Layouts and layout building

I am trying to reprogram my 2 engines one is a Atheron Amtrak AMD103 with a Digitrax DH163 decoder which I installed.  The other is a Bachman SD45 that was DCC Decoder installed.    I tried following the instructions, however after I input the address and then hit the Enter button on the 400 throttle, I see a "No-d" or similiar appear and I can't go to the next step of enable ing the 4 digit address as specified in the instructions.  I even tried to just change the 2 digit address and something similiar happens.  What and I doing wrong with my Digitrax Super chief system?

 Thanks

Ryan

What mode are you in with the DT400 during prog? Also do you see the AD=?? for two digit entry? Or the AD=???? For the 4 digit entry?

After a 4 digit entry, it should display a dialog related to enabling 4 digit addressing, hit YES and move on.

If you make a successful entry and it is accepted by the decoder it should display "GOOD" on your DT400. Anything else means either it has been refused or the decoder has a problem responding which is a whole different can of worms.

It might be a couple of things, as Safety has alluded.  I use Paged Mode, but only on an isolated section of track so that I don't get 10 locos with the same address.....ooops.  Anyway, my method is to do the address change in Paged Mode, and when you enter the address with a DT 400 and the DB 150 combo SEB from Digitrax, there is an immediate beep and the track power is cut.  I have to manually restore track power using the DT400 "power" and "y".  For any extended addresses, I then enter Ops Mode and change CV 29 to 38, which enables the decoder to use the new extended address.  It is at this step, and clicking the endcoder with that address dialed in, that my QSI decoders come to life.  Perhaps for yours, too.

It's telling you "No decoder".  That means it can't electrically "see" the decoder to program it. 

The first two things to check are:

Do you have the loco on an isolated section of track connected to the programming terminals on the Super Chief, and;

Are the programming track and the loco wheels clean so they make good contact?

HTH,
Steve 

 

Or even a decoder is physically present inside the engine?

I will give this a try tonight on an isolated piece of track with Programming terminals.   I didn't hook up the Programing Terminals because I thought those were if you want a dedicated programming section only, but it sounds like that may might be my screw up.....  Right now this is the only engine on the track and let you all know what happens.   They run perfectlly when selected to address 3 as expected, but they just love that number too much...

thanks for the suggestions, more to follow...

With that added tidbit about Address 03, we know it has a decoder, and I'm pretty sure the issue is with the mode you're using, or perhaps with the terminals.  There is confusion out there about the terminals.  I had a soundtraxx tech tell me to program my 100LC using the middle terminals on my DB 150 a couple of years back when I had a reset problem.  I didn't listen to him, thank God, and corrected the problem myself.  Point being, you should not have to move wires at all to program a decoder.  Just use the right mode, and then enable the address if it is an extended one.  I had problems getting the "Y" prompt to actuall do the address enabling, so I reverted to Ops mode and changing the CV29 to 38 that way.  Success every single time.

Selector,

is CV 29=38 the key to 4 digit addressing? If I put the value of 38 into this CV 29 I should not get any more prompts or have any problem issuing 4 digit addressing?

The program track is the key, I would hate to re-format a entire roundhouse full of DCC engines.

Safety, it is the key for the QSI decoders, and I would think it is probably the same for many others.  (Where are the experts here?)  Anyway, what does a fella have to lose if he can't achieve his goal of getting a loco to function at his bidding otherwise? 

For the Digitrax SEB, the instructions with the DT400 throttle supplied say to go through a certain procedure, but as you know, some decoders are more progamme-friendly than others on the main.  The DB 150/DT 400 combo comprising the Super Empire Builder works this way-  the loco should be on a seperately powered section where the programming commands can get to that section only...no other.  For me, that means flipping a SPDT to cut power to the rest of the layout, entering programming mode, in Paged, and then going through the motions to alter the address.  When the DT 400 asks me if I want to engage the new extended address by pressing "Y", as the manual says it will, I have not been happy with the outcomes.  So, I hit enter at that point, whereupon the DB 150 cuts track power completely with a beep.  I restore track power using the DT 400 buttons, re-enter programming, but thumb through to Ops Mode, and then change the CV29 to a value of 38.  In the case of the QSI decoders, they keep their backs turned to you until you actually dial in their new names, and click the encoder knob.  When you engage the decoder that way, they will start up their sounds and respond to your bidding.

BTW, CV29 set to 38 means properly oriented lighting control dependent on locomotive's directon of movement, among other things.  But it also activates the long addresses.

-Crandell

Looks like I had some success last night, I tried just moving the main bus wires over to the Prog A and B terminals and recieved a No Pwr on the DT 400 Terminal.  The point to which the feeder wired is connected to the track to where the engine was sitting is approx 25 feet away since I am still putting in track feeder wires.    After that I grabbed a short piece of flex track and soldered 2 wires up to it and moved the bus wires back to Rail A and B on the DCS 100 and connected the short flex track up to the Prog A & B terminals.  Things then worked like a champ. 

One follow up question, do the decoders see a differance between the address of 0004 and 04 or do they just consider them 04?

Thanks for everybodys help...

REG

On some systems, 04 is a short address and 0004 is a long address, but on Digitrax systems, adresses 1-127 are all short addresses(you can't even enter 0004, at least on the Zephyr's console if you try to enter 0004, it shows up as 04) and 128-9983 are long addresses. If you have an engine that is programmed with a long address of 0004, you would have to reprogram the address to run it on Digitrax.

I usually program addresses on the programming track, but if you get into adjusting other CV's such as momentum, you'll probably want to do them on the main with Ops mode programming so that you won't have to move your engines back and force between the program track and the main to test different values.

 

Robert, same for me....programming track is strictly to get the decoder to its new name, and then the loco is placed out with the rest of the unwashed so that I can get it up to speed, break-in, and configure the decoder CV's.  Inertia, master volume, momentum, and so on, can be done in Ops mode on the main because the system will only be addressing the instructions to the new address.  Other decoders will ignore the commands.

You don't have to dedicate a piece of track off the layout for programming. 

I isolated a siding with insulated rail joiners and used a DPDT switch to change it's function.

In one switched position, the siding operates with the rest of the layout.  In the other switched position, it's my programming track. 

This works well and it's invisible.

Mike, even an SPDT, which I use, is fine.  You simply run the command centre's ouputs to the SPDT,but the same terminals would also have the feeders to the programming section that is isolated.  The other set of terminals supplies power to the rest of the layout.  When you flip the toggle to the SPDT, the layout power will be cut off, but the power and signal are still getting to the gapped programming track because the switch and the track get power from the same set of posts.

What selector is doing will work with the Empire Builder, but not the Chief or Zephyr. The Chief and Zephyr have seperate programming outputs, and when you use page programming, the programming commands are sent to the programming outputs and not the main track outputs. The way Mike has his programming track setup, he has one set of poles from the switch going to the main track outputs, and the other poles going to the programming outputs. I don't recommend to people that they do that because I have heard that if you accidentally run an engine into the track while it is set for programming, as the engine crosses the insulated gap and shorts the track outputs to the programming outputs, it could damage the command station. I have never heard of it actually happening, so it may not be a concern, but I figure better safe than sorry. Using a 4PDT switch, you can wire in a section of track between the programming track and the rest of the layout that is dead when you switch the track to programming to guard against this.