meet the connection at Cedar Rapids. This was in 1939, could you imagaine doing that today Larry 

cnwfan51

After the game on the Iowa City to Cedar Rapids the Crandic hit a cow at about 60mph in a interburan car. I asked what happened next , he said they just kept going , they had to meet the connection at Cedar Rapids. This was in 1939, could you imagaine doing that today

I can't imagine running 60 MPH on the CR-to-IC CRANDIC line...

That's why they were called, "The Vomit Comets".  Diane over at Box-Kar Hobbies told me that name.

"Swing and sway the Crandic way!"

Jeff

 Vomit Comet....Was'nt that the last run of the night from a bar and dance Hall in Swisher?