General Discussion (Classic Trains)

What were TurboTrain's greatest weaknesses that made it so unsuccessful in the U.S. and Canada?

lattasnip9:

What were TurboTrain's greatest weaknesses that made it so unsuccessful in the U.S. and Canada?

Lots of teething problems since virtually every aspect of the train was new technology for the railroads meant that there was no rush to order more.  By the time these were sorted out, a bad taste remained.  Some of the design team was not from the rail industry and may not have appreciated some of the fundamental differences between operating on the ground and in the air.

But ultimately the biggest problem was that the few that were built (and survived) remained oddballs in an otherwise fairly standardized industry, needing a specialized stock of parts and technical support.

John

I frequently rode the Turbo between Boston and New York.  I liked it because I could board early and sit behind the engineer in the forward "pod".   Heavy maintenance requirements, and very rough riding at about 35mph, expecially over switches, were its main drawbacks.   Today, very excessive fuel consumption and pollution would also be considered drawbacks.   At times, I opted for overnight on the Owl or a really good meal on the Merchants Limited.

After the initail teething problems were resolved, Canadian National discovered that there were additional problems caused by cold weather.  This lead them, in 1971, to embark on a rebuilding programme, and they didn't return to service until 1973.  After that, they remained in service until late 1982, with, according to CN and VIA, an availability rate of over 97%.  Too bad that they were, in my opinion, so unattractive, though. 

Wayne

I rode the CN Turbos many times and quite honestly enjoyed every trip. I learned very early that eastbound to Montreal from Toronto the Turbo Club end of the train was where the engineer sat with only a Plexiglas partition separating him from the lounge in the Turbo Club Dome. They were clean quiet comfortable and the fastest train operating in the corridor at that time. I never traveled Turbo coach so cannot comment on that means of travel. CARA was the caterer for the CN Turbos and served up some pretty good food to Turboclub patrons. I was sorry to hear when they were discontinued. Yes they had some early teething problems and the fine winter snow of Ontario played havoc with the turbine blades for awhile but these problems were all corrected. On one occasion I found a FPA4 on the head end when leaving from Toronto and that old MLW was able to maintain the schedule to Montreal I later found out that one Turbine was operating providing hotel power and the MLW supplied all of the motive power.

Al - in - Stockton 

In the NY - Boston service, the only food was from a cafe section and the offerings were what Amtrak provided in its regular cafe cars, but perhaps a bit more limited, and no better nor worse quality.  However, except at 35 mph and over specialwork, the ride was confortable and quiet. Only coach class was offered, but there may have been a premium fare, similar to Metroliner.   I usually sat behind the engineer behind the glass or plexiglass partition.   Everytime I planned a trip on the Turbo, I rode what I planned to ride, and never once was there a need for the Turbo to be pulled by a regular locomotive.  And on-tme performance was normal, but speed limits were definitely exceeded.   I remember riding a steady 110 mph on the digital speedometer btween Portchester and Rye going westbound on the eastbound express track.

But I understand that each unit arriving in Boston in the evening (meaning each unit every other day) would backtrack to Providence, where United Aircraft had a maintenance shop, and each train got what about to a thorough overhaul every other day!

On my weekly trips I still opted for a  roomette on the Owl or a good meal on the Merchants on occasion.   And rode parlor once or twice on the Merchants.  And very occasionally on the Patriot from Penn Station.   And once I missed the Merchants at Grand Central, but instead of going to Penn for the Patrtiot, rode the Bankers (Springfield train) to New Haven and crossed the platform to the Patiort there.  And horrors, I even occasionally did fly Northeast Airlines Vicounts, but not very often. Eastern Shuttle?   DC-6's were far too noisy for my ears.   Bus?  Once during a RR srike, Greyhound.

Apologies.  I got my time frames mixed up.   I regularly traveled between NY and Boston through the years 1949 - 1996, with less frequent travel 1954-1956 and 1968-1969, but even when living at Fort Bragg, NC and in Illinois, I still used the service.   But my use of roometts on the Owl, the great meals on the Merchants, and use of the Patiort as a connecting train for the Bankers from GCT all occured in the pre-PC days, while most Tubo riding was done with PC and Amtrak.