General Discussion (Model Railroader)

Hello,

besides North American and European railroads I´m also very interested in South American railroads. My most favorite South American trains are those metre gauge trains from Bolivia and northwestern Argentine. Those bolivian/argentinian metre gauge trains look quite big, so that I see no problem why there shouldn´t be some available in HO scale, although it´s not the proper scale for them. I´m especially interested in those 2-10-2 type steam locomotives that used to pull both international passenger and freight trains over the Andinian mountains in Bolivia (National Railways of Bolivia) and northwestern Argentine (General Belgrano Railway). Here is a picture of such a loco, pulling the famous international "El Panamericano" (Pan American Express) long distance passenger train from Buenos Aires to La Paz, on it´s 1633 mile journey between the 2 capitals:

I would love to have such a 2-10-2, but I know that there are not existent in HO scale.Therefore I´m trying to find any good unlettered HO 2-10-2 type (doesn´t have to be similar to the original) to use it as my "South American" engine. But the problem is that I exactly know what I want, so things are difficult for me to find the right thing. I already saw those 2-10-2 models by Mehano/IHC and Proto 2000/Bachmann, but they don´t satisfy me. The Mehano 2-10-2 is a weak puller of what I´ve heard, and the Bachmann 2-10-2 cannot be euipped with a smoke unit. Both things that are very important to me.

Here is a list of things that the 2-10-2 I´m searching needs to have:

1. Loco & tender may be plastic or metal

2. Tender may have 4-wheel or 6-wheel trucks, but no tender cab (like some Bachmann 2-10-2´s)

3. Loco should have DCC or at least be DCC prepared

4. Loco should have a strong powerful motor (in the best case a 5 pole motor)

5. If the loco is built out of plastic it should be equipped with at least one set of flywheels

6. Loco should have the possibility of installing a smoke unit that can be turned on/off with DCC

7. Loco should still negotiate a 18" radius

8. Loco should have an operating headlight that can be turned on/off with DCC

Can anyone help me?

Daniel

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ned=us&q=ho+scale+2-10-2&btnmeta%3Dsearch%3Dsearch=Search+the+Web

I doubt this would look good on a 18 inch radius. I know you have to suspend disbelief in model railroading but this is really pushing the limits.

Rich

Looks like you're looking at a kitbash if you want the loco to be anything close to the prototype. The only other 2-10-2 I'm aware of is the old AHM/Rivarossi B&O Big Six, which looks nothing like this. You need a Belpaire firebox, for starters. Unless there's something on the foreign market that's closer, I think you'll have to build it.

Daniel: 

That's a really intriguing looking locomotive, but I agree, if you're going to get an approximation of it, you're going to have to kitbash or scratchbuild it.  Possibly a Spectrum "Russian" 2-10--0 might be a starting point, but you'll still need to mould a Belpaire firebox and look for a USRA or Hodges trailing truck.  The domes on the Spectrum look close.   This is a really small 2-10-2, and it looks smaller than even the 'light' USRA's. 

Frankly, it looks like a real project to me, but if you like that loco, it's a project worth looking into. 

Is it possible for you to find out who built the loco originally?  That might help.  South American railroads obtained a lot of their steam from both British and German manufacturers, but Baldwin in the United States also built quite a few locos for their railways.  You might want to research this and see if it's possible to obtain some construction drawings.  If you can do this, it might also help you figure out a starting point in available HO steamers on the market.  

Tom

Are you going to have your South American Loco enter a tunnel, pass under a river and 12 foot security fence and then appear on the other side outside of El Paso Texas? 

Here I have some more pictures of those locos for you. In the first 2 pictures you see argentinian 2-10-2´s, in the last 2 pictures you see bolivian 2-10-2´s. I don´t need a belpaire firebox necessarily, since the bolivian 2-10-2´s didn´t have them. As for the argentinian 2-10-2´s, I don´t know anything about, but I know something about the bolivian engines. Baldwin built 2 classes of 2-10-2´s for Bolivia. The first class (depicted in the third picture) arrived in 1942-1943 with 22 x 26 inch cylinders and 51 inch drivers. The second class (depicted in the fourth picture) arrived in 1946 with 22 x 24 inch cylinders and 48 inch drivers. I think that both bolivian and argentinian engines look quite similar. The main diffrence is that the bolivian had no belpaire firebox and 4-wheel-truck tenders, while the argentinian had a belpaire firebox and mostly had 6-wheel-truck tenders. Both were fired with oil, since there was hardly any wood or coal in those enormous heights (the trains operated up to over 14.000 feet above sea level!).

Here I have some more pictures of big bolivian metre gauge steam locos for those of you who are interested. While the 2-10-2´s were built by Baldwin, the 2 classes of bolivian 4-8-4´s were built by 2 other bulders. These 4-8-4´s represented some of the biggest steam locomotives in metre gauge and in South America. Both bolivian 4-8-4 classes were sold to Bolivia from the brazilian railway company Noroeste do Brazil (Northwestern of Brazil). The first 4-8-4´s were bulit by german builder Borsig in 1935 and had 4-wheel-truck tenders, and the second 4-8-4´s were built by Alco in 1946 and had larger 6-wheel-truck tenders. Both classes of 4-8-4´s were sold from Brazil to Bolivia in the mid 50ies, where they have been in service until around 1980. The first 2 pictures show the Borsig 4-8-4´s and the last 2 pictures the  Alco 4-8-4´s. They would be some nice models in HO sale too, what do you think?

There is a rivarossi 2-10-2 on ebay that ends soon. 

 Are you kidding?

I would never ever buy that old Rivarossi crap. But I must admit that the boiler looks ok for a bolivian engine...especially with the headlight up high.

Daniel

Well I'm unclear what you're looking for. Are you looking for an HO standard gauge 2-10-2 that kinda looks like a South American meter-gauge 2-10-2 to use as an HO standard gauge engine, or are you looking for an HO 2-10-2 that you can kitbash into say an O scale meter gauge / narrow gauge engine??

It's not unusual for modellers in On3 or On30 to kitbash HO standard gauge engines. I beleive there's a company that makes a replacement cab and other details parts for converting a Mantua 2-6-6-2 to an O narrow gauge engine.

Anyway, Spectrum makes a USRA light 2-10-2 available with DCC and sound. The headlight is a separate part so it can be replaced or moved to an upper position. The "cab" (I asuume you mean the head brakeman's doghouse) is a separate piece which can be removed. Spectrum only adds them to models where the prototype used them.

Proto 2000 makes a similar HO engine:

IHC makes a generic 2-10-2...I'd avoid the ones with the deformed vanderbilt tenders though. Also, it's not available undecorated.

Finally, BLI makes a UP 2-10-2:

Otherwise, Spectrum makes an N scale 2-10-2...I guess you could try converting that into an HOn3 engine or something similar??

p.s. the engine in the original post does remind me a little of an East Broad Top 2-8-2: