General Discussion (Model Railroader)

I have a question on train ferry's and doc alignment . When the ferry pulls in to line up with the land based rail system how do they get the boat first to line up with the rails from side to side and then up and down. I would assume that water levels change and up and down elevations would be difficult. Then once they start unloading how do they keep the boat from dipping to one side and not dumping the cars over board or tilting to the rear and running into the drink ? I can imagine with newer systems there is probably a ballast system on board to compensate for this. But in the old days how was this accomlpished ?????  

Good question, Jerry.  One remedy to the problem could be a lock (like those found on the Panama or Erie canals) that would allow you to pump water in or out of it in order to offset any vertical discrepancies. 

Historically, canals and locks came before the RRs.  So these could have easily been constructed to address the problem - especially in ports where tidal fluctuations were a daily issue.

Tom

On the dock there is a horizontal gate, or apron, which is hinged at the dockside so the other end which is temporarily attached to the ship can rise and fall with it.  Care had to be taken to balance the load when loading and unloading, but the apron had some flexibility.

Mark

 Walthers HO carfloat apron:

" To move freight cars between land and carfloats, railroads and some private industries constructed Carfloat Aprons. These structures consist of a moving apron (similar to a bridge) that can be locked with the float. This keeps the tracks aligned during switching and allows the float and the apron to move up and down with the tides. Counterweights and lifting machinery are housed in the towers at the end of the apron. " 

http://www.walthers.com/exec/productinfo/933-3068

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/db/Washington_State_Ferry_6428.JPG&imgrefurl=http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Washington_State_Ferry_6428.JPG&usg=__ipeH-H8TleSt8NPj67RPZZ0Q2e4=&h=2848&w=4272&sz=5992&hl=en&start=2&um=1&tbnid=0c3bvxK29NrtDM:&tbnh=100&tbnw=150&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dwashington%2Bstate%2Bferry%2Bdocks%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official%26sa%3DN%26um%3D1

The above picture is of the Washington State Ferry pier in Edmonds, Wa. Those pilings that are out in the water jute out in the shape of a V from the apron. They are constructed in such a manner so that the ferry will fit snuggly inside. Being a constant rider of WSF it's always fun when the ferry hits these pilings because they are sprung, and act as a bumper and you can feel the ferry bump around as it settles into place.

The image from Jason's posted URL above...

Here is a picture of the model of railroad ferry Solano which operated between Port Costa and Benicia on SP's Oakland to Sacramento line.  She was the largest of her type until her younger sister Contra Costa was built to handle increased traffic.  They were superseded by Suisun Bay Bridge.

I took the picture at the Benicia Public Library where it was displayed as part of a tour of its builders. 

Mark

ndbprr:

One other important factor is proper loading and unloading.  Engines are rarely allowed onto ferries or barges due to their weight.  Cars are loaded or unloaded from both side (not ends) so that the vessel keeps as even and level as is possible and doesn't tip over.

SP ferries Solano and Contra Costa had four tracks.  They were big enough to carry about 24 passenger cars and two locomotives, or 36 freight cars and two locomotives.  One locomotive would be the train's road engine and the other a switcher to help put the train together in unloading.  Each ship had a restaurant and bar.  Since the actual ferry voyage was very short, I wonder if railroad passengers made use of these facilities while the trains were being disassembled and assembled.

A photo on page 119 of Signor's book Southern Pacific's Western Division shows that the apron's movement could be sufficient to create a substantial vertical kink in the tracks where the apron joins the dock.  The book contains several photos of the ferries and docks, as well as a track diagram of Port Costa showing the twin ferry slips.  Each ferry had its own slip.  Similarly, there were two slips at Benicia.

Signor wrote "Both ferry landings were diagonally positioned to take advantage of the swifly running current of the (Carquinez) strait with incoming or outgoing tide, where a more direct water route across the channel would have entailed a perpetual fight with cross current."  The route took advantage of the slight "S" curve in the strait.  (Pun intended.)

Mark

Some years ago I worked some operating sessions on a two level model railroad.  One level was the Green Bay and Western and the other was the Ann Arbor.  The owner had built models of the Ann Arbor's ferries on wheeled carts that could raise and lower and the ferries were the only path between railroads.

Working the ferry was done with idler flat cars between ferry loads and loco to keep the locos off the approach aprons and the rules were one car at a time, alternating sides, as I recall.  Once both boats were loaded they "sailed" to the opposite dock. 

After the op sessions we'd have a slide show from host's fairly large collection he had taken over the years.  One slide from maybe the late 70's of the Ann Arbor ferry in Elberta showed a boxcar being shoved on the outside ferry track.  The ferry was listing about 20 degrees and the apron had a twist in it like it was made of cardboard.  But the crewmen are just standing there like this is normal.  I'd have been ready to abandon ship!

George V.

Where there were extremely large changes in water level, two methods were employed:

1. The float (or ferry) would only be loaded/unloaded when the tide was within a certain range of depths - usually about four hours out of twelve.  At other times the vertical angle between the apron and the deck would be too large.
2. The apron would be built on an inclined railway, and would ride up and down the incline as the water level changed.  This method was used on the lower Mississippi River - the level changes were seasonal, not tidal.

As for balance, anyone who has loaded several people into a rowboat knows the basic principles.  Insofar as possible, the weights are balanced both fore and aft and side to side.  While loading or unloading, you DON"T fill the outer track on one side and leave the other side empty.  Likewise, you don't put a string of loaded ore cars on one side and a string of empty flat cars on the other.

Anyone who works around a seaport learns these things automatically.  Problems can arise when a new head from the prairies works an apron yard for the first time.

Chuck (Long ago Merchant Marine cadet modeling Central Japan in September, 1964)

yougottawanta:

I have a question on train ferry's and doc alignment . When the ferry pulls in to line up with the land based rail system how do they get the boat first to line up with the rails from side to side and then up and down. I would assume that water levels change and up and down elevations would be difficult. Then once they start unloading how do they keep the boat from dipping to one side and not dumping the cars over board or tilting to the rear and running into the drink ? I can imagine with newer systems there is probably a ballast system on board to compensate for this. But in the old days how was this accomlpished ?????  

It really isn a simple operation even though the process may sound complicated. The ferry comes into the dock and is guided by piers on either side of the boat. it is then pushed by its engine (if powered) or by a tug boat untill it is *** close to the position in which the boat is desired to be. Ropes are sent across that will enable the crews on the docks and on the boat to align the tracks on the ferry with those on the apron. Then a connection is made between the ferry and the apron that will keep the to boat in the desired alignment. This connection usually in the form of square thick timbers that fit into a recepticle much like on of the sliding bolts that some people use to lock doors. That takes of side to side motions.

Up and down motions are handled one of two ways. One end of the apron either floats on the water at the same height as docking end of the boat or it is operated by a lifting device run by an operator that raises and lowers the apron as needed. Both types are in use and the kind that will be used depends on factors such as tides, the length of the boat and/or apron and the kind of facility the apron is designed to serve.

Irv

Are you modeling the Great Lakes? There are no tides to mess with. Also, it is very easy to find the remains of these old ferry docks, since most on Lake Michigan were operated till the 80's by Ann Arbor. So if you're ever on the west side of Michigan, stop by Frankfort, i doubt Ludington's are still there, mayber Elberta, or head north to St. Ignace and Mackinac City.

Very interesting places to spend a couple of hours at.

Kennewaw, WI